Top Shot Episode 4

[Shibby]

Could someone explain the logic behind Iain's elimination round scheme? I'm dotting the I's (missing the point) on this.

Why jeopardize one of the best shooters on the team sending him/her to the elimination round. I mean... it wasn't like Jim was really far behind, anything could've happened. I would've sent Jim against Tara, the two poorest team challenge performers.

I'm just saying...

He wanted to send Jim home, and I don't think he trusted anyone else to do it.

Edited June 28, 2010 by Shibby

[Nemo]

He wanted to send Jim home, and I don't think he trusted anyone else to do it.

I'm glad it worked out for him. Could've backfired, though.

[DocMedic]

I'm not impressed with the abbreviated amount of shooting that gets done.

More action!

Last night there was a show on afterwards that covers the M16/AR15 platform. Getting together and doing that for each main weapon featured on the shown would be an awesome "history" tie in.

Yea, I specifically loved when the expert was explaining the 5.56 Armor pen rounds. how they were designed to "Shoot through a tank."...

[duramaxtech]

In my dictionary, its not a "miss" if you hit what you are aiming at

at first it looked as if you where trying to define what "is" is Edited June 28, 2010 by duramaxtech

[mdschappell]

I thought the swinging targets at the elimination were really cool, especially with no shoots swinging in front of the shoot targets. I didn't get to really look at it with the way it was presented on the show, and I wonder if there was a pattern or sequence to it or if it looked like a random "mess" swinging back and forth. I would like to see something like this at a USPSA match, I think it would be pretty challenging.

[Smithars]

I thought the swinging targets at the elimination were really cool, especially with no shoots swinging in front of the shoot targets. I didn't get to really look at it with the way it was presented on the show, and I wonder if there was a pattern or sequence to it or if it looked like a random "mess" swinging back and forth. I would like to see something like this at a USPSA match, I think it would be pretty challenging.

I'd kind of like to know how the targets were started and if any of the arms swung at a different speed. It looked to me like two of the plates for Jim, the red/blue combo that he hit, were swinging together at the same speed. It didn't look Jim would have had a chance to shoot it clean as the blue plate would have stayed behind the red..

Maybe that was just stock footage set up to show us the shot though.

[murkish]

I could see that Jim was toast in the elimination round before he fired a shot. When his plates started swinging, a red plate was swinging in perfect unison with a blue plate with the red in front. It was impossible for him to shoot all four red plates without popping that blue one. Bad luck, but a bad target design really. He did not shoot the same challenge that Iain did, due to bad luck.

Jack

[GentlemanJim]

I feel the blue team met the elemination with a little more honor than the red team did.

The red team seems more fueled by ego and petty diferences.

Most of the more mature shooters I know would treat a youngster with a little more courtesy, and behave more like actual adults.

I know Drama makes good TV, but these people do represent shooters in general.

I Tip my hat to those who are showing true character

Jim

[Audifn]

anyone found episode 4 online yet?

[clown]

I thought the swinging targets at the elimination were really cool, especially with no shoots swinging in front of the shoot targets. I didn't get to really look at it with the way it was presented on the show, and I wonder if there was a pattern or sequence to it or if it looked like a random "mess" swinging back and forth. I would like to see something like this at a USPSA match, I think it would be pretty challenging.

I'd kind of like to know how the targets were started and if any of the arms swung at a different speed. It looked to me like two of the plates for Jim, the red/blue combo that he hit, were swinging together at the same speed. It didn't look Jim would have had a chance to shoot it clean as the blue plate would have stayed behind the red..

Maybe that was just stock footage set up to show us the shot though.

I could see that Jim was toast in the elimination round before he fired a shot. When his plates started swinging, a red plate was swinging in perfect unison with a blue plate with the red in front. It was impossible for him to shoot all four red plates without popping that blue one. Bad luck, but a bad target design really. He did not shoot the same challenge that Iain did, due to bad luck.

Jack

I felt the same way. From the viewers point of view, Jim was screwed by equipment failure. I was screaming for a re-shoot.

[jar]

I think there's a simple fix to the sitting out issue that would help. Instead of not being allowed to sit twice in a row, everyone should have to sit out once before any repeats.

[spanky]

I think there's a simple fix to the sitting out issue that would help. Instead of not being allowed to sit twice in a row, everyone should have to sit out once before any repeats.

I like that.

[kevin c]

I thought the swinging targets at the elimination were really cool, especially with no shoots swinging in front of the shoot targets. I didn't get to really look at it with the way it was presented on the show, and I wonder if there was a pattern or sequence to it or if it looked like a random "mess" swinging back and forth. I would like to see something like this at a USPSA match, I think it would be pretty challenging.

I'd kind of like to know how the targets were started and if any of the arms swung at a different speed. It looked to me like two of the plates for Jim, the red/blue combo that he hit, were swinging together at the same speed. It didn't look Jim would have had a chance to shoot it clean as the blue plate would have stayed behind the red..

Maybe that was just stock footage set up to show us the shot though.

I could see that Jim was toast in the elimination round before he fired a shot. When his plates started swinging, a red plate was swinging in perfect unison with a blue plate with the red in front. It was impossible for him to shoot all four red plates without popping that blue one. Bad luck, but a bad target design really. He did not shoot the same challenge that Iain did, due to bad luck.

Jack

I felt the same way. From the viewers point of view, Jim was screwed by equipment failure. I was screaming for a re-shoot.

Yeah, I'd like to see the segment again to confirm that was really Jim's run where the two targets swung together. If so, Iain didn't beat him, and Jim didn't beat himself. If the producers let the outcome stand, it is a crying shame. It'd also show the risk Iain was taking. It would have come down essentially to a 50/50 coin toss: who got the bad target setup, which I'm sure Iain and the rest of the Blue Team would not want to subject themselves to. Or, in case of a tie, another unknown random element might determine the outcome.

Iain may come across and may be a bad*ss, but, given the random element that seems too prominent in just about all the challenges, he wasn't being too bright either, putting himself at unnecessary risk. He was trusting his skill (and it's apparent that he has a lot) to guarantee a win in the elimination, but that's not what always determines the challenge outcomes.

[Sgtsvi]

I would like to see the teams pick who sits out by using another shooting challenge like a bullseye shoot and the two farthest from center have to go to the elimination challenge. I get tired of seeing JJ and Blake sit out on anything that uses firearms. I do like the fact that we finally have a television show that focuses on positive use of firearms instead of having a bunch of inbreads with realtree camo shirts shooting at beer cans they just emptied.

[Glockcomma]

I shot a carbine match with Iain yesterday, he invited us to a viewing party at a sports bar last night I had people stop by unexpectedly and couldn't make it. He was going to be the color commentator I think it would have been fun sorry I missed it.

Tim

[Mbauer67]

I believe Iain made a pretty bold statement with his performance at the challenge, something to the effect of, "I am confident in my abilities, and I am in this competition to win it." and he is willing to take some risks to acheive his goal. His show of skill might also mess with the mental confidence of his teammates/future competition.

But, in my opinion it is to early in the competition to be taking such bold risks. Look at the guys like Andre, being pulled along by his teammates but staying in the shadows enough so as not to be placed in a challenge.

My bet is it will come down to JJ, Blake, Iain, the girl, and maybe one red player like Denny towards the top 5.

[Ahab]

One thing to point out is that each swinging plate was on a four inch wide steel backer. If you shot the plate dead center, the bullet wouldn't have passed through to hit another plate like it did to Jim. But an edge hit would allow the bullet to keep moving. While it was a difficult shot, it was certainly a shot that can be made.

[sslav]

I think there's a simple fix to the sitting out issue that would help. Instead of not being allowed to sit twice in a row, everyone should have to sit out once before any repeats.

I think that would not achieve what they are trying to achieve. This way, the more unbalanced the teams become the higher the number of better shooters sitting out becomes - giving the team that is outnumbered a chance to catch up.

[kevin c]

One thing to point out is that each swinging plate was on a four inch wide steel backer. If you shot the plate dead center, the bullet wouldn't have passed through to hit another plate like it did to Jim. But an edge hit would allow the bullet to keep moving. While it was a difficult shot, it was certainly a shot that can be made.

Was that something pointed out at the time? If so, then more power to Iain, especially since that backer isn't visible from behind the plate, and the plate has no distinguishing marks showing where the backer was, and also, if I'm remembering correctly, is diamond shaped, so that a shot off the dead center of the plate by some given distance would hit the backer if near one of the four points, but would pass through if it hit near the flats. That's a very fine shot to make.

If that back target was swinging completely in sync with the one in front, I'm not sure Jim knew there was one there. Much easier to track the cross swing of targets that appear/disappear in front of/behind each other.

Perhaps I'm too used to sports where any shot landing in the maximum scoring area is good enough. A hit on any clay bird, on any part of the A zone of an IPSC target or down zero circle of an IDPA target gets you the maximum points. More pertinent to the show, any part of the plates in the challenge similarly got you the points. The finer points of shoot throughs on backers onto penalty targets, neither of which I can see, are beyond me, both understanding and, frankly, shooting wise.

Edited June 29, 2010 by kevin c

[Carmoney]

I'm enjoying watching the show, but can't help thinking that I'm seeing some really mediocre shooting overall, sprinkled with only a few moments of brilliance.

I realize we haven't seen much from Blake and J.J. and a couple others yet, but seriously.....this is all the better they could do, in terms of casting this thing?

I can think of several truly excellent all-around shooters, guys who can shoot anything well and have proven their ability to quickly master a strange gun, and none of them are on the show!

Ah well.....like I said, I'm enjoying it, and I do think it's good for the game.

[Sarge]

Andre hasn't done much of anything so far in the show. He's gonna have to show some skills real soon, or face elimination.

And he is friggin' Army, no less!!! Send the squinting, one eye only shooter packing. How does somebody in the Army shoot so poorly with an AR-15? UGHH!!

[sperman]

Was it just me, or did the producers make it obvious before the end of the first practice that the blue team would lose and Jim would be in the elimination round?

[Flexmoney]

Flex - yeah I guess then I missed my exact target... but only by a LITTLE instead of A LOT.

Just teasin'ya.

[Sarge]

Was it just me, or did the producers make it obvious before the end of the first practice that the blue team would lose and Jim would be in the elimination round?

No its not just you.

[sfinney]

Heck, I think I you could tell just from the previews of Episode 5 that the Blue Team may lose again, and lots of drama on who goes to the Elimination Round this time.

They aren't being very subtle