Why YOU don't shoot Heavy Metal?

[Alaskapopo]

Not a new topic, but instead of polluting other threads or dredging up an old one it seems like a good time to try and figure out why heavy metal is not well represented at major matches. Instead of lamenting the lack of participation, I would like to know why it is that at smaller local matches there seems to be no shortage of people who want to shoot heavy metal, but at major matches not so much. If you do not shoot heavy metal why? Do you have the gear to shoot it if you wanted to? Do you shoot it at smaller local matches but not at larger matches?

Thanks for your replies.

I sold my .308 Armalite AR10's. They were harder to keep running by far than the typical AR15, ammo cost (I reload) was way higher and overall they were not as much fun to shoot. I may get a Larue .308 someday and try it again.

pat

[Bryan 45]

I don't particularly care for a pump either, but I like my M1A so much I put up with the pump.

Thanks a lot, KURT!!!!

[J.Schmitt]

For me it would be the cost of replacing my handgun and rifle. No, I won't sell what I already have to get new stuff. Otherwise I would like to try HM.

Jay

[HRider]

Of all the matches that I have shot so far, I have either shot Tac iron or Heavy Metal. I enjoy both, and there is tough competition in either one. If the match requires two hits on paper, it does cost a little more to shoot the .308, but not a deal breaker to me. I shoot my favorite old singlestack Colt in either division, but will shoot my M1 Benelli in TI. I actually enjoy shooting the pump shotgun too though. If I can build an 8rd tube for my 97 Winchester, I might park the Nova for a while.

I can also claim to be one of the top 250 HM shooters in the Southeast

Hurley

[George]

I have always wanted to try it. My reasons for not trying it are in order:

- cost of new gear I would need (rifle, pistol and shotgun + their accessories).

- extra ammo cost

- variability of rules

With my existing gear working in 3 divisions already, it just doesn't make sense for me to add a whole new ballgame right now however much fun it might be

[Modoc]

Mine is a bit similar to the others

At the present, I am only able to get in one or two Multi-gun matches a year. Soooo, I am using my varmit rifle (WOA AR) and goose gun (Browning Gold 3-1/2") with my single stack. Yes, I need to get a mag extension for the goose gun, but I have other things that to me are a bit higher priority.

I would love an M1A and a Nova, but buying better Cowboy guns and SS pistol for the wife come first

She has no interest in Multi-gun (yet) but we shoot CAS twice a month with a couple Level II equivalent matches each year. Family shooting time is good .

Edited January 29, 2011 by Modoc

[GentlemanJim]

I just dont have enough guns ..all of mine have those open thingies

Jim

[MarkCO]

For me, I'm not a huge fan of shotgun, and shooting a pump would just frustrate me even more. I'm not a big fan of the .308/.30-06 only rules either. I have a AR-10, that I converted to .260. For me, it is more versatile and I use it in other things besides 3-gun.

So, IF I could shoot my SLP and AR-10 .260 along with my single stack 1911, I would probably shoot HM at a few matches every year. I shoot primarily for fun and the great people. HM would lower my shooting fun factor and does not change the people factor at all.

[EkuJustice]

Dont own a 308 rifle for the division and the ammo cost gets up there. Cant justify buying one for the couple matchs a year I might shoot

[Benelli Chick]

Considered it, but those guns are so heavy!!!

I was exhausted after about a half hour of practice.

The pistol is big and heavy.

The rifle is big and long and soooo heavy.

And the pump is fun, but the darn thing doesn't stay on target so good when I pump it!

I wanted to be top He-Man lady, but I'm too much of a wuss!

I guess size does matter!

[SinistralRifleman]

I wanted to be top He-Man lady, but I'm too much of a wuss!

I think the proper term would be She-Ra: Princess of Power for top lady in that division.

[Pro2AInPA]

I don't own a .308 rifle or a pump shotgun. Not worth it to me to buy them when TO and Open are plenty fun.

[Chills1994]

I don't have an M1A, AR10, FAL, PTR91, or a Saiga rifle in .308 (what did I leave out?) .

It would be cool if we could pester Montana Gold enough to make a .308 bullet...kinda like their .223 55 grain bullet.

It's kind of a catch-22 for me...for me to travel to these bigger matches and buy all these toys I need to work overtime. overtime happens on the weekends which is when the big matches are.

so it is like that chicken and the egg thing with the HM prize table not being big enough or good enough that it doesn't lure in enough or more HM shooters.

if I had a .308 rifle, sure I'd shoot HM just because I am stubborn and sometimes I like doing things the hardway.

[Vlad]

I don't shoot HM, because its hard, the prizes suck, the other competitors are lame, it costs too much??????, I can't decide which HM division to shoot in, and Pat Kelley keeps beating me!!!!!

WARNING THREAD DRIFT WARNING!!!!!!!!

The costs to much thing confuses me, how much difference is there between the ammo costs and the optic on your rifle????? the hi cap mags on your belt over SS mags, the benefit of really only NEEDING to shoot one round on a lot of paper for rifle and pistol?????

You are assuming I ALREADY own the gear. Semi-auto .308s are not anywhere near as common as AR-15's in people's closets. You can build a competitive AR for $1000 or less before the optics (lets assume irons for the sake number crunching) with a bare bones factory 308 AR starting at the price, before we talk about the costs of M1As. And then I have a unitasker gun because I don't really want a semi-auto .308 for anything else.

And sure ammo is not THAT expensive (well it is twice the price of .223, but whatever) if you only count matches, but if I'm going to lay down 1000-1500 on a gun I should probably practice with it too, no? Practice ammo far outnumbers match ammo and well, it is expensive.

So sure, let me run right our and spend $1500 on a rifle and $1000 on ammo so I can get ready for the next match where there are going to be 4 competitors in that division: me, 1 new guy who thought it would be cool, 1 guy who thinks this is going to be militia training for his 600 yard dream scenario come the revolution, and one HM specialist who will then complain that the the field is not wide enough and the prize table is too small.

I'll get right on that.

[Chuck Anderson]

I actually have all the gear, for all the different variations of the rules. I started getting set up with my G21 right about the time Superstition changed the rules so that my cheater G21 wouldn't be legal but the 3000.00 single stack would be. Even with all that, I have all the stuff to shoot Heavy Metal, Heavy Optics, He-Man, whatever. I enjoy shooting a pump shotgun, (870 is one of my favorite platforms) And I've even got a bunch of .308 stacked up on the garage. For me my reasons are a bit different. I don't shoot it at matches I have to travel to because I can't make the 50 pound weight limit for luggage with the heavier rifle. And I don't feel like paying an extra $100.00 bucks to the airlines. I did shoot Heavy Optics at the R&R NW Multi Gun last year and did ok despite forgetting to shoot a whole bank of targets. I'll probably shoot that division again at some point, it was fun.

I guess it comes down to two big reasons for me. First, I want to compete against the best. I'm not saying that Pat Kelley, Barry Dueck and a few others arent great shooters, but they don't go to every match and shooting against a field of maybe 10 guys just doesn't do much for me. I don't want to come home from the match, have guys ask me how I did and say, "Great, I came in 2nd! How many shooters...4"

The other reason is...well I'll just leave that one blank since this is a family friendly forum.

[mpeltier]

I shot he-man for a while, even did an area match in that division. I realized a couple things and went back to TO. number one was I HATE pump shotguns, as much as they hate me. And shooting head shots at 100yds with irons SUCKS. The ammo cost was more as well and could certainly be an issue for some. It may not be that much, match to match, but figure it all up for a year and throw in a bit of practice and it added up to more than enough differance to buy that new Swarovski...I still have the reciepts.

[Bryan 45]

It's not for everyone, and shouldn't be.

The same question could be asked about Tac Optics or Open- you would just get a lot less answers.

[djeffers]

I don't shoot Heavy Metal, because I DETEST pump shotguns!!

Back when He Man was instituted It was a .308 rifle, a 45 with 10 rounds, and a 12 gage shotgun...thats it no other constraints. I know cause I was one of the 4 guys that helped come up with it, With Eddie Rohdes being the main guy behind it.

I have all the stuff to shoot the division ( yes I own a Nova), and up untill some JERK changed the shotgun to pump only I shot it all the time....BTW...that "Jerk" was ME!! Everyone that activly shot that division wanted it to change to pump, and since they were the paying customer, I changed the rule...now I kick myself for doing it. After RM3G changed it everyone else followed suit and now look where we are!

I essentially have all the stuff to shoot it, but I have to admit I like the idea of Heavy Optic the best (as some rules let you use an auto SG). I haven't shot it becuase I am fairly new to the game and I haven't had enough time to put any rounds down range ......so I have been sticking with TO (and I need to put more rounds down range for that also!).

Edited January 29, 2011 by djeffers

[keno34]

I think cost is the biggest issue, then there is all that extra recoil

[StealthyBlagga]

I just built a nice LR-308 for HM Scope. I also have a single-stack 1911 .45 and a Remington 870 pump. I will probably shoot HMS at some point in 2011, but it won't be at a big match. Why ? Mostly ammo costs - I rarely shoot 7.62 or .45, so reloading for it is a hassle... I just run factory ammo, which gets expensive really quick when you get into a serious practice regime.

Gratuitous gun porn:

[steel1212]

Ammo cost? Na, the last batch of .308 I reloaded was running .40 cents each, thats only 40-60$ for a 100-150 round match. The .45 would be about the same as my .40 loads if I use moly/lead. I don't reload shotgun so its a wash. My DPMS with PMAGS has ran everything I've fed it and with an adjustable gas block and Titan its not bad at all to run and gun with.

Honeslty I think the reason more people don't shoot HM is because the matches save all the good stuff for the divisions with the most entries. You can't really blame them more people sign up for TO so they should have the bigger cut. Now put a M1A on the HM table, like it should be, and you might see more people move over.

I come from shooting SS so not a lot of participation is what I'm used to. Thats ok people are scared of what they don't know

[dcloudy777]

I'm seeing many good arguments for the idea I espoused awhile back, and sort of what Bryan is talking about in the other thread. Instead of having a small HM" division, (and a small prize table) allow "heavy" rifles or pistols into the mainstream division with a scoring advantage. This lets HM shooters configure their guns pretty much however they like, and gives them a larger field to play against while not putting them at a huge capacity/recoil disadvantage.

DanO

[spd522]

I have all the gear for HM in whatever configuration the rules say it is......pump/semi shotgun, irons/RDS/scope, Single Stack 8 rd or just Major cal 10 rd. I look more at the match and decide if I want to shoot it or not. I enjoy shooting it but some matches are designed where HM just isn't as much fun as other divisions. USPSA rules are usually not as fun in HM because of the required 2 hits on paper. Doubles up the ammo cost and carry load for both the rifle and pistol. But if the match scoring is 1 A/B, HM works fine for me.

If I don't shoot HM, I shoot Limited/Tac Irons. I have yet to shoot a match in Tac Optics although I may try it this year.

Craig

[DMAC]

I just bought a Salient Benelli, that's why I won't get into HM for a while. I really like shooting my JP LRP-07 and I shot this in Tac Optics at FB3G, just because I wanted to.

Once LaRue comes out with their 762 OBR PredatAR, I'll probably shoot this at a match or two in TacOptics as well.

Someday I'll have to put the time into learning to shoot my Nova pump. I'm working too much and raising two young children for now. It's all I can do to get to match.

I really don't care how things get classified, I'll shoot whatever I feel like needs some lead down the barrel.

[mike cyrwus]

I think its (TO) a bigger crowd to beat, not necessairily tougher. There are some damn good shooters in HM.

all five of them are pretty good.