jakfrost1 Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Hi all, first off I have pretty much got the 650 running as smoothly as is possible given the design flaws, ( minor...) that would seem to have been addressed in the latest crop of product from Dillon. My current issue isn't with the press itself but with my torn rotator cuff(s) that are making extended use difficult, if not downright painful. I have a couple of options: 1. Buy a motor system built for the 650 from a fellow reloader who is upgrading his system to a fully automated one with all the sensors. The system he is selling is strictly MANUAL, i.e. it requires diligent observation and a quick foot on the 'stop pedal' to prevent a minor/major problem from occurring. If I could mechanize the 're-sizing, de-priming' portion, using another, dedicated 650 with this motor system, I could then manually run the remaining functions thru the original 650, since the force required places much less strain on my shoulders, AND...interestingly, seems to provide a much smaller spread on the resulting OAL. OR 2. Sell my 650 and put the money ( and a bunch more! ), towards a full blown Mark 7 system. Option 1 is definitely the less expensive way to go, and I only need to reload between 12,00 and 14,000 rounds of 9mm a season. Really all I need is to eliminate the 're-size/de-cap' process. which brings me to option 3... 3. Buy commercially processed, once fired brass, for roughly $75.00/1000. This almost doubles the price of a round of minor 9mm over using range brass. Oh, and that price is the 'if you buy a minimum of 50,000 rounds' price. Given my current usage they would last me roughly 5 years...I'm 74 and who knows, maybe they would 'see me out', hahaha. Anyone have comments, suggestions? I haven't seen the 650 motor drive in action, the owner lives 3hrs away...it might be more trouble than its worth, dunno... Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Option 4 - Keep your 650 as is and ask your fellow shooters to come and help you reload. If you are only need 12K - 14K loaded that can easily be done in a weekend with a few buddies taking turns behind the press. You would spend a lot less in beer and pizza with this option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 I feel your pain - tore mine a couple of years ago. All good now thanks to a fantastic PT. I was lucky enough to snag an Ammobot before they got bought by Dillon and it was a godsend. Not sure when Dillon is going to start selling them but a 1050/1100 and the new Dillon Automation version would be my suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Automation puts a lot of stress on the machine. I know people do it but you couldn't pay me enough to automate my 650; just not robust enough. You need a 1050/1100 or the Mark 7 option whatever they are calling it; EVO or Apex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnipTheDog Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 2 hours ago, warpspeed said: I feel your pain - tore mine a couple of years ago. All good now thanks to a fantastic PT. I was lucky enough to snag an Ammobot before they got bought by Dillon and it was a godsend. Not sure when Dillon is going to start selling them but a 1050/1100 and the new Dillon Automation version would be my suggestion. Dillon is saying the automation is only for the 1100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Grandkids need to learn how to re-load don’t they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stick Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Keep it as is. If you can, learn how to operate the press with the other hand by standing along side the press. Reload what you need and keep the extra money for more components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakfrost1 Posted September 24, 2021 Author Share Posted September 24, 2021 Thanks all...PT is the reason I am still able to compete, however 'Strong Hand Only' is still a challenge, lol. Since the 'bring a friend' option is not really an option for me, living in a small rural area, and grandkids are even farther away, I guess I'll just continue doing what needs to be done in small batches, like 200rds max at a time for the 're-sizing' anyway. I can fill/finish the brass easily for much longer, just need to break down the hard part into smaller bites...sucks to get old, haha. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHI Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 (edited) Do you have a bullet feeder on your 650? Do you lube your cases? Edited September 24, 2021 by AHI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jejb Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Why not get the RC fixed? That's what I did (weak hand) a few years ago. Yeah, rehab is a pain and you won't be able to shoot with the impacted arm for a while, but it's worth it in the long run, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Youngeyes Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 1 hour ago, jakfrost1 said: 200rds max at a time for the 're-sizing' anyway Are you using lube? I found that my 650 resizes with ease when I use lube. I have a MBF and case feeder and can easily run the machine even with a sore shoulder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NETim Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 2 hours ago, Youngeyes said: Are you using lube? I found that my 650 resizes with ease when I use lube. I have a MBF and case feeder and can easily run the machine even with a sore shoulder. Spray on case lube works wonders IMHO. I'm not sure any one brand is better than the other. Regardless, using it does make a dramatic difference on both the up and down stroke effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 I’m one of those guys that preps my brass ahead of time. I spray it and de-cap, resize through a Lee APP then wet clean and dry. When it’s time to load it’s like using new brass and keeps the press clean, might be an option. Just have to remember to stay ahead of demand. I too have lately developed a shoulder problem and can sympathize with you. I can pull really good but pushing is, well, a pain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HesedTech Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 18 hours ago, jakfrost1 said: Buy a motor system built for the 650 from a fellow reloader who is upgrading his system to a fully automated one with all the sensors. The only reason to do this is because you got a smoking hot deal. The 650 is not a great automated press. I had a 650 set up with the Mark 7 and even though the M7 is a great system the press is not designed to be run that way. I had lots of broken plastic parts (index ring) and a kaboom because the primer set up is not the best. I recommend a 1100 with automation (I use an 1050/Ammobot but they are not available any more) or wait for Dillon's automation when it becomes available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigarmsp226 Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 To add to Hesed’s comments - the great news about the 1100 is you do not have to “push” to seat the primer - everything is done on the down stroke of the machine except for shell plate indexing and retraction of the tool head…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris13 Posted September 26, 2021 Share Posted September 26, 2021 (edited) I too have a tender shoulder, not in need of surgery, just old. My plan is to motorize my Dillon 650. Just got my Mr Bullet Feeder and will run that as I save up for motor drive. The full blown Mark 7 system is a bit pricey and would have to learn a new press if I would go that route. Just being realistic for me. I reload mostly in the winter, pulling the handle anywhere from 50 to 100 times a day, building up my bullet inventory. My shooting is less in the freezing weather, so my inventory gets filled up and ready for spring in no time. When I go fully motorized reloading, my routine might or might not change, I'll have to play that by ear. There is still time needed to sort, clean and inspect brass. Yes lube your brass. I'm sure there is plenty of good lube available, but I've been using the Hornady stuff and it's worked wonderful for me. Edited September 26, 2021 by Polaris13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boatdoc173 Posted September 26, 2021 Share Posted September 26, 2021 if you loved close by, I would offer to size cases for you. and since you do not have any other way to get help, I say, you only live once--get the Mark 7 apex. watch the videos and set it up with 4 stations like your 650. if that does not work due to the cost and set up time required, then buy the processed brass. sell off what you do not need. are you a member of a shooting club? perhaps other members might help you out by processing you brass on t heir machines or on yours? good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boatdoc173 Posted September 26, 2021 Share Posted September 26, 2021 On 9/24/2021 at 12:08 PM, NETim said: Spray on case lube works wonders IMHO. I'm not sure any one brand is better than the other. Regardless, using it does make a dramatic difference on both the up and down stroke effort. The hornady one shot( suggested by Brian Enow and many others) makes resizing cases MUCH easier. I am on board with that group. If it decreases your pain enough, you can shorten you load sessions a bit and keep on loading yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnnymazz Posted September 28, 2021 Share Posted September 28, 2021 On 9/23/2021 at 10:20 PM, jakfrost1 said: Hi all, first off I have pretty much got the 650 running as smoothly as is possible given the design flaws, ( minor...) that would seem to have been addressed in the latest crop of product from Dillon. My current issue isn't with the press itself but with my torn rotator cuff(s) that are making extended use difficult, if not downright painful. I have a couple of options: 1. Buy a motor system built for the 650 from a fellow reloader who is upgrading his system to a fully automated one with all the sensors. The system he is selling is strictly MANUAL, i.e. it requires diligent observation and a quick foot on the 'stop pedal' to prevent a minor/major problem from occurring. If I could mechanize the 're-sizing, de-priming' portion, using another, dedicated 650 with this motor system, I could then manually run the remaining functions thru the original 650, since the force required places much less strain on my shoulders, AND...interestingly, seems to provide a much smaller spread on the resulting OAL. OR 2. Sell my 650 and put the money ( and a bunch more! ), towards a full blown Mark 7 system. Option 1 is definitely the less expensive way to go, and I only need to reload between 12,00 and 14,000 rounds of 9mm a season. Really all I need is to eliminate the 're-size/de-cap' process. which brings me to option 3... 3. Buy commercially processed, once fired brass, for roughly $75.00/1000. This almost doubles the price of a round of minor 9mm over using range brass. Oh, and that price is the 'if you buy a minimum of 50,000 rounds' price. Given my current usage they would last me roughly 5 years...I'm 74 and who knows, maybe they would 'see me out', hahaha. Anyone have comments, suggestions? I haven't seen the 650 motor drive in action, the owner lives 3hrs away...it might be more trouble than its worth, dunno... Jim I was in the same boat. I shoot 18,000 rounds a year. My arm was getting tired pulling the handle. I bought a Cp2000 and RL1100 . Automated them . It all depends on how much you want to invest in equipment. To me its worth every penny since I enjoy reloading, past 32 years. Wish they had all this cool stuff back when I started. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakfrost1 Posted September 28, 2021 Author Share Posted September 28, 2021 WOW...lots of good info...thanks all. Here is where I'm at right now. I had been using a homemade formula for lubrication, pure Lanolin mixed with isopropyl alcohol...but it left a kind of sticky residue so I stopped a year or so ago. So...I drove a couple of hours to pick up 3 cans of the Hornady 'One Shot' and gave it a try. What a pleasant surprise. No residue and almost no effort to size the brass! So little in fact I dug out the original '8 Ball' actuating lever for the 650 and zip cut off the top 4"...rethreaded it and put a slight, ( 1.5") bend away from the press in the shaft, bolted it place and presto, 'Short Action 650'. So now I can resize with ease with a 30% shorter stroke, so less movement AND less effort. All good. However when ANY new Dillon presses are once again available without a '48 week' waiting period, I will get in line to try a newer press, probably a 1100... Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddc Posted September 28, 2021 Share Posted September 28, 2021 1 hour ago, jakfrost1 said: WOW...lots of good info...thanks all. Here is where I'm at right now. I had been using a homemade formula for lubrication, pure Lanolin mixed with isopropyl alcohol...but it left a kind of sticky residue so I stopped a year or so ago. So...I drove a couple of hours to pick up 3 cans of the Hornady 'One Shot' and gave it a try. What a pleasant surprise. No residue and almost no effort to size the brass! So little in fact I dug out the original '8 Ball' actuating lever for the 650 and zip cut off the top 4"...rethreaded it and put a slight, ( 1.5") bend away from the press in the shaft, bolted it place and presto, 'Short Action 650'. So now I can resize with ease with a 30% shorter stroke, so less movement AND less effort. All good. However when ANY new Dillon presses are once again available without a '48 week' waiting period, I will get in line to try a newer press, probably a 1100... Jim Waiting periods are way down compared to where they were. Especially if you already have some dies you can use order the option without dies for the caliber you mostly load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jejb Posted September 29, 2021 Share Posted September 29, 2021 13 hours ago, ddc said: Waiting periods are way down compared to where they were. Especially if you already have some dies you can use order the option without dies for the caliber you mostly load. Agreed. I actually found 3 - 1100's in stock at a store in the Mpls area recently (https://www.gunstop.com/). I bought the 9mm w/o dies 1100 they had in stock, along with a MBF, which was also in stock there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmer Posted October 2, 2021 Share Posted October 2, 2021 On 9/28/2021 at 2:38 PM, jakfrost1 said: WOW...lots of good info...thanks all. Here is where I'm at right now. I had been using a homemade formula for lubrication, pure Lanolin mixed with isopropyl alcohol...but it left a kind of sticky residue so I stopped a year or so ago. So...I drove a couple of hours to pick up 3 cans of the Hornady 'One Shot' and gave it a try. What a pleasant surprise. No residue and almost no effort to size the brass! So little in fact I dug out the original '8 Ball' actuating lever for the 650 and zip cut off the top 4"...rethreaded it and put a slight, ( 1.5") bend away from the press in the shaft, bolted it place and presto, 'Short Action 650'. So now I can resize with ease with a 30% shorter stroke, so less movement AND less effort. All good. However when ANY new Dillon presses are once again available without a '48 week' waiting period, I will get in line to try a newer press, probably a 1100... Jim Glad to hear ya got her going! Have to do what you can to enjoy the hobby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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