Is it time for a Combined Action Shooting World Championship?

[Nimitz]

There's no perfect place for this but I'll post it here & in the 'other shooting sports' sub forum so if it gets any traction the mods can combine them ....

 

So,  we have multiple , individual action shooting sports: USPSA, IDPA, Steel Challenge, Bianchi Cup, 3-gun.  they are all different in some respect, have theiur loyal followers & detractors but the one thing they do all have in common is that they are 'Action Shooting' sports -- to excel at any of them you must master the ability to shoot accurately at speed.  Given this, I think a great way to grow all the sports would be to have a combined world action shooting championship.  while there would be  zillion ways to do this the basic concept would be something like say a week long competition where competitors would shoot stages from all the individual sports and then devise some sort of scoring system to normalize between them and at the end you would crown a Combined Action Shooting World Champion.  I think this would be an interesting way to grow all the sports and drive more interest and could help quell some of the never ending debate about which is 'better' ....

obviously there are a million things to work out to do something like this and if you could ever generate sponsor interest so that there could be actual prize money like professional bass fishing, professional beach volleyball, professional bowling, etc where the top pros actually make healthy livings, that would go a long way.

 

So what do folks think?  please don't just comment on why it won't work as there are always solutions to roadblocks if there is enough interest but try providing constructive comments on what it might do or not do for competitive shooting is really the goal.  if you think its a bad idea don't just say so because it would be hard to do, tell why you think competitors & others would not be interested ....

 

so let's here what you have to say ...

[JFlowers]

I seem to recall a match that did just that, maybe at Peacemaker Training.  X number of stages of this, X number of that.

[HCH]

I'd be interested in shooting it.

 

 

[B_RAD]

In theory, this would be very interesting. 

 

In practicality, I don't see it as being possible..

 

I could go ahead and tell you which member/sport would win. 

 

And since that'd almost certainly be the case each time, let's just stick with that one sport. 

[Steve133]

37 minutes ago, JFlowers said:

I seem to recall a match that did just that, maybe at Peacemaker Training.  X number of stages of this, X number of that.

 

I think you might be thinking about the NRA World Shooting Championship? Pretty sure it was at Peacemaker and had a format similar to that. A quick google search doesn't reveal much information on it beyond "canceled for 2020 due to Covid", but I'm trying to remember what I saw about it the last time it happened. I want to say that it was a mish-mash of the typical "action shooting" sports (including SASS) with bullseye pistol, Olympic-style smallbore stuff, and trap/skeet.

 

I'm kind of on the fence about whether including the "non-action" sports is better or worse. On the one hand, they don't interest me too terribly much personally; but on the other had, it does tend to introduce a more holistic challenge than limiting things to the broadly-similar action sports, and it probably carries a greater potential for crossover.

[Joe4d]

2 big points in your post I couldnt care less about.

"Grow the sport"  PULEASE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cant shoot now as it is. Want to shoot an Area ? yeh good luck, better register months out in the 30 second window. Heck I quit the sport years ago because the nearest match was a 5 hour round trip you had to register a couple weeks out or you couldnt shoot.

Want to grow the sport, needs to grow from the bottom with more support for local willing match directors and getting some ranges and matches off the ground.

Second point. I seriously could give a rip if a handful of prima donnas get a paycheck skimmed from the thousands of recreational shooters work and money.

Pro level simply cant self support like it does in some of your other sports.

[Sarge]

33 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

2 big points in your post I couldnt care less about.

"Grow the sport"  PULEASE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cant shoot now as it is. Want to shoot an Area ? yeh good luck, better register months out in the 30 second window. Heck I quit the sport years ago because the nearest match was a 5 hour round trip you had to register a couple weeks out or you couldnt shoot.

Want to grow the sport, needs to grow from the bottom with more support for local willing match directors and getting some ranges and matches off the ground.

Second point. I seriously could give a rip if a handful of prima donnas get a paycheck skimmed from the thousands of recreational shooters work and money.

Pro level simply cant self support like it does in some of your other sports.

I’m right there with you on growing the sport. Even locals now have wait lists.

[Rez805]

1 hour ago, JFlowers said:

I seem to recall a match that did just that, maybe at Peacemaker Training.  X number of stages of this, X number of that.

"This time on Hot Shots . . ."

 

[outerlimits]

51 minutes ago, Joe4d said:

2 big points in your post I couldnt care less about.

"Grow the sport"  PULEASE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cant shoot now as it is. Want to shoot an Area ? yeh good luck, better register months out in the 30 second window. Heck I quit the sport years ago because the nearest match was a 5 hour round trip you had to register a couple weeks out or you couldnt shoot.

Want to grow the sport, needs to grow from the bottom with more support for local willing match directors and getting some ranges and matches off the ground.

Second point. I seriously could give a rip if a handful of prima donnas get a paycheck skimmed from the thousands of recreational shooters work and money.

Pro level simply cant self support like it does in some of your other sports.

this^^^^

 

besides the beard would just make it a ppc match.

[Nolan]

The NRA match concept works, but the NRA couldn't run or promote a match if it's life depended on it.  

 

What I like about it:

Equipment and ammo supplied by the match, just show up with Eye and Ear protection and shoot.

Good variety of disciplines.
Fun to shoot other disciplines in competition.

It looked like they did have a pretty good vendors row.

 

 

What I don't like about it:

Suppliers for the NRA match did not always supply appropriate equipment or ammo.

Shotguns didn't have enough stock adjustments or were not allowed to adjust stocks.

NRA competition division.  I'm a member, but politics ruins everything.

 

Getting that many suppliers involved would be a tremendous undertaking and would require a range like the CMP range....which brings up the question, could the CMP put together a match like this WITHOUT involving the NRA.

 

Nolan

 

 

[Nolan]

2 hours ago, Joe4d said:

"Grow the sport"  PULEASE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

There have been lots of arguments like this, but it's the old chicken or egg question.  Ranges aren't viable without the customers to support them, bring more customers and they can support more ranges.

 

There was a time when there were only a couple on 1911 manufacturers, and there was a multi-year wait list for custom guns...oh wait, bad example (Just kidding), now there are dozens of custom 1911 makers and at least a dozen semi-custom makers, because there are customers for them.

 

Here in Commiefornia within a 2 hour drive there have been 2 defunct ranges re-opened and are running matches (USPSA, IDPA, and Steel Challenge) because there are too many customers being turned away from other competition ranges with full matches.

 

Nolan

[TonytheTiger]

3 hours ago, Steve133 said:

I'm kind of on the fence about whether including the "non-action" sports is better or worse. On the one hand, they don't interest me too terribly much personally; but on the other had, it does tend to introduce a more holistic challenge than limiting things to the broadly-similar action sports, and it probably carries a greater potential for crossover.

Do you include PRS type stuff? It's currently the trendy sport, and some people call it an action sport. Doesn't really fit well with anything being discussed so far.

I can't possibly imagine how you could score all these very different types of shooting to find an overall champion.

[SGT_Schultz]

4 hours ago, JFlowers said:

I seem to recall a match that did just that, maybe at Peacemaker Training.  X number of stages of this, X number of that.

 

The NRA put it on and it was a giant flop IIRC

[Gregg K]

Just combining several USPSA Nationals together causes a lot of difficulty for competitors wanting to shoot both. I would give you a higher chance of success if you leave out IDPA from the mix. I'm not bashing and have been an active competitor in it and many other sports. If you think you can resolve the problems between USPSA and IDPA types, you need to be elected to congress because getting it to work would be easier.

[Intheshaw1]

I feel like you would have to take them all and mash them together into one big match. Do a crazy field type stage that's like a mile long and get sponsors for each part. Run to this stage and grab the pcc and shoot these targets, run over here and grab a rifle and hit those 600 yard targets.

 

You would need to incorporate things from each discipline but it would have to be different enough to draw a crowd from all. You could have a couple divisions but the weapon would pick up at each mini stage would be determined by your division.

 

You just need to figure out the one or two things each discipline would bring whether it's long range, multigun, fast and accurate shooting, or wearing a vest. All could be incorporated into some big shoot but they would all need to be blended into one thing and not broken up. I wouldn't want it to be like 'now this is the USPSA stage and that is the IDPA stage' if you get my drift.

[-JCN-]

Revive Top Shot television show, lol. 

[shred]

Yeah, the NRA/Peacemaker people tried the World Championships a couple times and not a lot of people cared.  Video can be found on YouTube.

It seemed like a World Championship of Auto Racing or something, with a mixture of F1, off-road, stock-car, autocross and drag racing.

 

If you're a pro that specializes in being very good at some specific sport (as most do), then they aren't going to be wild to be scored on their skeet or PRS or SASS or IDPA or whatever skills. 

[ClangClang]

I'm just thinking of how many Pelican cases would be required to travel to a match where I was going to shoot USPSA, 3 Gun, PRS, and Sporting Clays - all in a single weekend. I'm not sure I could even fit all that in the trunk of my Civic, much less as flight baggage.

 

[SGT_Schultz]

1 hour ago, Intheshaw1 said:

I feel like you would have to take them all and mash them together into one big match. Do a crazy field type stage that's like a mile long and get sponsors for each part. Run to this stage and grab the pcc and shoot these targets, run over here and grab a rifle and hit those 600 yard targets.

 

 

So if I do cowboy mounted shooting, can I bring my horse for the mile?

[Intheshaw1]

57 minutes ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

So if I do cowboy mounted shooting, can I bring my horse for the mile?

If there is enough demand, incorporate it. A local 3 gun match had shooting from a stationary motorcycle. So make a wooden horse and shoot from it.

 

I honestly don't think a combined shoot would work, but I have my input on how it could work.

 

[SGT_Schultz]

5 hours ago, Intheshaw1 said:

If there is enough demand, incorporate it. A local 3 gun match had shooting from a stationary motorcycle. So make a wooden horse and shoot from it.

 

LOL I meant one of these

 

[perttime]

IPSC has World Shoots. They are big enough even with Handgun, Rifle, Shotgun, etc. separated into different Matches.

 

In this thread, people seem to be talking about US matches, thinking that it covers the World.

[Intheshaw1]

3 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

 

LOL I meant one of these

 

I know what you meant, I just assumed that 99% of people can't ride so it would have to be something that everyone could do.

[Racinready300ex]

1 hour ago, perttime said:

IPSC has World Shoots. They are big enough even with Handgun, Rifle, Shotgun, etc. separated into different Matches.

 

In this thread, people seem to be talking about US matches, thinking that it covers the World.

 

Exactly just because you say something is a world championship doesn't make it so.

 

Kind of like SC lol

[RJH]

16 hours ago, TonytheTiger said:

Do you include PRS type stuff? It's currently the trendy sport, and some people call it an action sport. Doesn't really fit well with anything being discussed so far.

I can't possibly imagine how you could score all these very different types of shooting to find an overall champion.

 

I like the idea of PRS thrown in

 

Scoring could be done easily.  Winner of each event gets 100 points and everyone else gets the points reflective of their percent of the winner.  At he end of it all most points total is champion,  kind of like a time plus 3 gun match.  Then all events would be Equal in scoring and no one event would be weighed more heavily than the others.

 

I like the idea of a match like this and i liked the idea of the NRA match that kind of did it in the past.  I would like to see one set up where a competitor could use his own guns though, and maybe have to use the same guns through the match.  Like where a person would have to pick in their opinion the 3 guns that would give them the best overall chance of winning.