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Pistol Caliber Carbine. (PCC)


DocMedic

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The provisional rules we've seen so far say it has to be shoulder fired. I don't think anyone wants to volunteer to be the test case for the first prosecution of a pistol being fired as a rifle, or whatever ATFE is calling it. Cheeking it won't be allowed by rule.

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opinions on bracing off the cheek with a sig brace??

Looks shoulder fired to me. Even if it wasnt touching the shoulder. The ATF has ruled that the SIG brace is legal if used as intended. Meaning stick your arm through brace and use it as intended. "Cheeking" an arm brace is not using it as intended. Pony up your $200 if you want a SBR.

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The ATF has ruled it is illegal to get an AR pistol and put a SIG brace on it to by pass the NFA laws. How a firearm is used doesn't change the legal status of a firearm. It doesn't change anything if you take a glock and shoulder it or take a rifle and shoot it with one hand not shouldered. In the most recent SIG brace letter the author writing the ATF clearly states he wants to get a SIG brace to shoulder as a stock which is illegal. In a previous letter a police agency asked about the legality of someone shouldering a SIG brace(which is legal as long as you don't intend to by pass the NFA).

In the provisional rules it clearly states a sig brace is not allowed.

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The ATF has ruled it is illegal to get an AR pistol and put a SIG brace on it to by pass the NFA laws. How a firearm is used doesn't change the legal status of a firearm. It doesn't change anything if you take a glock and shoulder it or take a rifle and shoot it with one hand not shouldered. In the most recent SIG brace letter the author writing the ATF clearly states he wants to get a SIG brace to shoulder as a stock which is illegal. In a previous letter a police agency asked about the legality of someone shouldering a SIG brace(which is legal as long as you don't intend to by pass the NFA).

In the provisional rules it clearly states a sig brace is not allowed.

Actually what the latest ruling says is if you shoulder the gun you commit a felony if you don't you aren't. So yes BATFE latest ruling does in essence say how you shoot a firearm chances it legal status. Sucks but that is what they said.You can cheek it all you want so long as you don't touch the shoulder but I don't want them in a match because people will shoulder them.

Pat

Edited by Alaskapopo
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Not saying that is or isn't the law, but if how you hold a firearm determines the legality, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

Common sense is lacking in the atf world if you haven't already noticed

True, it doesn't have to make sense, this IS the gov't we're talking about!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Is anyone running PCC in their USPSA matches yet?

Can we legally do so?

our club ran pcc on saturday. several guys showed up for it.

oddly, in a 9 stage match, we had zero uprange starts, zero SHO/WHO, and lots of 20 yard mini poppers and partials. :devil:

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So, the match was set up at the MD's discretion, pretty much like all L1 matches?

With the exception of the occasional Classifier (SHO/WHO, Uprange Starts) and not having as many tough shots it sounds like one our local matches.

Was this a 9-stage LOCAL? If so, wow!

Edited by Beastly
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9 stages and not a single uprange start, zero SHO/WHO & a lot of 20 yd mini poppers & partials?

With an actual data point being provided here it looks like all the predictions of stage design being affected by PCC is actually starting to come true .... :)

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Is anyone running PCC in their USPSA matches yet?

Can we legally do so?

our club ran pcc on saturday. several guys showed up for it.

oddly, in a 9 stage match, we had zero uprange starts, zero SHO/WHO, and lots of 20 yard mini poppers and partials. :devil:

Is what you describe a normal or abnormal situation? Have there been other months that duplicated this match?

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9 stages and not a single uprange start, zero SHO/WHO & a lot of 20 yd mini poppers & partials?

With an actual data point being provided here it looks like all the predictions of stage design being affected by PCC is actually starting to come true .... :)

or possibly i'm just stirring up shiznit, but the MD did shoot PCC. :devil:

to be honest tho, this match was setup as 2 matches over 2 days, limited, open and pcc on saturday, L10, SS and prod on sunday, same exact stages. Many different volunteer stage designers, only a couple of whom shot PCC, so i would probably not use this is a data point for anything except getting people riled up online.

fwiw tho, this is a really really fun match format, and a valuable learning experience too, to be able to shoot the same stages with different equipment.

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Moto is also stirring the honeypot in addition to his chilli fixin's.

9 stages back-to-back Hi-cap / Lo-cap level 1 match is not normal for us, but something the club started doing last year and this was our second offering. 9 stages, low 200 rnd count. Day 1: match only recognizes the hi-cap divisions. Day 2: match only recognizes the lo-cap divisions. Idea is to bump up the competitive heat by attracting only those divisions on each day, plus what's not to like about 1 setup, 2 matches, 1 tear-down?

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UZI-Pro-121-400x267.jpg

opinions on bracing off the cheek with a sig brace??

Looks shoulder fired to me. Even if it wasnt touching the shoulder. The ATF has ruled that the SIG brace is legal if used as intended. Meaning stick your arm through brace and use it as intended. "Cheeking" an arm brace is not using it as intended. Pony up your $200 if you want a SBR.

if he got a thordsencustoms and did that he would be perfectly fine

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