Limited Major dying?

[MHicks]

3 hours ago, MadBomber said:

As far as eyes going and not being able to run irons, just have a set of "MAGIC" glasses made by your optometrist.

 

Have the dominate lens set for the sweet spot to be about 6 inches past your out stretched hand.  Have the other lens set for normal distance.  NO BIFOCALS!  

 

Magic glasses work.  Been there, doing that.

 

Did exactly that years ago and it has worked great for me. I did recently get a pair set up with my regular distance prescription because it's  much better for me using an optic. 

[sandflea316]

On 9/1/2023 at 1:39 AM, Sandbagger123 said:

slap a dot on a limited major gun,  load some 40 minor and you have a LO gun.  that is what i am going to do for next season 

I have a tanfo limited pro in 9mm that I converted to LO.

I also bought a .40 top end and will mill it for optics.  Going to load minor .40 to see which one shoots better.

 

[shred]

On 9/1/2023 at 10:10 PM, RJH said:

 

 

Where have you found 9 mm for 10 bucks for 50 rounds? The best I've found is $12 for 50 rounds, plus shipping which ends up being around 25 or 26 cents a round

2A warehouse has 9mm reman under 20c each, curbside pickup in Houston.  Might be a bit of a drive, but there's lots of small ammo companies out there.

 

I like the monovision glasses, although after getting a set at front-sight distance (brought my 1911s in to the opto and all), I had them push the focus distance dominant eye out a couple clicks to make downrange a bit clearer without losing much front sight clarity.

 

[zzt]

On 9/2/2023 at 5:33 PM, MadBomber said:

As far as eyes going and not being able to run irons, just have a set of "MAGIC" glasses made by your optometrist.

 

Have the dominate lens set for the sweet spot to be about 6 inches past your out stretched hand.  Have the other lens set for normal distance.  NO BIFOCALS!  

 

Magic glasses work.  Been there, doing that.

 

And you lose depth perception.  On top of that, you get an eyeache.

[shred]

I got plenty of depth perception and that setup worked well enough for me to top 20 Nationals, win an Area mach and an IPSC Pan American championship. 

 

Ymmv. 

[RJH]

Revisiting this topic. Even though limited major is definitely dying, pretty sure I'm shooting it at the next match I'm going to go to. I'm a big proponent of limited optics, because I think it's where the . org needs to go, but I think I'll always like limited major and single stack major the best

[Bigzona]

Started in CO, moved to Open, bought a Limited gun last year, finally shot it for a couple of months after Area 4 this year to learn irons. The division is dying, but I hope it doesn't go anywhere. I learned a ton shooting 40 and irons. Before going back to Open, I shot a handful of matches in LO to quickly get classified. Made M. 9minor feels like a .22 after shooting Limited Major, and the dot made for easy visual processing compared to irons at speed. Made LO feel easy.

 

In summary, I think newer competitors that are getting serious can benefit from learning to run irons at speed. The exercise does require humility and patience, both of which aren't abundant for most.

[twodownzero]

Everything that isn't a rifle or minor high cap optics is already dead.

[MHicks]

2 hours ago, zzt said:

 

And you lose depth perception.  On top of that, you get an eyeache.

 

Have you tried glasses set up like this? Your brain easily adjusts, for most people at least.

[Inkman]

31 minutes ago, twodownzero said:

Everything that isn't a rifle or minor high cap optics is already dead.

 

 

This.

[zzt]

50 minutes ago, MHicks said:

 

Have you tried glasses set up like this? Your brain easily adjusts, for most people at least.

 

I have.  Absolutely didn't work.  The closest I came was buying a stick-on Diopter and using it upside down at the top of the lens.  Dip head to see front sight.  Since the bottom of the lens was clear I could see to run.

 

Maybe it didn't work for me because I don't have a dominant eye.

Edited September 6, 2023 by zzt

[MHicks]

1 hour ago, zzt said:

 

I have.  Absolutely didn't work.  The closest I came was buying a stick-on Diopter and using it upside down at the top of the lens.  Dip head to see front sight.  Since the bottom of the lens was clear I could see to run.

 

Maybe it didn't work for me because I don't have a dominant eye.

 

That's what I tried at first. The stick on magnifier. Tried a couple to find the right strength. It worked fine just standing in one spot shooting a target but moving or leaning around a barrier it didn't.  The full lense worked great when i got those glasses made.

[pjb45]

As I am now a member to the newest category of senior citizens I have some observations.

I shoot at Rio with others in my age category.  Almost all of us have switched to 9mm for the majority of our matches.

The ease and convenience easily overcomes the disadvantage in scoring.

We just don't care!  We are out to have fun.

[waynes_world_45]

On 9/2/2023 at 5:33 PM, MadBomber said:

As far as eyes going and not being able to run irons, just have a set of "MAGIC" glasses made by your optometrist.

 

Have the dominate lens set for the sweet spot to be about 6 inches past your out stretched hand.  Have the other lens set for normal distance.  NO BIFOCALS!  

 

Magic glasses work.  Been there, doing that.

Tried That. It gave me a headache. 

[cheby]

On 9/6/2023 at 1:41 PM, zzt said:

 

And you lose depth perception.  On top of that, you get an eyeache.

It does work; however, it takes some time to get used to. It took several months in my case. I was extremely skeptical about this idea for a long time. I revisited it for real after shooting a dot for a while. I think the dot helped me to improve my target focused shooting and that helped me with my iron sights while using the glasses with different prescription on each lens. 

[Midwest3Gunner]

So I shot my first match since Oct '21 this past weekend. I promoted at work in March '22 and got super busy and couldn't make it out, then I decided to hurt my back right at the start of this season. I'm finally feeling better and decided to go to a match. Showed up, 32 shooters, and I was the only one shooting Limited Major... 2 years ago CO and Limited were about equal. I'm shooting a old TSS Fat Free, gun shoots great when I do my part. I was saving to have a new custom 6in gun built, but now I'm not so sure. I'd sell it to fund an Open gun, but I don't even know if there is a market for it? Long story short, my favorite division is dying and I don't know what to do before hoping off to the dark side? I have a bunch of factory 40 that would sit forever if I didn't shoot it...

[OperationHitFactor]

Previous Limited shooter. After taking a very long break I just came back and had to decide on a division. Naturally I considered Limited but then realized. Oh I need to get a reloading press again to load long, ah I need to get a 2011, woah I need to stock up on components, ugh then get a chronograph to load develop for major. Then I realized the numbers for limited are dying and I don't want to be the last one holding a $5K .40 cal 2011 with couple grand in ammo. So... yeah... nope

 

Then you look at Carry Optics, easy to find cheap guns in every flavor and tons of red dot sights to pick from. Also 9mm minor, factory ammunition is competitive and trouble free. Easy choice I can go start training to be ready for the Fall matches. Plus the entire commercial market is using carry optics guns so easy to resale. 

 

Now Limited Optics - This one was actually enticing and I might end up here. Since it is 9mm minor, no need for load development. Let's face it, .40 is dead across the industry not just USPSA. Limited might have a better chance if it dropped to minor power factor for 9mm but that is going to make some people real mad that have .40 major guns now. Another pro to 9mm 2011 is it opens up potential buyers outside of sport shooting when we flip our guns for new. I have friends who have never and will never shoot a competition but they have 9mm 2011s or Double Stack 1911s. 

 

Plus optics are hear to stay. Nobody is going back to iron sights, ever, like never ever.  

 

Limited was incredible and had an amazing run, but this is it's swan song. 

 

RIP Iron Sights 1450 - 2023

 

RIP .40 Cal  1990 - 2023 

[Midwest3Gunner]

Right, so what happens to all the 40 cal guns? They just sit in the safe forever? I don't think its worth it to mill my slide for a dot, but YMMV. In Standard division in IPSC, major has a minimum bullet diameter of .400" for Major PF. How do our European friends deal with 40 dying off? Is Standard Major facing the same problem?

[BritinUSA]

It's different in IPSC, there's more balance between the divisions. Last time I checked it was Open that was declining (slowly), I suspect that decline will pick up now there is another division for Optics (ProdOptics).

 

Standard Optics will push people from Standard but they won't need to buy new guns as it's staying as Major/Minor so just a quick milling and they will be all set.

 

It will be interesting to compare the growth between USPSA's LO and IPSC's SO.

[lroy]

7 hours ago, Midwest3Gunner said:

Right, so what happens to all the 40 cal guns? They just sit in the safe forever? I don't think its worth it to mill my slide for a dot, but YMMV. In Standard division in IPSC, major has a minimum bullet diameter of .400" for Major PF. How do our European friends deal with 40 dying off? Is Standard Major facing the same problem?

 

Isn't that what's happening to them now, anyway? It's not like all those limited shooters died, they just switched divisions.

[Midwest3Gunner]

42 minutes ago, lroy said:

 

Isn't that what's happening to them now, anyway? It's not like all those limited shooters died, they just switched divisions.

Right, I'm just saying that there isn't as much point of repurposing the Limited guns as there was to just get a production gun milled for a dot to shoot Carry Optics. Another thing, in Limited, there was a whole bunch of different gun configurations and it was fun to compare them all. It'll be interesting to see if there's as much variation in LO, or if it'll turn into this such and such setup works best for 9 minor, just choose what optic you like best.

[Joe4d]

On 9/6/2023 at 5:53 PM, twodownzero said:

Everything that isn't a rifle or minor high cap optics is already dead.

thats because there isnt a minor high cap iron division.

[Racinready300ex]

1 hour ago, Midwest3Gunner said:

Right, I'm just saying that there isn't as much point of repurposing the Limited guns as there was to just get a production gun milled for a dot to shoot Carry Optics. Another thing, in Limited, there was a whole bunch of different gun configurations and it was fun to compare them all. It'll be interesting to see if there's as much variation in LO, or if it'll turn into this such and such setup works best for 9 minor, just choose what optic you like best.

 

Was there really? Most serious limited shooters I see shoot 2011's with a small number of CZ's mixed in. Then there are the pro's who are paid to shoot something that's not as good. But most people never see those guys at their local anyway.

 

LO being minor we will certainly see more variation in guns. 2011's are great at taking the abuse and soaking up recoil of a 40. Minor it doesn't matter nearly as much. 

[Racinready300ex]

1 hour ago, Midwest3Gunner said:

Right, I'm just saying that there isn't as much point of repurposing the Limited guns as there was to just get a production gun milled for a dot to shoot Carry Optics. Another thing, in Limited, there was a whole bunch of different gun configurations and it was fun to compare them all. It'll be interesting to see if there's as much variation in LO, or if it'll turn into this such and such setup works best for 9 minor, just choose what optic you like best.

 

I repurposed a limited gun into a LO gun. New slide was like 200. New barrel was maybe 250, 350 for a dot, 150 for a plate. So 950. Reused basically everything else, holster, mag pouches etc. (really I had a old barrel laying around too)

 

VS 600 for a plastic rival and 350 for a dot the same dot would be 950 minimum. Add a brass back strap, tungsten guide rod, fancy trigger, replace the springs, Maybe a better magwell as the stock one is kinda trashy. Maybe a better holser and mag pouches. You'll have more into this build. 

 

Really I just wanted to do it, more than I was worried about the numbers. 

[Midwest3Gunner]

6 minutes ago, Racinready300ex said:

 

Was there really? Most serious limited shooters I see shoot 2011's with a small number of CZ's mixed in. Then there are the pro's who are paid to shoot something that's not as good. But most people never see those guys at their local anyway.

 

LO being minor we will certainly see more variation in guns. 2011's are great at taking the abuse and soaking up recoil of a 40. Minor it doesn't matter nearly as much. 

Sorry, I meant a bunch of different 2011 configurations. You had 5, 5.4, 6in barrels, bushing or bull, long, short, intermediate dust covers. Sight trackers, island barrels, poly grips, aluminum, and steel. Thumb rest or not, racker or not. I just don't see that mix in LO. I shot a TSO for a season, I really liked it but I wanted to tinker more, so I switched back to a 2011. I would bet everything settles out at a 4.6 slide full dustcover with a steel grip as being the most common setup.