DocMedic Posted January 26, 2016 Author Share Posted January 26, 2016 As a certified RO am I expected to learn another rulebook for the 4 people that want to run PCC's at at the Regular Handgun Match? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Nukem Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 When do we find out if this will become a division? Provisional or otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 I shared all the results I have. I noticed, that is all. Note that I am not talking about their shooting scores, but simply how long it takes to run the shooter, from make ready to range is clear. bagging and unbagging takes time, as does chasing down magazines that are generally not on the belt. And to be fair, i am talking about rimfire rifles. We have had exactly zero shooters show up with PCC's. Can't you just unbag in the safe area, walk muzzle up to the start position, and wait until told to make ready while everyone is scoring the last shooter? Then after ULSC walk muzzle up to the safe area and bag the rifle while others begin scoring? This is what we've done at the rifle matches I've attended and it seems pretty efficient. not under uspsa handgun rules. I suppose if you have a safe table in each bay and could adjust the rules, it's a reasonable solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctay Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 How many folks who don't support PCC would support it if it was run as a separate match? I know I'd be a lot more likely to support the idea then ... 100% support from me. I think it would be fun and I think it would bring more people into the game. I'm not sold that it can be run alongside a pistol match but I have an open mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_striker Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 (edited) As a certified RO am I expected to learn another rulebook for the 4 people that want to run PCC's at at the Regular Handgun Match? Yes. Booooooo. I have a hard enough time with just the Handgun Rulebook. Edited January 26, 2016 by d_striker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocMedic Posted January 26, 2016 Author Share Posted January 26, 2016 Booooo. I have a hard enough time with just the Handgun Rulebook. I'll make it up to ya! I'll drop by and buy a beer from you or you can shoot my PCC next time I Bring it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_striker Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 Booooo. I have a hard enough time with just the Handgun Rulebook. I'll make it up to ya! I'll drop by and buy a beer from you or you can shoot my PCC next time I Bring it Deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric4069 Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 When do we find out if this will become a division? Provisional or otherwise. I guess the Board already knows the answer from the meeting this weekend??? Good question as to when we find out what they decided? Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gng4life Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 The club I frequent is moving to a Saturday and Sunday club match format due to high number of shooters at our Sunday matches. If you add PCC, and someone wants to shoot that and their pistol, limit it to one gun per day. At Majors, have them shoot PCC or their pistol on the Staff day (which anyone can request to shoot that day), and the other gun on the normal match day(s). I understand that not all clubs would be able to make use of a double match format, but it's not a bad option. On another note: I think that the rules and stage descriptions would need to specify using props as support for the PCC. This could raise some safety concerns, and impact the durability of some props. There is already a rule in USPSA about using props and another about weak/strong unsupported so this shouldn't be a concern. The walls and props should already be stable enough and the match crew will handle things like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.McDevitt Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 +1... PCC is HUGE fun. Shake things up USPSA. If you think their not already popular talk to all the manufactures, They can't make 9mm caliber carbines fast enough, Shoot as a fun or second gun at most USPSA matches, no restrictions (at all) let shooters decide barrel length mag size etc. just let the fun begin. I have seen so many different combinations from CZ Scorpion's to top dog JP's in 9mm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norther Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Some thoughts: The two division per shooter concern is irrelevant. MDs can disallow if they wish. Our club would have to ban the division for half the year due to the restrictions at our indoor range. Lots of Open shooters bag their guns instead of carry them around in holsters. If you don't like the idea of possible stage design alterations to accommodate PCC, volunteer to design stages yourself. Really, this applies to anything you don't like about the matches you attend. I have some reservations, but overall I think I like it. But you gotta allow SBRs. I don't like so many divisions, but neither do I like the idea of limiting them. I don't know the answer to that. Maybe edit Appendix A2 to require more shooters per division for it to be recognized? If a division is rarely recognized shooters will mostly abandon it on their own, at least at bigger matches. This is a little off-topic, but not entirely. Keeping an open mind here. I don't even own a PCC (yet). Sounds like fun though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 But you gotta allow SBRs. Only if they fire a pistol caliber cartridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norther Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Well, yes. Didn't think I needed to say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Well, yes. Didn't think I needed to say that. Experience has shown that common sense with the IPSC lawyers does not exist. Everything must be explicitly stated, and even then some will try to use Clintonian English. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 There are already RULES in USPSA on how "Long Guns" are handled when shooter is at before and after the ULSC. So I do not understand why there is such a resistance to add PCC to a normal USPSA match based on safety concerns? All items are covered under 5.2.3 USPSA Rifle, Shotgun and Multigun rules Feb 01 2014. As for slowing down the match, how so? Can someone please explain to me how a shooter who is running a PCC will slow a match down anymore then a open, revo, or production shooter? I only asked this as I've CRO'd for the past 6 years in many major and large 3gun events and I have never had notice once that ULSC with a rifle was any slower then a pistol. Even starting with a rifle I find it in my own experience a shooter is ready faster with a rifle then a pistol as a rifle shooter only needs to do his sight picture, load and go to the start position of "low ready" or "port arms". I would also like to ask, how many shooters do you think would shoot in a PCC division? I might know 4 or 5 people here locally that would shoot PCC seriously but that's really it. Others might shoot it once in a while in lieu of there normal USPSA division, but I don't see them coming in droves as some of the post in this thread seem to suggest. If I would had guess I say attendance would be more then L10, Revo, and CO. probably closer to Single stack depending on your location, but I don't see it ever hitting Production,limited and open numbers. I know there are going to be some rules that would need to be worked out such as "facing up range" "hands above shoulders" etc etc. But honestly those are easy fixes, after all PCC would only Compete against other PCC shooters, just how Limited only scored against limited shooters and not production shooters Multigun rules gave conflict with USPSA handgun rules, so which rule book is the one to follow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkm Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 I am so excited.. It is about time we allowed those long guns in a handgun match... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Look at it this way, we've already got handguns in long gun matches !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKT1106 Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 PCCs are either bagged or on the rack. Shooter in PCC retrieves PCC and walks muzzle up or muzzle down to the start box when called. Make ready Are you ready? Stand By Beep If you are finished, unload and show clear. If clear, chamber flag and hang muzzle up or down Range is clear PCC shooter returns PCC to bag or rack PCC shooter moves to next stage with PCC in bag or muzzle up or muzzle down and places PCC either on next rack or keeps in bag. Repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 PCCs are either bagged or on the rack. the rules we run our matches under (uspsa handgun rules) don't appear to have any provision for a rack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 PCCs are either bagged or on the rack. the rules we run our matches under (uspsa handgun rules) don't appear to have any provision for a rack. USPSA handgun rules a shooter must never be allowed or required to start touching a firearm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckB Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 I'm looking for that for another reason as well, what rule number is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckB Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Found it 8.2.3 A course of fire must never require or allow a competitor to touch or hold a handgun, loading device or ammunition after the "Standby" command and before the "Start Signal". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Found it 8.2.3 A course of fire must never require or allow a competitor to touch or hold a handgun, loading device or ammunition after the "Standby" command and before the "Start Signal". No problem. We won't be touching a "handgun" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bret Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 Found it 8.2.3 A course of fire must never require or allow a competitor to touch or hold a handgun, loading device or ammunition after the "Standby" command and before the "Start Signal". No problem. We won't be touching a "handgun" What rule allow's a carbine to be used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckB Posted January 28, 2016 Share Posted January 28, 2016 I was just looking at that same word and wondering if I should poke the bear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now