-1 Points down = 1 second?

[David Honeycutt]

Our IDPA club is preparing to order targets for 2016. Does IDPA plan to change the "approved" target to show the points-down markings using the new points down numbers?

David

[LeviSS]

Our IDPA club is preparing to order targets for 2016. Does IDPA plan to change the "approved" target to show the points-down markings using the new points down numbers?

David

I doubt it. Now the numbers on the target will be your seconds down...no more dividing in half.

[JD45]

Why do we even talk about IDPA? Your opinion doesn't matter. There is no board and no voting.

You have to shoot by their rules or leave.

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

But everyone I talk to still believes it's 1983 and you must have a race gun to shoot USPSA.

[IHAVEGAS]

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

With IDPA, a half dozen of us can show up at the range at 7:00 a.m. and we can be ready to start shooting a fun 6 stage match at 10:00 a.m. . Things are normally cleaned up and put up by 3:30 or so. That works out real well for a couple heavily utilized local (to me) ranges.

With USPSA, a half dozen (+ -) of us show up on Wednesday and put in 4 - 5 hours getting walls and target stands & etc right for a 6 stage match, then we spend 3-4 hours on Friday getting steel targets in place & kitting targets per stage/timers/pasters/ etc, and then a few folks show up early on match day to staple on targets & etc. Things (walls / barrels / target stands) that can be left in place are left in place until the next match. This works out real well at a competition focused local range where it is ok to leave things in place & where damage by idiots or theft is minimal.

Point being that when USPSA is not feasable given range time or manpower constraints (or both) , IDPA sure beats not shooting.

[jcc7x7]

Why do we even talk about IDPA? Your opinion doesn't matter. There is no board and no voting.

You have to shoot by their rules or leave.

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

But everyone I talk to still believes it's 1983 and you must have a race gun to shoot USPSA.

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

With IDPA, a half dozen of us can show up at the range at 7:00 a.m. and we can be ready to start shooting a fun 6 stage match at 10:00 a.m. . Things are normally cleaned up and put up by 3:30 or so. That works out real well for a couple heavily utilized local (to me) ranges.

With USPSA, a half dozen (+ -) of us show up on Wednesday and put in 4 - 5 hours getting walls and target stands & etc right for a 6 stage match, then we spend 3-4 hours on Friday getting steel targets in place & kitting targets per stage/timers/pasters/ etc, and then a few folks show up early on match day to staple on targets & etc. Things (walls / barrels / target stands) that can be left in place are left in place until the next match. This works out real well at a competition focused local range where it is ok to leave things in place & where damage by idiots or theft is minimal.

Point being that when USPSA is not feasable given range time or manpower constraints (or both) , IDPA sure beats not shooting.

idpa left when I no longer could remember all the rule changes and the cost of the new gun I bought to shoot idpa that was then made obsolete

USPSA may be more work but usually is twice the amount of rounds fired at our local matches

Great thing about America we can still agree to disagree

[IHAVEGAS]

USPSA may be more work but usually is twice the amount of rounds fired at our local matches

Great thing about America we can still agree to disagree

I don't know what you are disagreeing with, whatever it is I agree that you can if you want to though .

Edited January 16, 2016 by IHAVEGAS

[waktasz]

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

With IDPA, a half dozen of us can show up at the range at 7:00 a.m. and we can be ready to start shooting a fun 6 stage match at 10:00 a.m. . Things are normally cleaned up and put up by 3:30 or so. That works out real well for a couple heavily utilized local (to me) ranges.

With USPSA, a half dozen (+ -) of us show up on Wednesday and put in 4 - 5 hours getting walls and target stands & etc right for a 6 stage match, then we spend 3-4 hours on Friday getting steel targets in place & kitting targets per stage/timers/pasters/ etc, and then a few folks show up early on match day to staple on targets & etc. Things (walls / barrels / target stands) that can be left in place are left in place until the next match. This works out real well at a competition focused local range where it is ok to leave things in place & where damage by idiots or theft is minimal.

Point being that when USPSA is not feasable given range time or manpower constraints (or both) , IDPA sure beats not shooting.

IDPA makes more money for the home club too.

[motosapiens]

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

With IDPA, a half dozen of us can show up at the range at 7:00 a.m. and we can be ready to start shooting a fun 6 stage match at 10:00 a.m. . Things are normally cleaned up and put up by 3:30 or so. That works out real well for a couple heavily utilized local (to me) ranges.

With USPSA, a half dozen (+ -) of us show up on Wednesday and put in 4 - 5 hours getting walls and target stands & etc right for a 6 stage match, then we spend 3-4 hours on Friday getting steel targets in place & kitting targets per stage/timers/pasters/ etc, and then a few folks show up early on match day to staple on targets & etc. Things (walls / barrels / target stands) that can be left in place are left in place until the next match. This works out real well at a competition focused local range where it is ok to leave things in place & where damage by idiots or theft is minimal.

Point being that when USPSA is not feasable given range time or manpower constraints (or both) , IDPA sure beats not shooting.

WTH? y'all are totally doing it wrong. We set up a 6 stage USPSA match in 60-90 minutes, twice a month. generally 5-6 hours from start to finish (set up, register, shoot, clean up, lock up.

In my experience, IDPA is not any faster, or any slower (both groups share the same props at our range), and I can't think of any good reason why there should be a difference.

[Cherryriver]

To the point of IDPA ignoring the wishes of the shooting members, I generally agree, but it's also true that IDPA reversed the flat-foot reload rule.
They can change if the noise is loud enough. But I'm not forecasting it.

[IHAVEGAS]

I can't think of any good reason why there should be a difference.

Twice the targets per stage, lots of walls at every stage instead of few or no walls, boundary areas placed on every stage, a stage designer who goes out of his way to make sure every USPSA stage has multiple options of about equal difficulty, and a bit too much perfectionism/revision sometimes perhaps. It all adds up to a LOT more work, just lugging walls is more than what it takes for an entire IDPA match.

It could be done more effeciently though with more help available and more delegation, but I have helped different USPSA groups at both local and major matches and it is just a good bit of work.

[freeidaho]

Our IDPA club is preparing to order targets for 2016. Does IDPA plan to change the "approved" target to show the points-down markings using the new points down numbers?

David

The points down areas of the target are not changing. So no issue with ordering targets.

[JD45]

If most of the local USPSA matches hadn't been killed off, and USPSA was better at promoting the production level of the sport, IDPA would have a low attendance.

With IDPA, a half dozen of us can show up at the range at 7:00 a.m. and we can be ready to start shooting a fun 6 stage match at 10:00 a.m. . Things are normally cleaned up and put up by 3:30 or so. That works out real well for a couple heavily utilized local (to me) ranges.

With USPSA, a half dozen (+ -) of us show up on Wednesday and put in 4 - 5 hours getting walls and target stands & etc right for a 6 stage match, then we spend 3-4 hours on Friday getting steel targets in place & kitting targets per stage/timers/pasters/ etc, and then a few folks show up early on match day to staple on targets & etc. Things (walls / barrels / target stands) that can be left in place are left in place until the next match. This works out real well at a competition focused local range where it is ok to leave things in place & where damage by idiots or theft is minimal.

Point being that when USPSA is not feasable given range time or manpower constraints (or both) , IDPA sure beats not shooting.

WTH? y'all are totally doing it wrong. We set up a 6 stage USPSA match in 60-90 minutes, twice a month. generally 5-6 hours from start to finish (set up, register, shoot, clean up, lock up.

In my experience, IDPA is not any faster, or any slower (both groups share the same props at our range), and I can't think of any good reason why there should be a difference.

[JD45]

This is true. We have matches that tell u to be there at 9:30. Then we wait in the cold weather til like 10:45 to fire the first shot. And instead of designing fast stages in bad weather, they'll have the longest most confusing thing they can dream up.

Reset takes forever. Beginners are a mess. Very few paste targets. An old shooter I know calls it, " amateur night". And it is.

I can shoot the one USPSA match left and help tear down, and be done hours earlier, with just as many shooters. And they always follow the rule book.

[motosapiens]

I can't think of any good reason why there should be a difference.

Twice the targets per stage, lots of walls at every stage instead of few or no walls, boundary areas placed on every stage, a stage designer who goes out of his way to make sure every USPSA stage has multiple options of about equal difficulty, and a bit too much perfectionism/revision sometimes perhaps. It all adds up to a LOT more work, just lugging walls is more than what it takes for an entire IDPA match.

It could be done more effeciently though with more help available and more delegation, but I have helped different USPSA groups at both local and major matches and it is just a good bit of work.

Yep, you are doing it wrong. For sure, you *can* take more time to set up a uspsa match, but you can also take more time to set up an IDPA match if you don't delegate, and have elaborate stages.

It's been a couple years since I shot an IDPA match, but at the time, the ones around here ran about an hour or two longer than the uspsa matches. I blame that on better delegation, and a younger, more motivated crowd that was more experienced in shooting sports.

Edited January 19, 2016 by motosapiens

[IHAVEGAS]

I can't think of any good reason why there should be a difference.

Twice the targets per stage, lots of walls at every stage instead of few or no walls, boundary areas placed on every stage, a stage designer who goes out of his way to make sure every USPSA stage has multiple options of about equal difficulty, and a bit too much perfectionism/revision sometimes perhaps. It all adds up to a LOT more work, just lugging walls is more than what it takes for an entire IDPA match.

It could be done more effeciently though with more help available and more delegation, but I have helped different USPSA groups at both local and major matches and it is just a good bit of work.

Yep, you are doing it wrong. For sure, you *can* take more time to set up a uspsa match, but you can also take more time to set up an IDPA match if you don't delegate, and have elaborate stages.

It's been a couple years since I shot an IDPA match, but at the time, the ones around here ran about an hour or two longer than the uspsa matches. I blame that on better delegation, and a younger, more motivated crowd that was more experienced in shooting sports.

Some of it likely gets down to local traditions and expectations.

I'm not big on going to higher level USPSA matches because the cost is much more & the stages are not any better than the stages at local matches with the the four USPSA clubs within reasonable driving distance, so for me it is a choice of 5 excellent stages + a classifier for $20 or maybe twice that many stages for $100 - 200 + lots of gas + motel + food.

For IDPA matches the stages at local clubs do tend to be much less elaborate than what you will see at many of the higher level matches.

I would hate to see things done any differently locally, I think the effort and facilities required reflects the manpower and facilities available at the respective clubs, but I understand your point that how much effort is required it is a matter of choice.

[GMB]

One of the worst ideas that IDPA HQ has come up with!!!!!!!!!!!!! They took some steps in the right direction with the revised reloading on the move rules and now this. HQ leave the scoring alone, it is not broken so don't try to fix it!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[S&W686]

One of the worst ideas that IDPA HQ has come up with!!!!!!!!!!!!! They took some steps in the right direction with the revised reloading on the move rules and now this. HQ leave the scoring alone, it is not broken so don't try to fix it!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree! Stop all the rule changing.

[MilkMyDuds]

Does anyone know with some certainty if the 1 point = 1 second rule change will happen in 2016?

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk

[GMB]

No SCORING change IDPA HQ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Cherryriver]

I telephoned HQ in early February to ask and was told that the change definitely won't happen this year, and will next. But maybe not then, either.
So we stayed affiliated for another year.

[Alaskan454]

I don't care if they bump the points down penalty but it would be nice to let the membership vote about it.

As for the set-up times, we probably spend about the same amount of time in each discipline, but the more elaborate stages require more volunteers.

[COF]

Like some of the other folks here I started IDPA at our club in March 98 and have seen some of the most inane rules come out of IDPA. I made my opinion known to HQ and dealt with it at a club level. We had the customers who wanted to shoot IDPA and we did our best to put together interesting matches so we kept shooting it til we lost our range. I kept shooting at other clubs in the area and shooting a few nationals. As a side note, I started shooting "combat shooting" back in the early 80's and have shot USPSA since 96 so I didn't just start a couple years ago. I've shot good and bad USPSA and IDPA matches, but like they say - a bad day shooting beats a good day at work...

The point is I kept shooting it because I enjoyed it. When IDPA changed the rules it wasn't the end of the world, it was an inconvenience. Either folks continued to shoot or they didn't - they voted with their feet. That is my message to everyone - vote with your feet, either shoot IDPA or don't.

It just amazes me that this thread has taken 14 pages over a potential scoring rule change that I don't believe will fundamentally change the sport. I don't have an issue with the scoring change. Should have been that way all along - would have simplified all those hand written score sheets...

My point is - shoot it or don't.

[Steppenwolf]

COF:

"My point is - shoot it or don't."

Trying to interject logical replies into an online forum! You are trying to get people to overcome the human proclivity of "bitching" about stuff they don't like. Your point is valid, but, if the majority of IDPA participants are opposed to the change and their voices are "not heard," and they do what you advocate (especially "don't shoot")--then IDPA will probably dwindle. Our local club dropped IPDA affiliation (in December). I noticed (from comments in various shooting forums) that at least 12 other clubs have dropped IDPA affiliation (for various reasons) in the past few months.

I will still shoot IDPA at a club 25 miles from me, but am focusing on USPSA (at a club an hour away) and our local "practical shooting" matches (now similar to USPSA). I don't think the rationale for the new scoring is convincing, but I'm just a peasant outside the Lord of the Realm's castle. The aristocracy will know there is a problem if the peasants stop tilling and harvesting.

[GMB]

The board should put it to the membership to vote on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[robertson]

I don't think 1=1 would slow the times much, not enough to make IDPA boring by any stretch. ICORE has 1=1 scoring and the pace looks about the same as any of the other games. Shooters will adjust, do what needs to be done to make those tough shots. Shot splits on some stages will go up a little, but movement, reloads etc. won't change. So a 14 second stage goes in 14.8 or 15.1 who cares.

Easy shots will be the same as they are now, easy. So why change? I think it would push people to shoot smoother more in control. A good challenge.

John

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