Limited Major dying?

[RJH]

Just now, Boomstick303 said:

 

Does this stand for "Oh, For Fudd's Sake?"

 

 

Something like that LOL. I'd started typing a longer rebuttal, but then realized it was going to be wasted. I think I was correct

[Racinready300ex]

Just now, cautery said:

Yes, I do.  I chose to SERVE the organization rather than spend my time on a delusional journey to be a Master or GM.

And when the douchebags starting infesting this sport, and when the head shed started FAILING to back staff at shoots and started cow-towing to manufacturers and sponsored shooters....

I stopped ROing.

Nothing has gotten better.  <--- FACT

Prove me Wrong.

 

I get not chasing GM, it's not for everyone. But you could shoot a match. How can anyone prove you right or wrong if you don't even shoot?

 

I bet we have just as much fun at matches today as you did in 2014

[Racinready300ex]

3 minutes ago, RJH said:

 

 

Something like that LOL. I'd started typing a longer rebuttal, but then realized it was going to be wasted. I think I was correct

 

I noticed you were typing for a while for such a short reply. 

[cautery]

deleted

Edited September 26, 2023 by cautery

[Boomstick303]

I do find it weird is you can shoot divisions that include power, yet people do not want to shoot it.  

 

Is that the fault of the organization?  While I think there a lot of issues with the organization, blaming them for what people want to shoot is not one of their creation.  People like much of society today want the easy button.  To blame that on anyone or any organization is not how you "Save" low cap divisions, or power divisions.  

 

[Racinready300ex]

1 minute ago, cautery said:

You just proved right there, that you have no understanding at all.

I knew it was pointless to participate in this thread.

I am deleting all of my posts in this thread.

It's y'alls circus now...  burn the b!tch down.

 

What did I prove? That you haven't been on this board since 2018 when you sold a press and only returned to sell some brass and figured you know better then people who shoot today? 

 

If you shot a match today, I'd  be really surprised to hear you didn't enjoy it. You seem like a lot of fun. 

[RJH]

I started shooting in 05 I think, maybe 04. It was fun then it's still fun today

[Racinready300ex]

We're watching Limited fight for the honor of all iron sight divisions trying to hold on to the top spot and iron sight nationals. But, I don't think it can hold on. 

 

All these divisions are on life support. 

[Racinready300ex]

1 minute ago, RJH said:

I started shooting in 05 I think, maybe 04. It was fun then it's still fun today

 

So you started about the time @cautery probably did. I didn't start until 2011 or so. 

 

Also still fun today, in fact I probably have more fun today in many ways even if I'm older and slower. 

[Boomstick303]

I am pretty sure like 95% of the people have no idea what the organization is doing or care for that matter, for the most part and are at matches just to shoot and have fun.  

[RJH]

26 minutes ago, Racinready300ex said:

We're watching Limited fight for the honor of all iron sight divisions trying to hold on to the top spot and iron sight nationals. But, I don't think it can hold on. 

 

All these divisions are on life support. 

 

Damn, as soon as they announced it and, I realized people could move divisions it didn't surprise me a bit that it passed L10, revolver, and single stack. And I wasn't completely blown away when it passed production but, passing limited will really say something

[THS]

I think Production 15 will help it survive.   Great place for starting.   

 

I dont know if Limited Major has a future....

[BritinUSA]

3 hours ago, Racinready300ex said:

So you started about the time @cautery probably did. I didn't start until 2011 or so. 

1990 for me, though I didn't join UKPSA until 1992 (if I recall)

[konkapot]

I started in 00, and definitely had more fun because I was shooting well and improving. 

 

I would agree as usual with LtdMstr that there's more focus on movement rather than shooting. Not saying that's "good" or "bad" it just....is. 

 

I do see people with non optimal fundamentals particularly with regards to grip and trigger control. Obviously the grip/t.c is "good enough" for what we're doing. 

 

One thing that I do like is that they updated the hhf for the classifier system. When I made GM the hhf for 99-11 was 10.6 or something. There are other examples but that's the one that comes to mind. 

[Racinready300ex]

14 hours ago, konkapot said:

 

 

I would agree as usual with LtdMstr that there's more focus on movement rather than shooting. Not saying that's "good" or "bad" it just....is. 

 

I do see people with non optimal fundamentals particularly with regards to grip and trigger control. Obviously the grip/t.c is "good enough" for what we're doing. 

 

 

Certainly from the standpoint of these day's you have to be able to move efficiently to place well. Although I've heard back in the day they had stuff like Rhodesian walls. People would loose their s#!t over that today. Similarly, prone shooting is pretty much gone, I've seen maybe 2 or 3 cooper tunnels in 10 years of shooting. That's stuff is pretty physical and all but gone from the sport now.

 

Similarly though I see little one handed shooting, vary few if any difficult leans. IDPA in some ways is harder shooting that USPSA. I know uspsa shooters don't want to hear that but it's true. 

 

And for sure, today you can get pretty far just squirting bullets really fast. 

[Darqusoull13]

21 hours ago, Racinready300ex said:

All these divisions are on life support. 

I can't wait for CO+ to surpass Limited. Formerly Iron Sight Nationals stages look like a bunch of fun, especially with a dot and lots of bullets! 

Limited Major is dying because 40 sucks to shoot compared to 9 Minor. 40 is more expensive, more recoil, harder to buy power factor ammo and on top of that you're stuck with irons. 

To be honest, Production going to 15 will do more to kill off Limited as a division than CO+ will. 

[Racinready300ex]

6 minutes ago, Darqusoull13 said:

I can't wait for CO+ to surpass Limited. Formerly Iron Sight Nationals stages look like a bunch of fun, especially with a dot and lots of bullets! 

Limited Major is dying because 40 sucks to shoot compared to 9 Minor. 40 is more expensive, more recoil, harder to buy power factor ammo and on top of that you're stuck with irons. 

To be honest, Production going to 15 will do more to kill off Limited as a division than CO+ will. 

 

100%.

 

Had they made Prod 140's it would of been ugly for limited. But, either way it's death is imminent. 

 

Below is a Level 2 State Championship coming up. Not looking healthy. 

[barry]

Wow

I find it funny how much people are worried about what other people choose to shoot.

Should be worried about the fact that all shooting sports in this country are hanging by a very delicate political thread.

[Racinready300ex]

Just now, barry said:

Wow

I find it funny how much people are worried about what other people choose to shoot.

Should be worried about the fact that all shooting sports in this country are hanging by a very delicate political thread.

 

Not really much we can do about politics. Most gun owners don't even vote, and we can't talk politics here anyway. 

 

It's also possible to care about the direction of this sport and also care about the 2a stuff going on in the country. Kind of 2 separate things really. 

[barry]

But why all the can't wait for ltd to die? 

Just don't shoot it. I seldom shoot it. Never shot pcc but it brought shooters in.

[barry]

And as far as politics being banned it may explain why it the same 20 or so same people posting here on every subject 20 times a day.

[THS]

Two things:   Accuracy is REALLY undervalued in today's game.   Right or Wrong it just is.   At a recent local we shot El Prez.   The Winner (open)  had 3 A, 7 C, and 2 D in about 5.58.    Second (LO) was 9 A, 3 C in 7.05.   I would argue that the winner lacked Accuracy, with only 25% A hits!  I doubt we are going to change it, but the sport is "accuracy, SPEED, power" now.

 

When 40 was what EVERY law enforcement guy shot and was plentiful in brass and ammo it was a good limited round.   I shot many thousands of them.  As the LE community has moved to 9mm again, and the military has stayed there, it has become the easiest things to find and load for.  It is a cycle of life thing, in my observation.

 

Politics is out as it brings out the worst in people.  We dont talk the politics of the sport, much less the Nation;  you wont change that here.

[Racinready300ex]

16 minutes ago, THS said:

Two things:   Accuracy is REALLY undervalued in today's game.   Right or Wrong it just is.   At a recent local we shot El Prez.   The Winner (open)  had 3 A, 7 C, and 2 D in about 5.58.    Second (LO) was 9 A, 3 C in 7.05.   I would argue that the winner lacked Accuracy, with only 25% A hits!  I doubt we are going to change it, but the sport is "accuracy, SPEED, power" now.

 

 

I don't think you're wrong, but it's also vary match dependent. So it's completely up to the MD how valuable accuracy is today. Gear has likely made us faster too which raises HF and reduces the value of hits. But, I still see some matches with a average HF in the 5 or 6 range and points really matter. 

 

Even your example, the winner only shot 62% on that stage, he wasn't really that fast and his hits were bad. That's a example of how you can win at some locals even with out shooting great. 

[Murzikrv]

Agreed.

[Racinready300ex]

56 minutes ago, barry said:

But why all the can't wait for ltd to die? 

Just don't shoot it. I seldom shoot it. Never shot pcc but it brought shooters in.

 

If a division is going to potentially bring people in, that's great. LO is doing that some, or at least it's giving some people a place to shoot guns that were in open before and didn't fit. It'll probably be the biggest division at Iron sight nationals, so clearly it's a popular idea.

 

But, I don't see anyone these days showing up at their first match with a limited gun. They might shoot limited because they don't have 5 mags for their production gun but they're not really shooting limited. At this point limited is kind of broken and no one really shoots it. I personally don't think it's healthy for the sport to have lots of divisions that no one shoots. I think the sport can be better with less divisions if we put a little thought into it. 

 

Limited is 100% a legacy division that only exists because it's been around a long time. If we were going to start uspsa today there is no chance we'd make a division for SAO iron sight 40's. No one would be asking for that at all.