Ammo Catching @ match

[stephen1776]

I mark all my ammo, so I just rack the slide and pick it up. I have seen some shooters almost muzzle themselves when ULASC. It just seems unnecessary .

[steel1212]

Yup it is absolutely unnecessary to muzzle yourself.

[Flexmoney]

I had a shooter muzzle me (RO) when he went to pick his ammo off the ground.

[Nimitz]

Which of course was his last action of the day, right?

[Nik Habicht]

A long time ago, a guy named Dave Stanford told me as an RO, you are responsible for ensuring that gun is clear. I do that every time I run a shooter and always will. Flip to yer hearts content, but I will always make sure the gun is clear, my way. And that means I have to see an empty chamber. Pretty simple, eh?

What he said works for me. I'm not a chest thumper about the flipping thing -- I don't think it's a bright idea, but the shooter is likely to bear the brunt of a detonation....

[Nik Habicht]

Again, if you really want to see an empty chamber, then email your AD or petition the BoD to make the range command

"If you are finished, unload, and show an empty chamber". ... "the chamber is clear, hammer down, holster."

Pretty simple, eh?

Also unnecessary -- I've already got a perfectly useable range command that lets me see the chamber -- and the ability to add any other appropriate commands to ensure safety on the stage. Know how I know this? I've taken multiple RO classes where the topic's discussed.....

[Nik Habicht]

...as an RO, you are responsible for ensuring that gun is clear...

So, if the hammer is dropped and the gun goes 'bang' the RO takes the DQ instead of the shooter?

After all, its his responsibility.

Flipping and showing clear are two completely different issues.

Nope. But the absence of a bang at hammer down doesn't guarantee that the chamber is empty -- though it's a decent indicator.....

[Chills1994]

Again, if you really want to see an empty chamber, then email your AD or petition the BoD to make the range command

"If you are finished, unload, and show an empty chamber". ... "the chamber is clear, hammer down, holster."

Pretty simple, eh?

Also unnecessary -- I've already got a perfectly useable range command that lets me see the chamber -- and the ability to add any other appropriate commands to ensure safety on the stage. Know how I know this? I've taken multiple RO classes where the topic's discussed.....

You do realize that at Level I matches the RO's aren't required to be certified, right?

So it doesn't help the other 99% of the USPSA'ers who didn't attend the same RO classes you did where it was discussed.

I've been around and around with you in numerous other rules discussions (the what is inside the box versus what is outside the box thread comes to mind). I just get this feeling if I told you the sky was blue, you'd come back with, "No it isn't! It is azure!"

[Nik Habicht]

Again, if you really want to see an empty chamber, then email your AD or petition the BoD to make the range command

"If you are finished, unload, and show an empty chamber". ... "the chamber is clear, hammer down, holster."

Pretty simple, eh?

Also unnecessary -- I've already got a perfectly useable range command that lets me see the chamber -- and the ability to add any other appropriate commands to ensure safety on the stage. Know how I know this? I've taken multiple RO classes where the topic's discussed.....

You do realize that at Level I matches the RO's aren't required to be certified, right?

So it doesn't help the other 99% of the USPSA'ers who didn't attend the same RO classes you did where it was discussed.

I've been around and around with you in numerous other rules discussions (the what is inside the box versus what is outside the box thread comes to mind). I just get this feeling if I told you the sky was blue, you'd come back with, "No it isn't! It is azure!"

I'm sorry -- you're arguing that we should dumb down to the lowest common denominator? Yep, we'll disagree......

I'd rather elevate toward highest potential.....

99% of USPSA'ers didn't attend RO classes? Didn't participate in discussion here? Haven't worked to tweak their understanding of the rules? I think your math might be a little off.......

[grapemeister]

I don't do it but when it's done the right way it looks pretty cool. Seems like, as a whole, the Europeans do it the best. Most of us Americans need a little more practice at looking more cool when doing it.....Flip and catch, that is.

Doesn't bother me in the slightest as an RO, as long as it's safely done. Maybe the RO should have the discretion in giving a penalty for a sloppy uncool flip and catch?

[Jasonub]

I used to catch the round between my teeth but when my lead levels went up I make sure I wear a shirt with a small breast pocket so when I rack the slide and let the live round fly, it's where I catch it to differentiate with other rack and catch shooters.

Haha just kidding

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[vluc]

Do a Benihanna style flip and catch on the crown of your hat. If you have to do it, entertain me.

[foxriver6]

Ugh.... Let me sit my purse down.

The real problem I see with flipping is situational awareness. Some shooters get a little loose when they flip and watch the round instead of the gun. I don't like having to lunge and dive to be able to see if the gun stays safe as in does not point at somebody else or the shooter does not sweep himself trying to catch a stray round. Yes, I will lunge or dive because I am supposed to be able to see the gun at all times. I am not of the opinion that flipping is hazardous because it may detonate a round. Getting it out of the chamber and off of the face of the slide quickly is safer than easing it out and rolling it over into your hand that is covering the port. NOW THAT MAKES ME CRINGE!

Flip if you like. Just know that I am watching for you to flub it. Also, in my experience all the flippers I have encountered have reopened the gun for me to look in after doing their magic trick. If they don't I'll ask them to show me clear before proceeding.

This! I am not reading any more, my head hurts!

[Chills1994]

Again, if you really want to see an empty chamber, then email your AD or petition the BoD to make the range command

"If you are finished, unload, and show an empty chamber". ... "the chamber is clear, hammer down, holster."

Pretty simple, eh?

Also unnecessary -- I've already got a perfectly useable range command that lets me see the chamber -- and the ability to add any other appropriate commands to ensure safety on the stage. Know how I know this? I've taken multiple RO classes where the topic's discussed.....

You do realize that at Level I matches the RO's aren't required to be certified, right?

So it doesn't help the other 99% of the USPSA'ers who didn't attend the same RO classes you did where it was discussed.

I've been around and around with you in numerous other rules discussions (the what is inside the box versus what is outside the box thread comes to mind). I just get this feeling if I told you the sky was blue, you'd come back with, "No it isn't! It is azure!"

I'm sorry -- you're arguing that we should dumb down to the lowest common denominator? Yep, we'll disagree......

I'd rather elevate toward highest potential.....

99% of USPSA'ers didn't attend RO classes? Didn't participate in discussion here? Haven't worked to tweak their understanding of the rules? I think your math might be a little off.......

I think your reading comprehension might be off. I said it doesn't help the other 99% of USPSA'ers who didn't attend the same RO classes you did.

[Stephen7942]

I rack it and let it hit the ground as I mark my cases... Sometimes the RO will catch it but otherwise it hits the deck...

[BulletWhisperer]

What ?!!! This super long thread and NO video ?!!

[steel1212]

What ?!!! This super long thread and NO video ?!!

Go to my YouTube....every stage.

[BillR1]

What ?!!! This super long thread and NO video ?!!

Go to my YouTube....every stage.

Watched a few...very smooth shooting and movement!

[Sarge]

What ?!!! This super long thread and NO video ?!!

Go to my YouTube....every stage.

Watched a few...very smooth shooting and movement!

Yes indeed. But oh my! That deadly flip and catch thing made my palms sweat!

[steel1212]

I'm a flippin ninja!!

[Inkman]

I rack it out and pick the rd up off the ground after holstering if it is right there and i can see it at a glance. Might lose a rd or two per match. Making sure i find/save every last rd not fired is not exactly a high priority at a match for me.

Al

[awfaxis]

Only been shooting USPSA since June. Never knew this was such a controversy. Before I did my first match, I wanted to make the whole process of "Load/Make Ready" and "Unload/Show Clear" process 2nd nature.

I developed a very specific set of movements when finishing a stage, engraved in muscle memory.

1. Point down-range, and rotate gun about 40 degrees LEFT, and show my finger on the frame.

2. Aim down, about 8-10 feet for ground POI, and pull back the slide from the serrations. Arms still fully extended.

3. Once round is ejected, continue to hold slide open for RO to see, pulling in the gun a bit for presentation.

4. Rotate to normal vertical orientation, extend arms again, and pull trigger when told to.

5. Holster slowly.

The M&P tends to let the round fall into the magazine well if you don't pull back smartly. One time, the extractor actually hung onto the round doing a slow movement that probably didn't go back far enough.

Anyway, after a few matches, I noticed the live cartridges would tend to hit me in the left shoulder. After a few matches, I noticed others catching rounds. The M&P's (I have 3) all throw live rounds the same, no movement / flipping required.

So now I catch. However, once caught, I go back and reopen the slide again until the RO can see and tell me to continue. Its now habit.

As I read the concern for ejector caused ignition, it got me thinking, as this was never on my radar. However, the characteristic of my Tupperware M&P's trajectory provides some margin for safety.

The ejection port is facing upward but also downrange during the slide-back process I've developed. The slide back speed is not any more vigorous than my LMR. (Too forceful an unload makes the round fly over my head).

I feel this is safe, but I'll start asking the RO's for their perspective. However, I will be wary to avoid having the ejection port facing anyone during load and unload.

[eric4069]

What ?!!! This super long thread and NO video ?!!

you can see this demostrated in the first episode of the TV show Breaking Bad

Eric

[ZackJones]

I feel this is safe, but I'll start asking the RO's for their perspective. However, I will be wary to avoid having the ejection port facing anyone during load and unload.

It's been a long time since I was an RO but when I was the whole catch thing wasn't done. The shooter would rack the slide and let the round fall to the ground or if the RO's hand was held out we'd rotate the pistol so that the round ejected into his/her hand. I don't really know why but seeing someone doing the catch just bugs me. Perhaps it's a jealousy thing as I can't do the catch with my revolver .

[Xhris]

I would rather pick the round up than flip and miss....

Are we really that worried about rounds hitting the ground and detonating? Seems like I see a LOT more rounds hit the ground while reloading mags. Someone is BSing with a friend, mag slips, round falls.. Isn't this equally as dangerous?