Why is is so hard to get people to try USPSA?

[Seanziegler]

2 hours ago, Derrick-508 said:

Awesome!  thats how I got into the sport, my dad making me paste targets until I was big enough to shoot a 1911. 

I think that would make me not want to try USPSA

[hamiltonian]

I think it has to do with the format of the sport.  It entails a lot of standing around and a little bit of shooting.  You have to really like all aspects of USPSA: shooting, pasting targets, painting steel, picking up brass.  Another is that many people enjoy  shooting but are not into the competition lifestyle.

Edited December 15, 2018 by hamiltonian

[nelson1each]

Almost had a first time shooter lined up for tomorrow’s match...then it got cancelled due to all the rain we are having. Hopefully he is down to go the next time it comes around. Everyone I know talks about shooting...they say yeah I’d like to try that blah blah blah but never do when the time comes. I think it boils down to there are those that talk and those that do in life. the talkers far out number the do’ers . Just my 2 cents  

[WarBoom]

I’ve brought several new shooters into the local club but it usually takes weeks of talking about it and showing copious videos of myself and others shooting it illustrating how fun it actually is.
I really think new shooters are intimidated and think they won’t be good enough to compete.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[zzt]

Of course new shooters are intimidated, assuming you've told them the rules and what is expected.  I had a series of posts earlier on this topic outlining what I did to prepare our club shooters for sanctioned USPSa and SCSA matches.

 

I think the very worst thing you could do is cajole your buddy into joining you on a lark.  The new shooter briefing is going to do nothing to help them understand what they are supposed to do.  Yes, they pass, and then forget everything when they are shooting the stage.  I see it all the time.  They get DQ'd on their first match and never come back.  I cannot overlook a serious safety infraction, so I have no choice but to DQ them.  Same with the other ROs.  One of my friends got DQ'd for his first three matches until he learned not to run with his finger in the trigger guard, or when clearing a jam.  He still shows up for every match.

 

There are a billion gotchas in USPSA.  Fortunately, I had veteran shooters to help me, and I read the rule book cover to cover a couple/three times before I shot my first match.

[Kletus]

The fact is that to say YES to something then you must necessarily say NO to something else.  If someone isn't naturally competitive.. then they probably aren't willing to say no to the other things they enjoy to say yes to competitive shooting.  I love competing and I love shooting USPSA, but I don't get to do it as often as I want.   I went from zero to three kids, which means that when I go shoot a match... I'm leaving my wife home to take care of 3 kids under 5.  There WILL be consequences when I get home.. .even if she doesn't really intend it.  I'm still fairly new to USPSA, so I don't really feel like I can just grab my stuff and head off to a match.  I want to do some practice and get some range time before hand to make sure I'm ready.  I also feel more pressure when shooting USPSA.  It's a more serious game and requires more mental focus than something like Steel Challenge.  All of this takes a time commitment that eats into other hobbies I have... (Golf, Kayaking, Fishing, Hiking, Swimming, boating... etc, etc, etc).  

 

Right now I am way more likely to go shoot Steel Challenge or a falling steel match than I am to go shoot USPSA because they are more relaxing and require less pure focus (no memory stages... no figuring out reloads, etc).  For me, the fun of USPSA is in the mental challenges.  Figuring out stages, reloads, memory problems, etc.  The problem is that the mental focus required is also sometimes a downer for the average shooter that wants to compete but doesn't want to have to put in all that effort.

[Reg1217]

So I recently tried action shooting as well as uspsa and lost interest very quickly. 

 

Why? 

 

5 minutes of shooting...4 hours of standing around.

 

ALL the local matches sell out in minutes and they have the most asinine sign up system too. Apparently match sign up happens sometime around 2 or 3 am. It's ridiculous and the same people show up to every match at every club in the area.

 

They lump in beginners as well as more casual folks with the ultra competitive, tacticool, operator types who have a perma-grimace on their faces. These guys look at you with disgust for showing up with your stock g19 and an IWB holster ( you know, a gun for the real world that you actually carry everyday ), as if they were competing for the super bowl.

 

I have to shoot >= 9mm which isn't a recoil issue for me (though it might be for some) but it definitely is a cost issue.  That makes it 4-5x more expensive than 22lr. Why not have a  divison with no scoring where you can bring any caliber or whatever you want and entirely for fun?

 

So as much as I'd like to get into it further, I realized it's not a good fit with regards to time, cost, attitudes and the community which is too bad because shooting courses is otherwise really fun.

Edited February 6, 2019 by Zara43
Typo

[Sarge]

2 minutes ago, Zara43 said:

So I recently tried action shooting as well as uspsa and lost interest very quickly. 

 

Why? 

 

5 minutes of shooting...4 hours of standing around.

 

ALL the local matches sell out in minutes and they have the most asinine sign up system too. Apparently match sign up happens sometime around 2 or 3 am. It's ridiculous and the same people show up to every match at every club in the area.

 

They lump in beginners as well as more casual folks with the ultra competitive, tacticool, operator types who have a perma-grimace on their faces. These guys look at you with disgust for showing up with your stock g19 and an IWB holster ( you know, a gun for the real world that you actually carry everyday ), as if they were competing for the super bowl.

 

I have to shoot >= 9mm which isn't a recoil issue for me (though it might be for some) but it definitely is a cost issue.  That makes it 4-5x more expensive than 22lr. Why not have a  divison with no scoring where you can bring any caliber or whatever you want and entirely for fun?

 

So as much as I'd like to get into it further, I realized it's not a good fit with regards to time, cost, attitudes and the community which is too bad because shooting courses is otherwise really fun.

It’s not for everybody. Thank goodness! 

[RJH]

36 minutes ago, Zara43 said:

So I recently tried action shooting as well as uspsa and lost interest very quickly. 

 

Why? 

 

5 minutes of shooting...4 hours of standing around.

 

ALL the local matches sell out in minutes and they have the most asinine sign up system too. Apparently match sign up happens sometime around 2 or 3 am. It's ridiculous and the same people show up to every match at every club in the area.

 

They lump in beginners as well as more casual folks with the ultra competitive, tacticool, operator types who have a perma-grimace on their faces. These guys look at you with disgust for showing up with your stock g19 and an IWB holster ( you know, a gun for the real world that you actually carry everyday ), as if they were competing for the super bowl.

 

I have to shoot >= 9mm which isn't a recoil issue for me (though it might be for some) but it definitely is a cost issue.  That makes it 4-5x more expensive than 22lr. Why not have a  divison with no scoring where you can bring any caliber or whatever you want and entirely for fun?

 

So as much as I'd like to get into it further, I realized it's not a good fit with regards to time, cost, attitudes and the community which is too bad because shooting courses is otherwise really fun.

 

There are all types at matches that is for sure, and there is no way i know of to get around the shooting for a couple of minutes and working (notice i don't say standing around)  for a few hours.

However,  your 9mm is fine and even the best caliber for production, where your pistol fits the best too. I think if you just do it for the gun handleing experience, it is about the best feedback you can get.  Maybe try idpa as well, it might fit what you are looking for a little better

[GrumpyOne]

1 hour ago, Zara43 said:

So I recently tried action shooting as well as uspsa and lost interest very quickly. 

 

Why? 

 

5 minutes of shooting...4 hours of standing around.

 

ALL the local matches sell out in minutes and they have the most asinine sign up system too. Apparently match sign up happens sometime around 2 or 3 am. It's ridiculous and the same people show up to every match at every club in the area.

 

They lump in beginners as well as more casual folks with the ultra competitive, tacticool, operator types who have a perma-grimace on their faces. These guys look at you with disgust for showing up with your stock g19 and an IWB holster ( you know, a gun for the real world that you actually carry everyday ), as if they were competing for the super bowl.

 

I have to shoot >= 9mm which isn't a recoil issue for me (though it might be for some) but it definitely is a cost issue.  That makes it 4-5x more expensive than 22lr. Why not have a  divison with no scoring where you can bring any caliber or whatever you want and entirely for fun?

 

So as much as I'd like to get into it further, I realized it's not a good fit with regards to time, cost, attitudes and the community which is too bad because shooting courses is otherwise really fun.

You should look into Steel Challenge.

[Reg1217]

25 minutes ago, RJH said:

 

There are all types at matches that is for sure, and there is no way i know of to get around the shooting for a couple of minutes and working (notice i don't say standing around)  for a few hours.

However,  your 9mm is fine and even the best caliber for production, where your pistol fits the best too. I think if you just do it for the gun handleing experience, it is about the best feedback you can get.  Maybe try idpa as well, it might fit what you are looking for a little better

 

Thanks for the suggestion @RJH. I've only shot uspsa but from the way some of the folks I met spoke, there's some sort of divide or maybe tribalism is a better word for it, between idpa and uspsa. 

 

I'm waiting for the next IDPA match in hopes I doesn't sell ou as I'd really like try it. Running and gunning uspsa style is awesome but ultimately IDPA sounds more aligned with what I care about which is just being a good shooter for defensive purposes and having fun. 

 

@GrumpyOne thanks for the suggestion. I'm planning on trying that too. The shoot what u bring aspect is really appealing. 

 

 

Edited February 6, 2019 by Zara43

[SWprotected]

On ‎8‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 5:23 AM, Dbw2223 said:

My wife LOVES to shoot...as long as it’s just punching paper. She just doesn’t get into the whole competition aspect and has some stigma about people watching her.

 The funny thing is this is not uncommon. I have a buddy who started IDPA at the same time I did, after a few matches I was hooked and wanted to shoot all the time so I started shooting USPSA and outlaw steel. I thought shooting steel was a blast and encouraged my buddy to come out to the next match, when it was over he said he didn't like it that at least in IDPA you could shoot fast and no one could see you missing. I guess the tolerance for having our ego hurt varies, I just explain my misses as accuracy by volume.

[davidb72]

37 minutes ago, Zara43 said:

 

Thanks for the suggestion @RJH. I've only shot uspsa but from the way some of the folks I met spoke, there's some sort of divide or maybe tribalism is a better word for it, between idpa and uspsa. 

 

I'm waiting for the next IDPA match in hopes I doesn't sell ou as I'd really like try it. Running and gunning uspsa style is awesome but ultimately IDPA sounds more aligned with what I care about which is just being a good shooter for defensive purposes and having fun. 

 

@GrumpyOne thanks for the suggestion. I'm planning on trying that too. The shoot what u bring aspect is really appealing. 

 

 

IDPA is definitely worth trying. FYI - they will not let you use an appendix holster.

 

[nick779]

Ive been shooting infrequently since Dec 2017 when I bought my first pistol. I went to the range weekly for about 6 months and went through a box of ammo at least once a week. Took most of the Summer off (Didnt know about USPSA/IDPA), got back into it over the Fall & Winter 2018 and here we are. Ran a "tactical pistol" course at my local range, met some great people and immediately deep dived into what I need in order to have a go at USPSA this year.

 

Yeah im not going to be pulling double tap splits in the teens or hitting M in one summer, but the whole goal was to add a totally new dynamic to the boring "shoot your lane" at the range and meet some people with similar interests. Ill probably be a casual USPSA'r and hope to make 1-2 matches a month, might dry fire once a week but im ok with that.

 

Im sure ill meet a few people with a poor attitude, but thats life.

 

My biggest hurdle was getting into a local range, all of the ranges in my area require a member "sponsor" and nobody in my family in this area shoots. I joined an "expensive" range ($600/yr), no sponsor, indoor only. Im really hoping to switch to another local range that seems to be better equipped for the kind of shooting im interested in. (Its also $100/yr...)

[dcs12345]

1. A lot of people don’t like looking bad in front of others, even though most people had to do the same at the beginning. This could include shooting skill and the large amount of rules. 

2. Equipment costs

3. Ammo costs

4. Time. Both the amount and the time of day that most matches are scheduled. All the matches in my area are early in the day,  it a fair number of people don’t want to participate then due to family commitments. 

 

[blueorison]

On 2/6/2019 at 11:09 AM, SWprotected said:

 The funny thing is this is not uncommon. I have a buddy who started IDPA at the same time I did, after a few matches I was hooked and wanted to shoot all the time so I started shooting USPSA and outlaw steel. I thought shooting steel was a blast and encouraged my buddy to come out to the next match, when it was over he said he didn't like it that at least in IDPA you could shoot fast and no one could see you missing. I guess the tolerance for having our ego hurt varies, I just explain my misses as accuracy by volume.

 

hahahahhahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahhaha

 

I cannot stop laughing, mentally.

 

Lots of hurt egos, forsure.

 

Also, people are timid, because they are timid.

 

Try it once, then don't waste your time trying to get the horse to drink. You have better things to do, sir.

[Sawdustnsteel]

As a new guy, first I think a lot of the “ they don’t like actually shooting, they don’t want to loose to x, Et all” responses are well, bulls#!t... set aside your ego a minute and consider it might not actually be fun to others. Or that the picture you paint while may look like fine art to you looks like finger painting to them.... try showing them in another way.. because if your saying that, your conveying it..

 

it would be much the same where I and combat vets to show up at your match and ask “ why aren’t you fighting in Iraq or Afghanistan? Chickensiht? You a pussy? Got “bad knees?” *snicker*  not exactly fair nor kind to toss about s#!t like that right? 

 

Take the siht talking out of it, leave the ego at home. And invite them out to shoot with you.. then set up a practice match of sorts so they can see how it really is and not that it’s some yard stick for dick measuring. You actually might get them to come shoot a match then... or take them to a steel match if they shoot steel.

 

i was lucky enough to have a group  ( JJ Racaza, Marco, Junior, Steve and RJ at magnus sports in Las Vegas)of guys local to me who saw my lov3 of guns and mil history and invited me to try it out, two years later and helping set up and tears down ranges for a few months I went and shot a steel match. This while building my gear out and picking up specific firearms. I continued to shoot my steel targets in the desert with my wife until I was comfortable and ready to be around a group of strangers with guns and have enough of my stuff squared away with some understanding of what all it entails without wasting my time or that of others..

 

 

figure anyone who has firearms has enough interest in them to be able to use them competently and will want to become more proficient at thier use, if they’re refusing to do your thing with you, it’s likely not thier lack of desire to shoot but your ability to present it as something fun and worth giving a go. So.... try another approach...

 

even something as simple as getting ahold of your local match director and seeing if it’s possible to open a stage for new people to try out may be just the thing to give them a moment to enjoy what’s going on and want to invest money/time into getting a rig set up and practicing.

[teros135]

Participation trophies and safe spaces would probably help, too...

[blueorison]

5 minutes ago, teros135 said:

Participation trophies and safe spaces would probably help, too...

 

It is my opinion that, the toughest "tactical" guys take the most coddling, perhaps because they've so much farther to fall, from the image they try to portray in their minds/to others. It takes longer to bubble wrap their giant egos.

 

Cognitive dissonance is when you own NODs and a $3k Glock that barely functions but cant hit anything with it, so you shoot 5yd giant ipsc steel targets to feel good about it. Which is fine, you do you. You aren't hurting anyone, else. If you are angry because this represents you, dude, who cares what I think? My goal isnt to smirk or condescend.

 

This post sounds disparaging, I get that. What is true is that I've poured so much caring energy and been burned out by such individuals. Literally, spoken softly to them to encourage them when they get so hot under the collar at matches that lead to very UNSAFE behavior. They honestly scare me, safety-wise. I'm not going to marginalize and lump everyone who comes out with a battlebelt and rmrd Glock with a surefire into one group.

 

I'm not speaking of actual professionals like rangers etc. that do come out to learn and have fun and teach others really cool life lessons. You can almost immediately tell the difference between a tactical dude and a professional from their demeanor.

 

Another poster above mentioned "show the it isnt a dick measuring match". Tactical dudes are the first to turn anything into a dick measuring match, at which time I want to recuse myself, because I am so worn from listening to braggarts.

 

Again, in this day and age when everyone looks for ways to be angry; this isn't hate thrown towards a certain group of individuals. This my PERSONAL experience, and perhaps not just my own, shared in response to the OPs prompt, in order to illuminate a single perspective/answer. If you think of yoursels as ultra tactical, this doesn't mean I'm speaking of you. I simply lack a better descriptor except this common visual denominator I have come to be accustomed to.

 

 

 

 

[Sawdustnsteel]

15 minutes ago, blueorison said:

 

I'm not speaking of actual professionals like rangers etc. that do come out to learn and have fun and teach others really cool life lessons. You can almost immediately tell the difference between a tactical dude and a professional from their demeanor.

 

Another poster above mentioned "show the it isnt a dick measuring match". Tactical dudes are the first to turn anything into a dick measuring match, at which time I want to recuse myself, because I am so worn from listening to braggarts.

 

Again, in this day and age when everyone looks for ways to be angry; this isn't hate thrown towards a certain group of individuals. This my PERSONAL experience, and perhaps not just my own, shared in response to the OPs prompt, in order to illuminate a single perspective/answer. If you think of yoursels as ultra tactical, this doesn't mean I'm speaking of you. I simply lack a better descriptor except this common visual denominator I have come to be accustomed to.

 

 

This is the point I was just making.. 

the same thing can be and is often found among the wanna-be warrior guys who wear more s#!t to the range than even long tabs get issued, to a T they are quick to invite actual combat vets out to shoot... then snicker and talk s#!t when a  four deployment infantry vet can’t hit s#!t with mr tacticools 3k glock handbag... nevermind the infantry kid has a reoccurring nightmare of all the bodies he’s dropped and has proven skills with an AR...

 

its a huge reason why more military vets aren’t participating in shooting sports, who the hell wants to be a yardstick?.

 

if you want more pals on your playground, show them what the game is, share your toys, and teach them to play nice because you do.. 

if you want to ensure they won’t come back, bitch about them firing 3 mags of ammo, trash thier stance and effort, and talk s#!t to them about sucking... 

 

in the Army, no one gets “torn down and built back up” they get instructed, shown, and encouraged to practice perfect. Because if your leading men up a hill you want them keeping up, not aiming at the back of your head.

 

[Sarge]

1 hour ago, Sawdustnsteel said:

This is the point I was just making.. 

the same thing can be and is often found among the wanna-be warrior guys who wear more s#!t to the range than even long tabs get issued, to a T they are quick to invite actual combat vets out to shoot... then snicker and talk s#!t when a  four deployment infantry vet can’t hit s#!t with mr tacticools 3k glock handbag... nevermind the infantry kid has a reoccurring nightmare of all the bodies he’s dropped and has proven skills with an AR...

 

its a huge reason why more military vets aren’t participating in shooting sports, who the hell wants to be a yardstick?.

 

if you want more pals on your playground, show them what the game is, share your toys, and teach them to play nice because you do.. 

if you want to ensure they won’t come back, bitch about them firing 3 mags of ammo, trash thier stance and effort, and talk s#!t to them about sucking... 

 

in the Army, no one gets “torn down and built back up” they get instructed, shown, and encouraged to practice perfect. Because if your leading men up a hill you want them keeping up, not aiming at the back of your head.

 

Just curious, You military? What branch and when?

Edited February 22, 2019 by Sarge

[Sarge]

This thread, like many others, eventually turned into a s#!t show. I am more than happy to take a newb to a match to let them check it out and yes, I'll forgo trying to shoot well and walk them through their first match if they want to shoot. But it pretty much ends there for me. They either come back or they don't. I don't have the time to make the sport more appealing by nurse maiding them all summer. 

  We rarely see tactical nerds around our matches here. Most of those guys really can't shoot anyway and I was in the Army long enough to know there are more poor shots than there are good ones among actual military vets. Every unit I was ever in had a good sized group of troops that just couldn't shoot for crap. It's just not something everybody does well. Same goes for LEO. Carrying a gun all day every day for work does not equate to an expert with that gun. We have some pretty good LEO shooters around here but not all for sure.

[Sawdustnsteel]

1 hour ago, Sarge said:

This thread, like many others, eventually turned into a s#!t show. I am more than happy to take a newb to a match to let them check it out and yes, I'll forgo trying to shoot well and walk them through their first match if they want to shoot. But it pretty much ends there for me. They either come back or they don't. I don't have the time to make the sport more appealing by nurse maiding them all summer. 

  We rarely see tactical nerds around our matches here. Most of those guys really can't shoot anyway and I was in the Army long enough to know there are more poor shots than there are good ones among actual military vets. Every unit I was ever in had a good sized group of troops that just couldn't shoot for crap. It's just not something everybody does well. Same goes for LEO. Carrying a gun all day every day for work does not equate to an expert with that gun. We have some pretty good LEO shooters around here but not all for sure.

Pmed you as well..

 

im not saying butter up everyone’s butt.

i am saying coming cold from the street to try out a match with multiple different organizations,typically on the same day all with different rules cane be a bit more than daunting...

even moreso with most vets ( because they’re already jaded to shooting with others ref: tacticool douches who’ve already pissed them off) 

 

most who who take up shooting sports do so because they know someone... they continue for the same reason, least from what I observed thus far. Groups of friends squad together,  hang out outside of match day Et al .. if you want your friends to come play show them how, explain ,the rules, and let them blast junk targets from last match until they feel comfortable enough to try it timed. I equate it to riding motorcycles, no way in hell am I gonna spend a day showing where the controls are onany bike I own then putting someone on it and riding alongside them on a spare bike and callin it good cause they saw it on tv, heard me rev a bike or work on one.. be like me taking someone on a ride they get back with me whiteknuckled with pants full of s#!t and stare blankly at them while saying “ what’s the problem? You can drive a car Right?”

 

same with shooting sports... unrealistic to expect anyone to just “get it” 

[Joe4d]

nah but they just need to do a bit of effort and look up rule book and show up. In my experience,,, if u have to beg and plead and butter them up,, the wont stick around.. Goes for most expensive , hard sports

 

[RJH]

7 hours ago, Joe4d said:

nah but they just need to do a bit of effort and look up rule book and show up. In my experience,,, if u have to beg and plead and butter them up,, the wont stick around.. Goes for most expensive , hard sports

 

 

This right here.  Saw my first match on Shooting USA, said that looks neat.  Got online, actually looked up the rules and found a match all by myself,  then i went to the match and shot it.  I knew no one there and had never shot in any competitions before.  This was 14 or so years ago.  Since then i have asked tons of people to shoot, virtually no one has.  You either like it and want to do it or you don't.  I like to fish but have no desire to do it competitively, i think it is much the same with shooters.  I will still  tell people they should come out and give them the basics if they ask, but i ain't coddling people along, cause most people have other things they want to do with their time, and that is fine with me.