Apex 10 and other Mark 7 goodies

[Cuz]

Sorry to hear you all are having such problems.  I went the RL1100 route, and don’t regret it, but that doesn’t mean it was trouble free. 
 

Maybe we are all of the wrong frame of mind to think that after spending so much for the press it should work flawlessly. 
 

Does anyone on this forum know anybody that bought a Mark 7, or RL1050/1100 and took it out of the box and had it run perfectly?

 

It seems we all go through the “dialing in” or troubleshooting period where we tweak, adjust, or even replace/upgrade some parts before the press is up and running. And even then, when it’s working, as soon as someone mentions a new doohickey we immediately start considering whether or not to add it to our press. 
 

Mine is finally running fine (manually), but I seem to want to replace my shell plate with an aftermarket and I don’t even know why. It never ends. 
 

Hopefully, you guys will get things worked out and Lyman/Mark 7 support will be responsive and helpful. I’m watching this thread because I’m sure there will be a Mark 7 press in my future, just not sure when. 

[Posvar]

44 minutes ago, Cuz said:

Sorry to hear you all are having such problems.  I went the RL1100 route, and don’t regret it, but that doesn’t mean it was trouble free. 
 

Maybe we are all of the wrong frame of mind to think that after spending so much for the press it should work flawlessly. 
 

Does anyone on this forum know anybody that bought a Mark 7, or RL1050/1100 and took it out of the box and had it run perfectly?

 

It seems we all go through the “dialing in” or troubleshooting period where we tweak, adjust, or even replace/upgrade some parts before the press is up and running. And even then, when it’s working, as soon as someone mentions a new doohickey we immediately start considering whether or not to add it to our press. 
 

Mine is finally running fine (manually), but I seem to want to replace my shell plate with an aftermarket and I don’t even know why. It never ends. 
 

Hopefully, you guys will get things worked out and Lyman/Mark 7 support will be responsive and helpful. I’m watching this thread because I’m sure there will be a Mark 7 press in my future, just not sure when. 

I am exactly in the same boat as you. Cancelled my Apex order and got an 1100 in 9mm. Set it up and added a light kit and better loaded bullet bin support and it’s amazing. Took a couple hours to tweak and tune and now I’m jamming out 9mm Major like there is no tomorrow. A Mark 7 will someday end up on my bench most likely but for now I’m very pleased. 

[EricBu]

Odd question I've been wondering about.   Will Dillon pickup tubes and the Dillon RF100 work to fill the primer tube on a Apex 10?

[d3ydx3]

Just now, EricBu said:

Odd question I've been wondering about.   Will Dillon pickup tubes and the Dillon RF100 work to fill the primer tube on a Apex 10?

 

Dillon pickup tubes definitely work. I'm not using the RF100, but I use the Dillon pickup tubes and the primers drop fine into the Apex 10 primer feeding tube. I actually prefer the Dillon tubes to the Mark 7 ones, as the Mark 7 ones seem stiff with no plastic and don't pick up the primers as well as the Dillon tubes with the plastic tips.

[Posvar]

10 minutes ago, EricBu said:

Odd question I've been wondering about.   Will Dillon pickup tubes and the Dillon RF100 work to fill the primer tube on a Apex 10?

Yes 

[tenx100s]

Update on the Apex10 saga. If you have been reading this thread you know that I have been pretty frustrated by some little issues and a major one, namely the primer feeding. Here is what I have learned. I do not know why but adjustments you make with the tool head off do not seem to remain the same when the tool head is installed. Also, I have made my adjustments without modification to any factory supplied components. Discussion of that will come later if necessary. Another thing, my bench is pretty rigid and so should yours be. If you are bouncing things around on the bench when operating the handle you could be bouncing the primer after it leaves the security of the shuttle. Remember it is sitting on top of the punch for a short unsupported travel before it begins to locate and seat into the primer pocket of the brass. Having said that now to the adjustments.

First, the shell plate has to be snug and timed correctly. The manual gives instructions on how to accomplish that. 

Second, The primer punch resting position must be flush or slightly below the surface of the primer punch bushing. I used a depth micrometer to set mine .001-.002 below the surface so a primer can transition onto the punch in both directions without "snagging" on either edge of the punch or punch bushing. If you allow the punch to rest "proud" of the bushing you have a sharp tangent edge for the primer to snag on even though there is a small radius on the bottom of the primer. If you keep the punch rest position no deeper that a couple of thousandths below the bushing the radius on the primer will meet a concentric edge and is less likely to snag. Theoretically, the depth could be almost half of the primer cup radius but why test fate?

Third, the shuttle position is critical particularly when picking up the next primer. The manual suggests loading only 5-10 primers while proving primer pick up but I suggest that you lower the handle and drop ONE primer down the installed tube. That will position a single primer without any additional weight directly on the top of the shuttle so when you raise the handle that primer should drop into position on the shuttle. You can see that when you lower the handle and seeing the primer in the slot on the shuttle. If not present then adjust the setscrew that stops the shuttle travel a very small amount and recycle the handle. Continue until a single primer will drop into the slot on the shuttle. If you started this procedure with the slot centered as well as you can see or slightly early (left) of center you will be able to sneak up on this. A single primer without the primer back up rod in place should load every time.

Fourth, You're not out of the woods yet. Now you want to adjust the primer delivery position over the primer punch as centered as you can get it. The engineers at Mark7 have put a locating punch in place to correct the final position prior to seating the primer but don't expect that to correct serious misalignments. Remember that primer is just sitting there on top of the punch with a small gap before it begins seating into the primer pocket. I have not tried to determine if that timing would allow a primer to bounce or slide off center. A side note here: the shuttle in the priming position can vary on my press with how rigorous the handle is operated so while setting it up I move the handle at a steady speed approximating what I will be doing while loading. You want to adjust the shuttle in the priming position just until it contacts the spring plunger on the adjusting set screw. If you set it so it rotates too far that set screw will not have enough tension to reliably reposition the shuttle correctly.

Finally, On my machine the primer back up rod is too short (when used with the alarm) to ensure it makes contact with the last primer in the tube as the shuttle rotates to pick it up. The non-concentric radius on the primer slot of the shuttle may or may not be enough for a primer to hang up rather than dropping cleanly. I have not proven that one way of the other but if you have already made sure that a single primer drops cleanly and you have the primer backup rod adjusted to maintain contact with that last primer until it drops into the slot on the shuttle you should be good to go.

 

After all this fussing around and seeing my previous posts it is appropriate to ask why did I go through all of this. Better yet would be to ask if I am keeping the press. YES, I am keeping the press. Some forum postings have complained about how slow tech support is at Mark7 and how superb they are at Dillon. I don't know about Dillon support but the Mark7 people have reached out to me on several occasions, even when I voiced my frustration, proving they want to build a satisfied customer base. I have no experience with Dillon tech support and only operated a 1050 for about ten rounds. I originally chose the Mark7 for its feature rich and robust design. I'm keeping it because it is one beautiful and smooth machine. There are NO moving zinc (pot) metal casting components to wear out on the Mark7. Who else can say that?

One forum poster suggested that maybe it is the BMW of reloading presses. I've owned two BMW motorcycles and he has that right.

[SJBriggs]

So, is it safe to say that your Apex 10 is running well? How many rounds are you able to load without any issues?

[tenx100s]

On 11/12/2021 at 10:50 AM, EricBu said:

Odd question I've been wondering about.   Will Dillon pickup tubes and the Dillon RF100 work to fill the primer tube on a Apex 10?

I took an old LEE primer tray from a broken tool and modified it to hold a Hornady primer pick up tube so I could just shake or tap primers into it. Now I just place the end of the tray / tube assembly over the primer tube on the Apex10 and load primers into it. This would work with just any tray and tube combination.

[tenx100s]

30 minutes ago, SJBriggs said:

So, is it safe to say that your Apex 10 is running well? How many rounds are you able to load without any issues?

Starting from scratch I reassembled the press this weekend according to the information I posted and have been loading small batches of 5 rounds. It's a pain but I was getting most of my primer misfeeds at the end of the primer stack so this is how I'm testing it out. Getting the primer punch flush or below the bushing and the shuttle to center up at its pick up position seemed to solve the problems at least until it got down to the last two of three primers. Getting one primer to drop cleanly and having a primer backup rod long enough looks like it has cured the "Last three misfeed syndrome." I think I've done 5 or six batches without a glitch. That would "interpolate" to 500. I'll run another half dozen or so batches of five tomorrow followed by a batch of 50. If there are any issues I'll let you know.

 

I expect to be able to load 100% without primer feed issues. The primer manufacturers produce primers to some pretty tight tolerances which should make this process predictable.

 

I mentioned earlier that years ago I started depriming my brass and then cleaning in a wash tumbler with pins. That keeps so much debris out of the press. It you run a Hornady Ammo Plant or other press that has a straight line primer shuttle that dead ends in its prime position that debris can be a pain. The Hornady was easier to clean even if it failed than the Apex is so I will continue the habit and raise my production expectations.

[SJBriggs]

1 hour ago, tenx100s said:

Starting from scratch I reassembled the press this weekend according to the information I posted and have been loading small batches of 5 rounds. It's a pain but I was getting most of my primer misfeeds at the end of the primer stack so this is how I'm testing it out. Getting the primer punch flush or below the bushing and the shuttle to center up at its pick up position seemed to solve the problems at least until it got down to the last two of three primers. Getting one primer to drop cleanly and having a primer backup rod long enough looks like it has cured the "Last three misfeed syndrome." I think I've done 5 or six batches without a glitch. That would "interpolate" to 500. I'll run another half dozen or so batches of five tomorrow followed by a batch of 50. If there are any issues I'll let you know.

 

I expect to be able to load 100% without primer feed issues. The primer manufacturers produce primers to some pretty tight tolerances which should make this process predictable.

 

I mentioned earlier that years ago I started depriming my brass and then cleaning in a wash tumbler with pins. That keeps so much debris out of the press. It you run a Hornady Ammo Plant or other press that has a straight line primer shuttle that dead ends in its prime position that debris can be a pain. The Hornady was easier to clean even if it failed than the Apex is so I will continue the habit and raise my production expectations.

I process my brass the same way. Now that I started de-priming my brass, then wet tumbling, I get ZERO high primers. Add a Rollsizer to the mix, and things really run smooth.

 

Thanks for the detailed write up. After seeing an Apex 10 in person, I've been eye balling one pretty hard, but I'm hesitant due to the priming issues. It took a few months, but after getting my XL750 dialed in, I have pretty much no issues and can run thousands of rounds without any hang ups. I don't mind tinkering with the Apex as long as there is a fix for the initial set-up problems. If I can't get it to run as reliably as my 750, then I may have to reconsider.

[tenx100s]

Guys and Gals

I promised another update after the adjustments so here it is. I loaded 5 primers and brass at a time and ran the press dry with the primer backup rod in place a total of nine times. Then I tried to make it fail by running 5 primers and brass w/o the backup rod in place and again it cycled each one w/o error. Finally I loaded 50 primers and ran the press dry again w/o error. This only totals 100 rounds but when you consider that I was mostly concerned with that last 5 rounds this would be the same as if I had run 1000 rounds w/o any errors.

Besides running 5 rounds w/o the backup rod in place I also tried to vary the speed at which I operated from slow to as fast as I could hand place bullets.

I am so pleased that I think it is time to order a Mr Bulletfeeder.

 

Good Loading!

[XrayDoc88]

Has everyone else been able to solve their priming problems with this new press?  I want one, but don't think the priming process should be so sensitive that it fails frequently.  I wish Mark 7 would just scrap this priming system and redesign.

[Lefteye123]

I just picked up a used Apex10 with autodrive and primer express.  After some cleaning and following all the setup directions I got the system to work very well.  I don't run it fast (1500).  Seems to work well.  Like all new things it takes some fiddling.  Tech support was great and helped me get it straightened out

 

[cool]

The priming system of the EVO is of better quality than on the APEX.,

[erwos]

On 1/11/2022 at 12:33 AM, XrayDoc88 said:

Has everyone else been able to solve their priming problems with this new press?  I want one, but don't think the priming process should be so sensitive that it fails frequently.  I wish Mark 7 would just scrap this priming system and redesign.

 

I swapped from the Evo to the Apex priming system (so I could install a Primer Xpress), so I have some experience here.

 

The Evo system is simpler and has less fiddly bits to mess up. The Apex system isn't THAT bad, but you need to spend the time up front really lining things up to prevent problems later on. But once it works... it works. I spent about half an hour fiddling with those little threaded rods to get it just right.

[clw42]

Can you use the same shell plate for 9mm and 223 with the Apex?

[RGA]

9mm cases don't fit nicely in my 223 shell plate (Evo). The slot are a liitle too tight.

[clw42]

On 1/29/2022 at 2:19 AM, RGA said:

9mm cases don't fit nicely in my 223 shell plate (Evo). The slot are a liitle too tight.

 

Thanks

[clw42]

On 1/25/2022 at 12:11 PM, erwos said:

 

I swapped from the Evo to the Apex priming system (so I could install a Primer Xpress), so I have some experience here.

 

The Evo system is simpler and has less fiddly bits to mess up. The Apex system isn't THAT bad, but you need to spend the time up front really lining things up to prevent problems later on. But once it works... it works. I spent about half an hour fiddling with those little threaded rods to get it just right.

 

 

Any issues since the change?

[erwos]

22 hours ago, clw42 said:

 

 

Any issues since the change?

Nope.

[Kahuku]

Buyer beware! I bought a Mark 7 evolution September 2020 and I’m still not up and running. My personal experience is that the product is a POS and the business model sucks!

[ima45dv8]

2 hours ago, Kahuku said:

Buyer beware! I bought a Mark 7 evolution September 2020 and I’m still not up and running. My personal experience is that the product is a POS and the business model sucks!

I like fixing things. 

I'll give you $800 for it if you'll split the shipping.

[slavex]

13 hours ago, Kahuku said:

Buyer beware! I bought a Mark 7 evolution September 2020 and I’m still not up and running. My personal experience is that the product is a POS and the business model sucks!

what issues are you having? 

[XrayDoc88]

Are there any other owners of the Apex 10 out there that have truly solved the priming issues?  I want to be able to reload several hundreds of rounds without a primer jamming the system.

[ddc]

3 hours ago, XrayDoc88 said:

Are there any other owners of the Apex 10 out there that have truly solved the priming issues?  I want to be able to reload several hundreds of rounds without a primer jamming the system.

 

I think you are setting the bar way too low by at least one order of magnitude.