I wish Production wasn't dying

[SGT_Schultz]

On 12/8/2020 at 10:00 AM, Tunachaser said:

At a recent match in Socal we had 12 shooters in production out of 77 shooters total.  CO was the largest with 16 and only 5 in SS.  Now this is just a sample of one but production is doing well locally.

 

I think California, where everyone is stuck with ten round mags, is a good example of what likely would have happened nationwide if CO had been left at 10 rounds: CO and Production reaching relatively equal participation levels.

 

CO has obliterated Production in most states without mag capacity limits.  It certainly has in OH.

Edited December 14, 2020 by SGT_Schultz

[MHicks]

In California you can't go to the store and buy new standard capacity mags. But shooters are shooting USPSA open, limited and carry optics along with ppc using full standard capacity mags with extended baseplates every week.

[SGT_Schultz]

5 hours ago, MHicks said:

In California you can't go to the store and buy new standard capacity mags. But shooters are shooting USPSA open, limited and carry optics along with ppc using full standard capacity mags with extended baseplates every week.

 

I see. 

 

How many with std capacity mags are new to the sport?

 

 

Edited December 14, 2020 by SGT_Schultz

[nasty618]

12 hours ago, waktasz said:

Production is dying because Practiscore match results show the Overall results on the front page

In other words, because most people are not smart enough to understand that combined results mean jack? 

 

"After comparing each others combined results on the same squad, Lim major, CO and Production guys get to the parking lot and hear PCC guy boasting how he beat Open major guy by 2%.".. There's a joke in there somewhere, except it's not.

 

12 hours ago, SGT_Schultz said:

Production is all about embracing the suck

 

think it's the opposite.  Production's limitations give you fewer options to think about during stage planning

Lol, I have "Embrace the suck" morale badge on my gear bag. 

 

I agree. I found my plans get more complicated (or maybe I was just over complicating them) having to plan with higher cap divisions, at times wishing I had to plan for 8-10 rds on some stages.  I'm sure it's  just because that's what I'm used to and gets smoothed out after a while.

Edited December 14, 2020 by nasty618

[IHAVEGAS]

On 12/14/2020 at 6:19 AM, nasty618 said:

I agree. I found my plans get more complicated (or maybe I was just over complicating them) having to plan with higher cap divisions, at times wishing I had to plan for 8-10 rds on some stages.  I'm sure it's  just because that's what I'm used to and gets smoothed out after a while.

 

Maybe it is just what you get used to? I started with limited. 

Now when I want to make things easier on the planning side I will shoot my limited gun instead of production, when I am in the mood for a real planning challenge I shoot my 8 shot revolver. 

[zzt]

One of the clubs I shoot at has a 'revolver friendly' match every Nov.  Three shoot revo.  The 'winner' of revo Division moves so slowly I could walk backwards faster then him.  I don't ever recall him shooting anything less than an A.  The other two hardly know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of.  I have to remind one of them (constantly) not to break 180 or sweep his feet when  reloading.  At least he listens and appreciates the help.

[SGT_Schultz]

8 hours ago, zzt said:

One of the clubs I shoot at has a 'revolver friendly' match every Nov.  Three shoot revo.  The 'winner' of revo Division moves so slowly I could walk backwards faster then him.  I don't ever recall him shooting anything less than an A.  The other two hardly know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of.  I have to remind one of them (constantly) not to break 180 or sweep his feet when  reloading.  At least he listens and appreciates the help.

 

?

 

Seen two or three semi auto shooters who fit those descriptions to a T, including one who in his first season would buy $1.80 lunch at DQ almost every match.

Edited December 22, 2020 by SGT_Schultz

[IHAVEGAS]

13 hours ago, zzt said:

One of the clubs I shoot at has a 'revolver friendly' match every Nov.  Three shoot revo.  The 'winner' of revo Division moves so slowly I could walk backwards faster then him.  I don't ever recall him shooting anything less than an A.  The other two hardly know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of.  I have to remind one of them (constantly) not to break 180 or sweep his feet when  reloading.  At least he listens and appreciates the help.

 

Might need to travel there so maybe I could win at wheel gun just once.

For what it is worth, the best 180 or sweep training I have found is a dq.  

[PatJones]

13 hours ago, zzt said:

One of the clubs I shoot at has a 'revolver friendly' match every Nov.  Three shoot revo.  The 'winner' of revo Division moves so slowly I could walk backwards faster then him.  I don't ever recall him shooting anything less than an A.  The other two hardly know which end of the gun the bullet comes out of.  I have to remind one of them (constantly) not to break 180 or sweep his feet when  reloading.  At least he listens and appreciates the help.

Wanna race?

[zzt]

30 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said:

 

Might need to travel there so maybe I could win at wheel gun just once.

For what it is worth, the best 180 or sweep training I have found is a dq.  

 

Unfortunately, I have had to DQ for 180 violations.

 

I don't shoot revo, but it seems to me there is no reason to point the barrel straight down while reloading.  It only take a twitch to break 180.  The gent I have to keep reminding now keeps his feet more widely spaced so he is not sweeping his foot.  He does perfectly well when he shoots SS.  It is only when he shoots revo that he has this tendency.

 

FWIW, no one who shoots revo in SCSA does this.  Granted, they are not on the clock.

[PatJones]

6 hours ago, zzt said:

I don't shoot revo, but it seems to me there is no reason to point the barrel straight down while reloading.

Gravity. The moonclip drops in faster when it's closer to vertical.

 

Back on topic, there's an awful lot of talk now that a wider portion of USPSA is experiencing what I've experienced in the other low cap divisions for years. Last summer revolver outnumbered production locally for a month or so. I expect single stack will constantly out number production soon as folks need to load their large primers.

[SGT_Schultz]

13 hours ago, zzt said:

I don't shoot revo, but it seems to me there is no reason to point the barrel straight down while reloading.

 

 

Well, there is.

[MHicks]

On 12/14/2020 at 2:08 AM, SGT_Schultz said:

 

I see. 

 

How many with std capacity mags are new to the sport?

 

 

I don't know. But I see a lot of new shooters in carry optics and especially juniors in pcc.

[DirkD]

On 12/14/2020 at 7:19 AM, nasty618 said:

In other words, because most people are not smart enough to understand that combined results mean jack? 

 

 

combined scores are what matters most

[Sarge]

2 hours ago, DirkD said:

combined scores are what matters most

Actually combined scores are pointless

[cheby]

2 hours ago, DirkD said:

combined scores are what matters most

Lol

[DirkD]

24 minutes ago, Sarge said:

Actually combined scores are pointless

you just compete against yourself.

[mchapman]

14 minutes ago, DirkD said:

you just compete against yourself.

Or others in your division. Otherwise why have divisions? Let's all just shoot heads up with whatever you brought if HOA meant something.

[Steppenwolf]

I shot a match at a smaller club this spring and was 2nd overall. No Open shooters. HOA was a guy shooting a PCC. Four of the six stages were not really challenging for a PCC. HOA is just a result of Practiscore lumping all shooters in a match together in an overall combined list. I was happy with the result. But it seems that the Practiscore combined results list does matter to a lot of shooters.

[nasty618]

10 hours ago, DirkD said:

combined scores are what matters most

Ha. Lol?

 

4 hours ago, Steppenwolf said:

Practiscore combined results list does matter to a lot of shooters

I find it mind numbing how little people understand about the game.  Even at M and G levels. Oh well.  

 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2020 by nasty618

[SGT_Schultz]

4 hours ago, nasty618 said:

Ha. Lol?

 

I find it mind numbing how little people understand about the game.  Even at M and G levels. Oh well.  

 

 

 

 

This

[SGT_Schultz]

14 hours ago, DirkD said:

combined scores are what matters most

 

I read it on the internet, so it must be true.

[PatJones]

On 12/23/2020 at 10:05 AM, Sarge said:

Actually combined scores are pointless

They're kinda convenient when you're the only shooter in your division. Gotta measure progress somehow.

[Darrell]

I started shooting bowling pins with a 1911, move to 38 super, then when local matches became USPSA I shot my .45 with a comp. Over the years I eventually landed in Production. I tried Glock, M&P, XD, and eventually settled on CZ75 SP01 which got me to the nationals. I haven't shot a USPSA match in 3 years and only shoot local matches I sold all my open guns and since I carry a gun with an optic I started shooting local matches with an optic on a CZ TSO. I bought a P320 Legion and mounted an SRO and that got me thinking about getting back to shooting USPSA matches in CO division. I miss the comradery and my aging eyes need an optic so this may work out great for me. I find that I can shoot with my regular glasses in CO whereas I would need my prescription shooting glasses to shoot with iron sights and that has limitations when running and focusing.

[j1b]

On 12/23/2020 at 7:27 PM, nasty618 said:

Ha. Lol?

 

I find it mind numbing how little people understand about the game.  Even at M and G levels. Oh well.  

 

 

 

This is an interesting statement (to me). I do get it ... we all compete within our division. In my experience where I shoot most everyone understands that.

 

Paying attention to high overall though can make a difference. There is nothing inherently wrong with wanting to move up both in your division and on the high overall sheet. We have some solid shooters where I play this game and it is hardly rare that a production shooter wins the high overall (and by default high production). So for these shooters high overall is in fact important. If they don't win it, then they know that either someone else shot to their full potential or they did not. 

 

I always, and I mean always, rate my match on where I place in the overall match. For me it is absolutely the only score that I care about moving up in. With the equipment I shoot. 

 

Back when I was much better at this game I can state for fact that I shot limited guns against solid open shooters and my goal was to beat them. Despite the equipment differences. That's what drove me and that's what kept me looking for any and every potential to shave time or get more points. And at that time, it worked. That way when I was shooting a match like the limited nationals I was absolutely more prepared (though clearly never prepared enough). The caveat being this was back when limited was just coming on scene so there weren't as many limited shooters at all the club matches. So you had to push against the open guys and see what came happened.