Chuck Anderson Posted July 20, 2010 Share Posted July 20, 2010 btw, when is this taking effect/getting published "officially"? It's posted on the USPSA site. We didn't specify a waiting period and it was meant to be passed in time for the Multigun Nationals. I believe it's effective now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outsydlooknin75 Posted July 20, 2010 Share Posted July 20, 2010 Does the optic need to be permanently mounted? Can it be put on a flip to side mount? So that way on the hoser stages up close it could be used then for the longer stuff have the fancy irons? OR have two groups within limited, an optics and an irons division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocMedic Posted July 20, 2010 Share Posted July 20, 2010 btw, when is this taking effect/getting published "officially"? It's posted on the USPSA site. We didn't specify a waiting period and it was meant to be passed in time for the Multigun Nationals. I believe it's effective now. Wow, that was quick. Too bad I can't go, not enough time to ask for those days off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted July 20, 2010 Share Posted July 20, 2010 (edited) How do you measure/prove at the match that it's only 1X? I'm thinking the Gumbys out there will be showing up with some 1.1-1.2x trying to get an advantage claiming they are only running a 1X. Edited July 21, 2010 by jtischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 (edited) Well it is nice to see USPSA do this as well. I talked to Mike and Charles at quite some length about this change and now it is here. It is good to see Kentucky join in as well. Mike Pinto and I have been doing this for the last 1 1/2 years at OKC and we went from 4 dedicated iron shooters to a field of over 25 shooters in just 3 months. The only difference is we call it Tactical Non-Magnified. As for the idea of a red dot flip to the side etc. for close up...I have said for years...nothing beats irons up close, and nothing is going to start...well except those two times that Erik Lund did, but before or since no-one has come close. All the iron sight guys I have talked to WELCOME the challenge! I can't wait to see the spark grow into a burning ember and blossom into a great new/old division! This is the best change EVER for the sport of 3-gun...now if we could just get a LITTLE unity on Heavy Metal we would be cooking. Maybe USPSA can follow what OKC Gun Club is doing there as well....HEY I TRIED!! I was one of the 5 guys who brought you all Heavy Metal (it was really called He-Man and it was Eddie Rhodes idea but RM3G made it happen) and now Tac Non-Magnified...who knows what is next??? Maybe open is open for shotguns?? Hey I am trying! KurtM Edited July 21, 2010 by kurtm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bore Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 Pat Kelley asked me what I thought about this at the IronMan this year and I was all for it. Maybe this will get a few more people shooting Limited and make things a little more interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.Hayden Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 It's posted on the USPSA site. We didn't specify a waiting period and it was meant to be passed in time for the Multigun Nationals. I believe it's effective now. Anybody find the link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gose Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 (edited) It's posted on the USPSA site. We didn't specify a waiting period and it was meant to be passed in time for the Multigun Nationals. I believe it's effective now. Anybody find the link? yes Members area -> Board meeting minutes -> Online Meetings -> 0712 minutes Edited July 21, 2010 by gose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Bond Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 Does the optic need to be permanently mounted? Can it be put on a flip to side mount? So that way on the hoser stages up close it could be used then for the longer stuff have the fancy irons? OR have two groups within limited, an optics and an irons division. Limited is one division under this not two groups in the same division. Mounting? You can spend just a much money as you desire on any mount you can afford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_pinto Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 Thanks Chuck and other BOD members. This will be the one thing that helps limited. Glad our little club could be the proving ground for such a major revolution in multi-gun. Now let's get them folks out there and make Limited a viable division. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.Schmitt Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 Looks like there is a snowball rolling. I will pass this info on to those who run our monthly matches held at the DPMS range. Iron shooters are not well represented anymore at our monthly match. Thanks to you PIONEERS. I will say that I recently had the opportunity to shoot a 4moa aimpoint side by side with my iron sights at 100 yards and (well those folks can keep their aimpoints and eotechs). Thanks Jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbrowndog Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 its not a question of whether a unmagnified optic is better or worse than irons for shooting, its about not needing "perfect"????? vision to shoot well. and bringing the unmagnified class the participation to keep it alive and thriving, and hopefully increase participation. Now we just need the outlaw matches to accept it. I hope that HM gets included in the umbrella, it might be the catalyst to eliminate the need for HM-optic, and make it one division again. trapr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgnoyes Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 It's posted on the USPSA site. We didn't specify a waiting period and it was meant to be passed in time for the Multigun Nationals. I believe it's effective now. Anybody find the link? yes Members area -> Board meeting minutes -> Online Meetings -> 0712 minutes To me, those aren't rules. Those are a list of the things the Board wanted to change in the multigun rules, but the actual final text of the changed rulebook not available anywhere that I can find. (I DID find a June 2010 Handgun Rulebook, but that's for a different topic.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.E. Kelley Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 its not a question of whether a unmagnified optic is better or worse than irons for shooting, its about not needing "perfect"????? vision to shoot well. and bringing the unmagnified class the participation to keep it alive and thriving, and hopefully increase participation. Now we just need the outlaw matches to accept it. I hope that HM gets included in the umbrella, it might be the catalyst to eliminate the need for HM-optic, and make it one division again. trapr Absolutely!!! I pressed this point with MV and hope that it happens. I feel there is a "wait and see" on how 1x Limited works out first. Thanks to the Okies for plowing (you guys got pavement?) the way! Patrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maineshootah Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 This is a tad bit off subject but why wasn't the rule of Open division shotgun being limited to XX amount of shells not changed? Nobody even brought it up. I'll certainly mention it to the MG committee. Especially since I have a Saiga being built. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling White Posted July 21, 2010 Share Posted July 21, 2010 Thanks to the Okies for plowing (you guys got pavement?) the way! they drive big trucks with oversized mudslingers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stlhead Posted July 23, 2010 Share Posted July 23, 2010 I look forward to actually reading the revised rules. I hope they can get revised in the next couple of weeks. As for the red dot in HM, I wish I could say I do better with my irons, but I am still better with a dot, so if that change comes down the pipe I would dot my rifle, but I have no illusions that a dot would make me the winner winner chicken dinner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny hill Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 A new dawn has arrived. I will put my red dot on my AR and precede to kick the shit out of kurt miller in limited. Long live the new king. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Tischauser Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 (edited) A new dawn has arrived. I will put my red dot on my AR and precede to kick the shit out of kurt miller in limited. Long live the new king. cheers: Edited July 27, 2010 by jtischauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiskey1 Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 That's bold talk for a one eyed fat man! I ain't tryin' to start no trouble or nothin', just sayin'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 Just when I get rid of my aimpoint because it's useless in tactical! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 (edited) "Telling the new guy with a red dot to compete in Tactical against the guy with the $1600.00 Swarovski is a bit like telling him he's competing against the guy with the full custom 2011 with his Ruger P85." And ironically, that guy actually still is. I've seen it suggested that USPSA should have a production 3-gun division. Production Pistol Iron Sighted Rifle Pump Shotgun Maybe the folks that still shoot irons could fit in this. Edited July 27, 2010 by DyNo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan 45 Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 "Telling the new guy with a red dot to compete in Tactical against the guy with the $1600.00 Swarovski is a bit like telling him he's competing against the guy with the full custom 2011 with his Ruger P85." And ironically, that guy actually still is. I've seen it suggested that USPSA should have a production 3-gun division. Production Pistol Iron Sighted Rifle Pump Shotgun Maybe the folks that still shoot irons could fit in this. Very few new shooters use irons- at least the ones I've seen. And all the equipment in the world won't help a new shooter win a competition against someone who has put a lot of time and money into practice and matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sterling White Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 (edited) Who will be shooting irons? kurt m, trapr s, ted p, bruce p, craig u, patrick k, ??????????????? Who will be shooting 1x optic? benny h, ?????????? go benny go! Edited July 28, 2010 by Sterling White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyNo! Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 (edited) Very few new shooters use irons- at least the ones I've seen. And all the equipment in the world won't help a new shooter win a competition against someone who has put a lot of time and money into practice and matches. This division wouldn't target new shooters anymore than production division does though. Isn't the objective of production division in USPSA to allow shooters to compete with off the shelf equipment? It is easy for me to imagine a skilled shooter who isn't new by any means having a Glock, pump shotgun, and AR15 (and not a 2011, Benelli M1/FN SLP, and AR-15 with an ELCAN or S&B Short-Dot). Those are also items I can walk into most any gunstore and manage to find. Most AR-15's aren't sold with optics and I'm pretty confident that pump shotguns are more common than autoloaders. Edited July 27, 2010 by DyNo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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