USPSA purchases Steel Challenge

[Gary Stevens]

You all thought I was just putting a tag line on my signature. Really I was giving a warning

Gary

[et45]

Don't worry if they decide to buy IDPA they won't ask you anyway!

I plan on buying IDPA after I win Powerball

[AlamoShooter]

Edited December 13, 2007 by AlamoShooter

[rgkeller]

On topic, but back a few posts...

OK, one major concern has been how are the local staffs of USPSA clubs going to handle running SC type matches at their clubs.

Here is our experiance at Old Bridge. We have a very active USPSA Club, we run 12 sanctioned matches, a shotgun match and a multi-gun match, PLUS 23 indoor practice matches. In addition we have a VERY strong Steel organization. There are three monthly steel matches, One has essentially SC stages, one has "Steel" in that there are 5 targets and 5 shots. and one is Knockdown.

Here is the GOOD NEWS. We have tremendous cross over from shooters, but we have essentially two completely different crews. Neither team gets over-worked to an extreme.

Both types of match feed the other so we are all benefiting.

Jim

You are fortunate to have access to a range that has so many "slots" for matchs. Many ranges only permit one or two matches a month. USPSA matches already compete with SASS and IDPA for these slots.

Do you think that the steel match folks will be willing to send money every month to USPSA?

[JThompson]

On topic, but back a few posts...

OK, one major concern has been how are the local staffs of USPSA clubs going to handle running SC type matches at their clubs.

Here is our experiance at Old Bridge. We have a very active USPSA Club, we run 12 sanctioned matches, a shotgun match and a multi-gun match, PLUS 23 indoor practice matches. In addition we have a VERY strong Steel organization. There are three monthly steel matches, One has essentially SC stages, one has "Steel" in that there are 5 targets and 5 shots. and one is Knockdown.

Here is the GOOD NEWS. We have tremendous cross over from shooters, but we have essentially two completely different crews. Neither team gets over-worked to an extreme.

Both types of match feed the other so we are all benefiting.

Jim

You are fortunate to have access to a range that has so many "slots" for matchs. Many ranges only permit one or two matches a month. USPSA matches already compete with SASS and IDPA for these slots.

Do you think that the steel match folks will be willing to send money every month to USPSA?

Yes. This would be a major problem for us. If we shoot something like USPSA we have to exclude members who just want to come out and shoot. There's only so much of that you can do before members lose their patients and you their dues. We would, most likely, be forced to choose one or the other for any given months match.

EDIT: On a more positive vibe, there are many clubs in the area that have more than enough room to accommodate steel and not put members out.

Edited December 13, 2007 by JThompson

[Chriss Grube]

Any official announcement going on the actual USPSA website?? I see they are selling phones and thanking Para might be nice to let the rest of the organization know besides the guys here.

[Ron Ankeny]

I just deleted a long and well thought out post. Just let me say this thread is making a lot of people look bad. What's the chances of closing it under the beating a dead horse category?

[raz-0]

You are fortunate to have access to a range that has so many "slots" for matchs. Many ranges only permit one or two matches a month. USPSA matches already compete with SASS and IDPA for these slots.

Do you think that the steel match folks will be willing to send money every month to USPSA?

For the first part, either your clubs calendar is full or it isn't. I doubt anyone is going to be forced to shoot one thing or drop the other.

As for your second question, the answer could be yes, or it could be no.

If USPSA added steel match scoring ot ezwinscore, or provided a steel scoring program, and let you upload match results likeyou now can for USPSA competition, then $5 a head might be a very attractive deal.

On the other hand, under SCSA setup where if you put on a major match, they wanted you to cough up $20 a shooter and all you got was being forbidden to approach sponsors for that money. I think with that continued approach, you'll get what you have now.. which is pretty much every other sizable steel match telling them to go screw off. A $20 bump in match fees and a vanishing prize table isn't a very attractive incentive.

[Flexmoney]

You are fortunate to have access to a range that has so many "slots" for matchs. Many ranges only permit one or two matches a month. USPSA matches already compete with SASS and IDPA for these slots.

Do you think that the steel match folks will be willing to send money every month to USPSA?

For the first part, either your clubs calendar is full or it isn't. I doubt anyone is going to be forced to shoot one thing or drop the other.

Right.

There are clubs in the Ohio Section that could pick up SC, if they so choose.

There are clubs in the area that are "[insert discipline here]" clubs and I doubt they would ever run an USPSA/IPSC match...until the "powers that be" at those clubs moved on. They may, however be willing to benefit from an SC match.

There are clubs in the area that might not have the facilities, nor wherewithal, to run full-on USPSA matches. But they may be able to run a SC program on their facilities.

As for your second question, the answer could be yes, or it could be no.

If USPSA added steel match scoring ot ezwinscore, or provided a steel scoring program, and let you upload match results likeyou now can for USPSA competition, then $5 a head might be a very attractive deal.

On the other hand, under SCSA setup where if you put on a major match, they wanted you to cough up $20 a shooter and all you got was being forbidden to approach sponsors for that money. I think with that continued approach, you'll get what you have now.. which is pretty much every other sizable steel match telling them to go screw off. A $20 bump in match fees and a vanishing prize table isn't a very attractive incentive.

True.

[AlamoShooter]

$20 a head for a State + level match is NOT the steel challenge fee. =It was $5.00 (five dollars)

At the club level it IS -0- ZERO per shooter.

The score "?program" is just a simple excel page with simple formulas.

A steel challenge club can do any kind of stage that is safe and sane. Mike & Mike had no interest in restricting or controlling what a club was doing, other than making certain Good Will and Safety was maintained.

Alamo Sport Shooting Club = Just a little bitty piece of Texas

I will continue with the way we shoot and what we shoot, If USPSA asks us to stop calling it Steel Challenge, thats OK too. We already have a sister club called Texas Steel I'm all for States Rites.

Edited December 13, 2007 by AlamoShooter

[Jaxshooter]

What is amazing to me is that there is information on this forum about the purchase and nothing on the USPSA Forum. I think this is where the negative responce begins. I appears everybody in the world knows what the USPSA is doing before the information is presented to the members on thier own web site.

We don't have dates for our Nationals but the SC is set and ready to go. Everyone says to leave the match where it is but when the same thing is suggested for the Nationals the powers that be say it will allow the ranges ot hold us over a barrel. What is the difference? The President and the BOD need to listen to the member input regarding scheduling major matches if they want the USPSA to grow through participation by the members. You never get ahead by adding new members when you loose the old ones.

[WDB]

"Now gotta go to figure out how to incorporate SC stages into the local match scheme."

More Steel. Less IPSC.

That's what I wouldn't want to see. When I show up for USPSA, I want USPSA, paper, falling steel, and movement. When I show up for steel that's what I want, statioanary steel, 5 runs, worst one out. Don't mix them up!!! As a number of people on this forum have already pointed out, they are 2 different disciplines that compliment each other. Leave them both as is a let the scientist out there mess with combining DNA.

[Rob Boudrie]

That's what I wouldn't want to see. When I show up for USPSA, I want USPSA, paper, falling steel, and movement.

I would be opposed to making a SC stage part of a traditional USPSA match. If a match wanted to do a SC stage as a side match, fine - but not as part of the match itself. And, as a competitor, I'd be annoyed if the stage count was trimmed by 1 to make room for such a side match.

It's about expanding what we do, not shrinking anything we already offer.

[AZGunut]

Hi everyone,

I for one am glad that they purchased it. Not to stir the pot, but after 08 the best thing for the Challenge would be to move it the heck out of California. Not to make it political, with their restrictive gun laws and anti gun attitudes in the state why do we reward them by running a national level match there. I suggest we move it to Rio Salado here in Arizona. We already have the facility, the competitors (we run what is probably the nations largest weekly steel match every Tuesday night) The Steel Callenge was in Piru becasue Mike and Mike were there now if they no longer own the match there is no reason to keep the match there. Sorry if I offended and people from the country of Calfornia, but that is my opinion.

[cpty1]

with their restrictive gun laws and anti gun attitudes in the state why do we reward them by running a national level match there

Regardless of how one feels about the purchase, the lack of communication, or anything else about the thing, it's hard to argue with that.

[zhunter]

with their restrictive gun laws and anti gun attitudes in the state why do we reward them by running a national level match there

Regardless of how one feels about the purchase, the lack of communication, or anything else about the thing, it's hard to argue with that.

Both of the above get +1's from me!!!!

[shootingchef]

with their restrictive gun laws and anti gun attitudes in the state why do we reward them by running a national level match there

Regardless of how one feels about the purchase, the lack of communication, or anything else about the thing, it's hard to argue with that.

Both of the above get +1's from me!!!!

+1

Microstamping cases?

[DaG]

Hey so when are we gonna buy IDPA?

I'm in for $10.00...if I can wear my DOH

DaG

[boo radley]

Hi everyone,

I for one am glad that they purchased it. Not to stir the pot, but after 08 the best thing for the Challenge would be to move it the heck out of California. Not to make it political, with their restrictive gun laws and anti gun attitudes in the state why do we reward them by running a national level match there. I suggest we move it to Rio Salado here in Arizona. We already have the facility, the competitors (we run what is probably the nations largest weekly steel match every Tuesday night) The Steel Callenge was in Piru becasue Mike and Mike were there now if they no longer own the match there is no reason to keep the match there. Sorry if I offended and people from the country of Calfornia, but that is my opinion.

Help me understand? You don't wish to make this thread political, but you think the Steel Challenge Match -- by all accounts successful, and more so each year -- should be moved to punish California shooters.

Just checking.

Oddly enough, I've always felt success is defined through adversity. How much more honorable to continue and grow the tradition, in spite of opposition, than to snatch it away, and run.

[Vlad]

Seriously, with the lead ammo ban this is may academic. There may be no choice but to move the match. Well, that or not have it.

[warpspeed]

It is better to keep your mouth shut and let people think you are an idiot than to open it and remove all doubt.

[AZGunut]

Hi again,

I just wanted to say a public apoligy. I shouldn't have voiced out loud what I was thinking inside in a public forum. I do not want to get this thread closed and I will try to keep my private views private (Even though what I said I do stand behind)

[Alan Meek]

Seriously, with the lead ammo ban this is may academic. There may be no choice but to move the match. Well, that or not have it.

From my read on the lead ammo ban it only pertains to hunters at this time.

Alan

[AlamoShooter]

When did -Member- and -Stock Holder- become the same thing? I read all this about, 'communication' ,notification, 'keeping members informed'. We / you elect Representatives and that is what they did Represent you in what will be the best thing for USPSA.

It seams to me that is of next to zero risk for USPSA, and has every possibility to be a "Windfall Profit" to USPSA. If it does not work out I bet it could be resold for more than it was purchased for. I Also bet that MR M.&M. have thought of that and have a buy back plan. They put over 20 years in it. = Ask Brian = my bet Is "You Guys" would not even have this forum if it was not for Steel Challenge?

Its cool that we have this Forum, But if Brian decides to change it he owes us noting in the regard to a vote, the fact that we are "members" means nothing really. Not the same thing , but it kind of is

[zhunter]

Please stop the belly-aching!!!

Geez guys, just think, you have another chance to shoot!! You have an opportunity to justify a new gun, for you married guys that it

I see NO downside!

Steel is fun, different, but lots of fun.

Change, lack of communication, relocation, etc...

Who cares, just show up and shoot