thegirl Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 In spite of the rain and mud, this was a great match. OK, I was totally unprepared for all the tight shots and distant targets, but hey - now I know what to practice! Our squad (10) was awesome, we were still having a good time while getting soaked and mud-splattered - I really enjoyed meeting David and Jane, Robert and John, and getting to shoot a big match with our other friends from the great state of Texas - you guys were a hoot! The match staff and ROs are to be commended - with the conditions and long hours they had to work with they had every reason to be grumpy, but every one of them had a great attitude - geez, they didn't even get to collect any brass off the stages and still they were a pleasure to be around! I was at the LPR Nats last year and shot in the pouring rain, but I was also at the ProAm this year and shot in the 100+ degree heat - you just never know what you're going to get weatherwise, unless of course you go to New Mexico - nothing you can do but make the best of it and buy a new pair of cleats, 'cuz that smell will NEVER come out! See y'all next year, I need to go practice now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyin40 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 First I want to thank the RO's, what they had to put up with with the weather, mud, no lunch breaks etc. Can't thank them enough. I had a great squad to play in the mud with...Those crazy Texans. We all went out to dinner after the match and had a great time. Glad I was able to meet everyone and see the others I already knew. The match........was wet and muddy. I shot the first morning(day) and it rained a ton. We had to have someone watching our mags so we wouldn't lose them in the mud on reloads. I started on 11 on the back with all those big field courses and had a rough first day to say the least. My 2nd day started off rough. I knew ahead of time it was supposed to rain and should of done some practicing with bags on. Some of those head shots with bags on were tough. Overall my shooting was ok at best but being able to shoot in that mess gave me some confidence if I have to ever shoot in weather or conditions like that again. After a couple days to reflect on the match I think I would go back and shoot in those same conditions if I had to again. I would be better prepared to say the least. I never took a chair and I had to stand for 3hrs between my 3rd and 4th stage. I was tired by the end of the day along with everyone else. Was it a mess, you bet but I would do it again. The match was a character builder for sure Flyin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Baier Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 We are doing something very, very wrong. People will pay to volunteer!Volunteers pay $220 Even with what USPSA pays us RO's in expense reimbursements, we still pay out of pocket. For multi-gun for example, I'm paying an extra 150.00 just for airfare. We do it for the love of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjb45 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 George Jones was one of my most favorite ROs. He cracks me up. He ran a great stage with lots of humor! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prh Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 We are doing something very, very wrong. People will pay to volunteer!Volunteers pay $220 Dale, I don't know if you have worked a Nationals or any other major match or not, but the fact is that most of the match staff do "PAY TO VOLUNTEER". The travel and meal allowances do not cover all the costs. prh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Bond Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 I am in favor of returning to Tulsa as it is a relatively easy two day drive. The location relative to hotels, airport, restaurants and diversions is excellent. Vegas might have more to do, but it is further to go for most of us and I understand the range is not as good. I think that the potential for this range is virtually unlimited as far as USPSA Pistol matches go. All we need is a few tons of stone or gravel on the ranges instead of the sod and rain will cease to be a major concern. I wish it were just that simple. The problem is that WE should not do anything. USPSA does not own the range and operation and improvements are the responsibility of USSA. If USSA wants gravel, they will bring it in but that will not cure the problem. The problem is that all the sod is apparently installed on a clay base that holds water which makes a great sub surface to grow grass. If the surfaces of the stages were merely topped with gravel (and it would take several tons for each bay), the result after a rain storm would be that you would be shooting in a rock bottomed pond. The good news is that Tom Fee owns a construction company. The bad news is that the cost of the repair to make the range a competition range rather than just a trainning range may not be inviting. If we tried to go back to Tulsa at this point without the repairs, we would most certainly not be able to staff it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AikiDale Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 We are doing something very, very wrong. People will pay to volunteer!Volunteers pay $220 Dale, I don't know if you have worked a Nationals or any other major match or not, but the fact is that most of the match staff do "PAY TO VOLUNTEER". The travel and meal allowances do not cover all the costs. prh If we had an evil tongue in cheek smilie I would have used it. I worked a nationals in PASA once, no rain, just lots of sun on top of the hill. I had originally planned to shoot the LPR and work the O/L10 but thank goodness that did not work out and I had to shoot and scoot! You guys and gals did a terrific job and anyone who works a nationals or area match deserves a whole lot more than they get. Labor unions fought long and hard to outlaw the working conditions and meager compensation USPSA ROs endure year after year. Thanks for your service! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ysued Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 I wish it were just that simple. The problem is that WE should not do anything. USPSA does not own the range and operation and improvements are the responsibility of USSA. Funny, didn't we drop a ton of cash into PASA's Concrete Walls?? If USSA wants gravel, they will bring it in but that will not cure the problem. The problem is that all the sod is apparently installed on a clay base that holds water which makes a great sub surface to grow grass. If the surfaces of the stages were merely topped with gravel (and it would take several tons for each bay), the result after a rain storm would be that you would be shooting in a rock bottomed pond. The good news is that Tom Fee owns a construction company. The bad news is that the cost of the repair to make the range a competition range rather than just a trainning range may not be inviting.If we tried to go back to Tulsa at this point without the repairs, we would most certainly not be able to staff it. I sincerely doubt that!! Our RO staff is the most dedicated group of folks out there!! They are not crying babies!! They will be there and they will be happy to help, Rain or Shine!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDave Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 It sounds like a few dozen rolls of this might be just the thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 I am in favor of returning to Tulsa as it is a relatively easy two day drive. The location relative to hotels, airport, restaurants and diversions is excellent. Vegas might have more to do, but it is further to go for most of us and I understand the range is not as good. I think that the potential for this range is virtually unlimited as far as USPSA Pistol matches go. All we need is a few tons of stone or gravel on the ranges instead of the sod and rain will cease to be a major concern. I wish it were just that simple. The problem is that WE should not do anything. USPSA does not own the range and operation and improvements are the responsibility of USSA. If USSA wants gravel, they will bring it in but that will not cure the problem. The problem is that all the sod is apparently installed on a clay base that holds water which makes a great sub surface to grow grass. If the surfaces of the stages were merely topped with gravel (and it would take several tons for each bay), the result after a rain storm would be that you would be shooting in a rock bottomed pond. The good news is that Tom Fee owns a construction company. The bad news is that the cost of the repair to make the range a competition range rather than just a training range may not be inviting. If we tried to go back to Tulsa at this point without the repairs, we would most certainly not be able to staff it. Charles, Sorry if I was not clear. I was not implying that USPSA should do the improvements. The "We" was simply a figure of speech. I think that it would be in the best interest of USSA to consider a change to stone from Sod. Stone will eventually settle and there would be drainage, easily repairable surfaces and NO MUD. Grass has even been known to grow over the top of a stone base. Will I go back, Probably, more dependent upon schedule than locale. I will not happily fly anywhere. I prefer that we go to a location no further from home than Tulsa. 2700 mile round trip is about it for me. Might go a couple hundred more, but not AZ or NV. PASA is OK, but boring as watching grass grow once you are done shooting. Anyone think about ranges in Missouri? Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmshtr Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Tom owns a construction company??? I wish someone would've told us before we paid someone else to build this place! I'm glad that's out in the open now. GEEZ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Provan Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Phil Are there any plans to make changes to the bays that did not drain well? I know that several will need some major work to bring them back to a respectable appearance. Taking in to account the amount of rain and shooter traffic some of the bays held up ok, others, well being nice not so well. Some thing should be done so there are not major repairs after a match. I think it was a great match, with great staff, great stages, and lots of mud. I am willing to go back next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzdraw Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 (edited) Another Tulsa-area outdoor range has had gravel (limestone) floored bays for many years. It was originally built that way, due to the same clay soil so prevalent over much of the Tulsa area. The gravel bays work great, being built to engineering standards to quickly wick away surface water. The top gravel surface is bone-dry within a few minutes of the cessation of any steady downpour. The water flows away through the secondary layer of gravel. Such a range floor provides consistent range conditions for all shooters, throughout a match. It is difficult to loose safe footing on a properly built gravel floored range, thus avoiding many DQ's which we all dislike. Mr. Fee has shot matches on this local gravel floored range, so he's aware of the pro's and con's of this sort of construction. I know he's tried several methods to improve the drainage of his own grass floored bays; he's made attempts to improve the USSA situation. We shot a USPSA monthly match at this gravel floored range facility on the Sunday morning following the O/L10 without so much as getting our toes the least bit wet. Overnight Saturday, the remnants of the hurricane had plastered the Tulsa area with lots of rain, as so many of you are aware. I enjoyed shooting the LPR at USSA; the range was in good condition to start, even though some stages were beginning to get a tad sloppy. I felt the pain of the O/L10 guys who had to shoot in the swamp on some stages. Edited September 16, 2008 by Buzzdraw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ysued Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Tom owns a construction company???I wish someone would've told us before we paid someone else to build this place! I'm glad that's out in the open now. GEEZ! It goes to show you Phil!! folks her on the forum know things that you don't know!! Y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDH Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 My crew and I ran what I later heard was an unofficial nationals record 17 2/3 squads on Friday. Thanks to lucky squad 13 for coming over and busting ass in the failing light to get everyone through as fast as possible as our "martini squad". We all had a very long day and we still turned shooters at about 2 minutes per on that last squad.As for "just putting up no shoots" for O/L10. I don't know about any of the other stages but that was about all I was willing to do given that I figured we would be in bags the whole match. Doing anything more imaginative makes it rough to bag and unbag all the time. Darn, and I thought I had it with 17 squads. You da man!! On the no shoot issue... I did the same thing... planned to be under bags and set the no shoots to make it as easy as possible... Everyone have fun at the multi-gun. Unfortunately, I'll be going to Bali instead to work the World Shoot, and from what I hear, there will be no mud to worry about! Night Flowers? Yes... Mud? No... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chemtcher Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 My son Jakob went up to the nationals with Alamoshooter. Jake is 15 and an A class open shooter. This was his first nationals and although thoroughly exhausted, still muddy in places, and backlogged like crazy on homework he had an absolute blast at this match and would not trade the experience for anything. His remark after seeing Shred's pic of him was "if I can ski on mud I can shoot anywhere". He thoroughly enjoyed squad 32 and has a bunch of friends on that squad but he was really excited about meeting and working with some of the international shooters on that squad. He told me that having a chance to exchange ideas with the Jamaican and Norwegian gentlemen that were with him really opened his mind to style and sequencing possibilities that never occured to him before in his shooting and that this new mental outlook alone would have been worth all of the mud and slop. So thanks folks for welcoming the juniors to Nationals and much appreciation to Alamo Shooter and Stuart for altering their schedule to offer him a ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin c Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 The good Mr. Imel never lost his sardonic sense of humor: "Stage 10 here to Mr. Fixit - we need a new timer. The old one tried the backstroke and didn't make it..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Capizzo Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I want to add my kudos to the staff of O/L10 match to the others, especially from Squad 10. The weather and range surface sucked, no doubt about it. But the stages were the best I've ever seen at a nationals, and the Range Officers were unbelievable in their professionalism and good humor despite the hours and conditions. ALL the folks on Squad 10 were great to shoot with and work with, and F'n 40 can F'n shoot ! Very smooth, very impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Bond Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Tom owns a construction company???I wish someone would've told us before we paid someone else to build this place! I'm glad that's out in the open now. GEEZ! Phil: That is my error and I regret publishing inaccurate information. I relied upon some else's statement in making that comment who I thought was in the correct position to know this. Obviously you are in a position to have superior knowledge on that subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgtsvi Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I also had a great time at the match despite the weather conditions. My squad busted their butts getting the targets taped and steel reset. I think we were faster than some of the smaller squads out there. I made new friends at the match that I would squad with anytime anywhere in the future. Jane and Dave, Robert, XRe, Flyin40, Al, and my usual cast of friends that I shoot with made the rain and mud alot more bearable. I shot a horrible match and finally started shooting pretty good on the third day when I stopped caring about scores and started having fun. I see now that I have been shooting with an attitude of not wanting to screw up instead of hanging it out and being aggressive. I will have a whole new practice routine for next years Nats that will include setting up classic targets with cover. I look forward to seeing all my old squad 10 mates again very soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmshtr Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Although the decisions about range improvements go WAY above my pay grade, I'm sure that USSA and USPSA will do whatever it takes to work together to give the shooters a more enjoyable experience in the face of unpredictable weather. The real shame is, without the rain the week before the Nats (during set up) or the rain afterwards, everyone would have been talking about probably one of the best Nationals to date. But, many of you are right. The facility should be able to hold up in most conditions. I'm sure that the administration here will do everything within reason to make it so. Fingers crossed, Phil Strader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ysued Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Although the decisions about range improvements go WAY above my pay grade, I'm sure that USSA and USPSA will do whatever it takes to work together to give the shooters a more enjoyable experience in the face of unpredictable weather. The real shame is, without the rain the week before the Nats (during set up) or the rain afterwards, everyone would have been talking about probably one of the best Nationals to date. But, many of you are right. The facility should be able to hold up in most conditions. I'm sure that the administration here will do everything within reason to make it so. Fingers crossed, Phil Strader I'm confident that there will be improvements!! Looking forward to coming back!! Y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ysued Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimel Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Where did you find such shallow mud? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ysued Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Where did you find such shallow mud? Saturday Stage 13 in the AM!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now