RO Suspected of Cheating in USPSA Matches

[JakeMartens]

This has been released from Phil Strader:

USPSA has recently been presented with information regarding alleged misrepresentations of shooters’ stage times during major matches.

Currently, the accused Range Officer has had his RO duties suspended by NROI.

We take these allegations seriously, and we will do everything within our power to review the facts and come to a fair and equitable decision.

Not only does USPSA expect its certified Range Officials to maintain integrity and honesty while volunteering at these events, we also expect our members to exercise discretion and diplomacy during our investigation. Public character assassinations and threats will not be tolerated and will be addressed by me personally. This type of behavior can effect as much damage to USPSA as the dishonest actions of a match official, and I will do what is necessary to ensure that our organization is protected.

[deerassassin22]

TLDR

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[Guest]

^^^^

TLDR = Too Long, Didn't Read

[deerassassin22]

^^Thanks

[motosapiens]

Yeah, when the first place is over $10k, yes people will do they can to win it. I know it's dead now. I am part of the reason that when you type in the two words "paintball is", google auto- completes, "paintball is dead". I made millions selling the game (LMFAO!) in my time when it was hot. I can promise you, this game isn't ready for prime time with an article like that, people cheat, and the games crumble. Let's not talk about how much I made from airsoft toys, great profit margins for the wannabes...

Still lol-ing. I probably shouldn't out this, but there's a local very good shooter who made the mistake once of saying "I was a badazz paintballer". As you might imagine, great hilarity ensued.

I'm gonna learn to crochet someday.

[Jamiethesquid]

I have attached pictures of both of the timers you spoke of. They show the split in the upper corner and the lower right hand corner on both. As the shooter the score keeper and the RO. I need to have an idea in my head as to what that timer should say at the end of the course of fire. We have gotten into a bad habit of yelling the total time over our shoulder and pasting and scoring targets behind the shooter.

Let's make up an example. We walk up to the stage. I am your RO, I give the WSB and give you the 5 minutes for a walk through. Assuming this is a local match. I have tested my timer and know it is working properly. Let's say it is an 18 shot Virginia Count stage, standing in one box, with two mandatory reloads and a freestyle, strong, weak type of config. So first of all. I know that the timer should pick up 18 shots if the shooter fires only the required number of shots. Both of these timers and My CED 7000 and others show the time, the split and the number of shots fired.

Shooter 1 steps up, Load and Make Ready, Are You Ready?, Standby, BEEP!! ....Bang, Bang, Bang.... If you are finished unload and show clear, if clear hammer down and holster, range is Clear!! I look down at the timer.

This shooter is an A class production shooter, very accurate, good tempo, good splits, good transitions, quick reloads, shot all targets smoothly, and fired two at each target no extra shots fired. Remember I am watching the gun.

So as the RO I know that this stage should be in the low teens for a guy of this level. After the Range is clear command. I look down at the timer and it says.....14.55 sec 18 shots, split .22 sec. Looks good right? Show it to the score keeper who sees the same as I call it out and show it to the shooter also.

Now what happens if I look down at the timer and it shows 12 shots in 8.10 seconds. Or 27 shots in 33.45? Do I just yell out the time and move on. Or do I say hey wait a minute? What if the split displayed says 4.75 seconds, and 17 shots fired. You think I should roger up to the shooter and investigate why the timer is picking up shots from the neighboring Bay. That is my point.

The split displayed on the screen is the time between the last shot fired and the shot that came before it. Make sure it makes sense for the stage you are running/shooting/scoring.

Don't get me started on these guys that shoot a stage, and as soon as I say "If you are Fin..." They have done the "Ninja Flip, jack the slide, catch the round, dryfire and holster before I get through the command. I look them right in the eye Tell them to grow up and ULSC, properly or move them to the Mall Ninja squad.

Edited June 20, 2014 by Jamiethesquid

[A-shot]

Yeah, when the first place is over $10k, yes people will do they can to win it. I know it's dead now. I am part of the reason that when you type in the two words "paintball is", google auto- completes, "paintball is dead". I made millions selling the game (LMFAO!) in my time when it was hot. I can promise you, this game isn't ready for prime time with an article like that, people cheat, and the games crumble. Let's not talk about how much I made from airsoft toys, great profit margins for the wannabes...

Still lol-ing. I probably shouldn't out this, but there's a local very good shooter who made the mistake once of saying "I was a badazz paintballer". As you might imagine, great hilarity ensued.

I'm gonna learn to crochet someday.

I understand and don't take offense. The game is laughable. And if anyone cared about what people thought about them, shooting sports of any kind are totally the wrong thing to be in. I'd imagine this dude that just got banned and had his card pulled will be thinking about it for a long time. I was far from a badass when I played. I did make a killing at it. That allowed me to sell brass to everyone at a loss, so we can all play the game. I know how to crochet like a madman.....

Edited June 20, 2014 by A-shot

[BritinUSA]

Shooter 1 steps up, Load and Make Ready, Are You Ready?, Standby, BEEP!! ....Bang, Bang, Bang.... If you are finished unload and show clear, if clear hammer down and holster, range is Clear!! I look down at the timer.

I glance at the timer just before I call ULASC, that way I have an indication of the time in case something else causes the time to increment such as the ejected round hitting the timer or anything else bumping the timer.

At the final position of the stage I will hold the timer close to the competitor and in such a way that I can watch the time increment while I watch the gun as well to ensure that the final shots are picked up correctly.

[Mark R]

As a RO, after the last shot of the stage is fired, the RO should look briefly at the timer, then pull it away from the shooter so the timer does not pick up the ULSC process of racking the slide.

This happened when I was ROing a A/M class shooter (Randal W) at the 2014 AL Section match this year. The shooter knew he should have shot the stage in such-n-such time, with a double tap on the last two shots of the stage. During ULSC, the timer picked up his slide rack and added about 4-6 seconds to his time. After "Range is Clear", I called out the time and he asked to review the timer. We discovered that the last split was 4-6 seconds, yet his last two shots were a double tap on the last target. Discussed with RM and we backed up his time to the proper call.

[JakeMartens]

Jack Suber's response to my question of when was it presented to him (I also asked this of Jay Corn) as it has been alleged that this was presented to them prior to it hitting the other forum

Jake Martens, why do you think someone would mention it to me before hand? I found out about this when I read it here. I am not the Section Coordinator. I was never contacted about this before the South Carolina Sectional. I heard rumors about cheating a little over a week ago but no names. Please get the facts correct.

[pinkycatcher]

This is sad; I have shot this sport since 1979 and honor and integrity are what

defines our sport. What little I have seen about the RO in question is that he

looks at the timer and calls out the time without showing the scoring RO the

timer. I'm not longer an RO (was a Cop for 40 years), but every time I ran a

shooter I showed the timer to the scoring RO. I believe these allegations need

to be investigated and we should hold off convicting this guy until enough

evidence is found to do so.................

What does you having been a cop have to do with anything? Let alone being an RO?

[paul788]

Several posts have mentioned not allowing scoring behind the shooter as a way to avoid cheating for or against a shooter. Some of the Level 2 and Level 3 matches in the Southeast have made it standard practice to score behind the shooter where possible to reduce the amount of time between shooters and thus allow more shooters to compete. The offer is made to the whole squad to designate someone to accompany the scorekeeper to verify the calls before the first shooter hears "Make Ready". The stage staff does all pasting and resetting. The only person downrange other than staff is the shooter and the designated score checker if requested. At Area 6 we were turning shooters is under 3 1/2 minutes on stage 11. Think of the increase in shooters at a match if we reduce from 5 minutes per shooter to 3 minutes.

Please don't make a bunch of knee-jerk reactions to one individual's actions. Any changes to methods of ROing shooters need long consideration.

Paul Beck

A49023, CRO

[mgardner]

There's no fool proof method to eliminate cheating because someone will always figure a way to do it. All we can do is thin the herd when bad actors are found and go on. There's too much good about USPSA and the system to spend too much time lamenting the bad.

[Flatland Shooter]

Scoring behind the shooter is not a big deal as long as the shooter can have a representative accompany the scorer and the scorer calls out the target as he goes along. Been doing this for years, its nothing new.

Since I usually shoot with friends, its not a problem getting one of them to represent me.

Bill

[Sarge]

Scoring behind the shooter is not a big deal as long as the shooter can have a representative accompany the scorer and the scorer calls out the target as he goes along. Been doing this for years, its nothing new.

Since I usually shoot with friends, its not a problem getting one of them to represent me.

Bill

Sort of do the same thing here. If there is a mike or no shoot we typically hold off on pasting so the shooter can see that. It actually works pretty well for local matches. Typically don't do it in majors.

[Stlhead]

Where was this response from Mr. Strader published? If this is indeed the official response from our organization I am quite disappointed.

So the first rule of fight club has been invoked? If unequivocal evidence is presented that an individual has committed many blatant and willful acts that make a mockery of the sport it should not be discussed? Even a cursory review of the information that has been presented on this matter is a character assassination for "The Accused". Discussing the possibility of permanent banning from the sport could be construed as a threat, so apparently this too would bring the personal wrath of Mr Strader down upon the member who dares discuss it. The only outrage in this response is directed at the people who are foolhardy enough to debate the matter, not those that participated in the cheating. Notice I say those, because not only the person who perpetrated the fraud, but anyone who benefited from it knowingly or not was a participant.

A clear message is sent by this response, the leadership of USPSA is far more concerned with the negative PR associated with this issue than the actual impact of the issue on our sport. It was meant to be some sort of gag order. Here my response.

First a character assignation; After reviewing the video evidence I personally believe without doubt that Mr Paul Hendrix has intentionally scored people that he has officiated incorrectly for his own personal reasons. In light of this it is clear to me that he is a dishonest and reprehensible individual who is unworthy of associating with under any circumstances.

Now for the threat; If Mr Hendrix where on fire in the middle of the street I would probably urinate on him to extinguish the flames, but I would certainly have some serious reservations about it afterwards.

As I have violated the direct orders of the duly elected USPSA president, I stand prepared to be personally dealt with By Mr Strader. Will my punishment be harsher than the one handed down to the accused? Will I receive a stern talking to, or possibly have my membership revoked, will my classifiers be "lost", denied a slot to nationals?

This scandal will define USPSA going forward for me personally. I hope it ends well and I can come away with some shred of respect for the organization, If not then I am certain that I will not be missed any more than Mr Hendrix.

This has been released from Phil Strader:


USPSA has recently been presented with information regarding alleged misrepresentations of shooters’ stage times during major matches.

Currently, the accused Range Officer has had his RO duties suspended by NROI.

We take these allegations seriously, and we will do everything within our power to review the facts and come to a fair and equitable decision.

Not only does USPSA expect its certified Range Officials to maintain integrity and honesty while volunteering at these events, we also expect our members to exercise discretion and diplomacy during our investigation. Public character assassinations and threats will not be tolerated and will be addressed by me personally. This type of behavior can effect as much damage to USPSA as the dishonest actions of a match official, and I will do what is necessary to ensure that our organization is protected.

[Sarge]

Where was this response from Mr. Strader published? If this is indeed the official response from our organization I am quite disappointed.

So the first rule of fight club has been invoked? If unequivocal evidence is presented that an individual has committed many blatant and willful acts that make a mockery of the sport it should not be discussed? Even a cursory review of the information that has been presented on this matter is a character assassination for "The Accused". Discussing the possibility of permanent banning from the sport could be construed as a threat, so apparently this too would bring the personal wrath of Mr Strader down upon the member who dares discuss it. The only outrage in this response is directed at the people who are foolhardy enough to debate the matter, not those that participated in the cheating. Notice I say those, because not only the person who perpetrated the fraud, but anyone who benefited from it knowingly or not was a participant.

A clear message is sent by this response, the leadership of USPSA is far more concerned with the negative PR associated with this issue than the actual impact of the issue on our sport. It was meant to be some sort of gag order. Here my response.

First a character assignation; After reviewing the video evidence I personally believe without doubt that Mr Paul Hendrix has intentionally scored people that he has officiated incorrectly for his own personal reasons. In light of this it is clear to me that he is a dishonest and reprehensible individual who is unworthy of associating with under any circumstances.

Now for the threat; If Mr Hendrix where on fire in the middle of the street I would probably urinate on him to extinguish the flames, but I would certainly have some serious reservations about it afterwards.

As I have violated the direct orders of the duly elected USPSA president, I stand prepared to be personally dealt with By Mr Strader. Will my punishment be harsher than the one handed down to the accused? Will I receive a stern talking to, or possibly have my membership revoked, will my classifiers be "lost", denied a slot to nationals?

This scandal will define USPSA going forward for me personally. I hope it ends well and I can come away with some shred of respect for the organization, If not then I am certain that I will not be missed any more than Mr Hendrix.

This has been released from Phil Strader:

USPSA has recently been presented with information regarding alleged misrepresentations of shooters’ stage times during major matches.

Currently, the accused Range Officer has had his RO duties suspended by NROI.

We take these allegations seriously, and we will do everything within our power to review the facts and come to a fair and equitable decision.

Not only does USPSA expect its certified Range Officials to maintain integrity and honesty while volunteering at these events, we also expect our members to exercise discretion and diplomacy during our investigation. Public character assassinations and threats will not be tolerated and will be addressed by me personally. This type of behavior can effect as much damage to USPSA as the dishonest actions of a match official, and I will do what is necessary to ensure that our organization is protected.

I don't see it in quite the same light that you do. I do think it was unnecessary for the PREZ to add the comments about members being dealt with personally for discussing this in a negative way. I have seen this many times in various jobs I have held. If somebody gets caught doing something wrong they seem to suffer less than those who reported it or those who followed the rules in the first place. When you get right down to it, discussing the actions of a cheater in our sport is not what damages us. It's the cheater that damages us. PERIOD

[RammerJammer]

Personally the fact that every 'scandal' in USPA is shrouded in secrecy and not allowed to be discussed makes me think I know about 1/8 of the shiftiness involved in the sport. If it was talked about and there was some transparency I would have more faith but the code of silence to me is more troubling than the actual event.

[A-shot]

^^^^ This is the truth.

[Sparky]

This is sad; I have shot this sport since 1979 and honor and integrity are what

defines our sport. What little I have seen about the RO in question is that he

looks at the timer and calls out the time without showing the scoring RO the

timer. I'm not longer an RO (was a Cop for 40 years), but every time I ran a

shooter I showed the timer to the scoring RO. I believe these allegations need

to be investigated and we should hold off convicting this guy until enough

evidence is found to do so.................

What does you having been a cop have to do with anything? Let alone being an RO?

William,

The RO in question was a Cop. Just stating my background and opinion; which I have

a right to do.

Ron

[bajaholic]

I feel the comments regarding USPSA are about as "lawyer'ed" up as anyone one would expect at this point. And rightly so... Do I agree, not completely, But I can see why...

As an organization, or really any business entity there is risk, exposure, loss and mitigating circumstances that need to be investigated. Until actual facts and interviews can be made, it is hearsay. Once that facts have been presented actual rulings can be made.

At that point it is really fair game to discuss, disclose and judge. Until then it is the jury of public opinion, not facts.

This could have serious legal implications if it was not handled properly including criminal charges... So they need to be very careful.

I would also recommend taking a softer approach against the actual people involved until the allegations are proved. because if it was proven to be a witch hunt, exposure is an issue and could come back against those that posted personal attacks to those involved.

Honesty/Integrity/respect is harder to find in the world today.... But personally, I feel if the people that are wrong, take responsibility and own up to it, we can all move forward much faster and heal from it. That is where personal peer pressure from their inner circle would be the best resolve....

[kooyahdesigns]

Personally the fact that every 'scandal' in USPA is shrouded in secrecy and not allowed to be discussed makes me think I know about 1/8 of the shiftiness involved in the sport. If it was talked about and there was some transparency I would have more faith but the code of silence to me is more troubling than the actual event.

+1

[kneelingatlas]

Why are so many members looking to USPSA to dish out vengeance? This doesn't really effect any of us who live in other parts of the country and will likely never cross paths with this RO, and I feel confident those who do know him have made their judgement already, so it's up to them to exclude him if they wish. I know I wouldn't sign up under his name on the squad sheet...

[Flexmoney]

Some of you guys act like USPSA hasn't ever been sued for running off at the mouth before.

Also, some of you are uptight about past Executive Sessions in meetings. Some have pointed out that they have been on Boards and that they only went into executive session when there was an issue that might have legal/medical/employee concerns (basically, privacy matters)... Well, duh.

Consider your source/premise. Anything you hear from an individual BOD member is going to be their personal take on things. It ain't gospel.

As for Phil's note...that is what it was. It was a note from the President. (I read it online like a everybody else.) That is his purgative.

[ETA: This is just my personal opinion.]

[Neomet]

Every time there is serious competition there will be some who cheat. A sad but true story. I've seen cheating in everything from recreational softball leagues and local 10Ks to F1 and MLB. This sport is no exception. "Major" ammo, buddies "accidentally" taping a target before it is scored on a bad run, bullying ROs into calling a double that isn't there. It happens. By the same token the vast majority of shooters are honest competitors that I am proud to shoot with. The actions of a few should not reflect on the whole game.

If there is convincing evidence that this person (and whoever else may be implicated) have cheated to the level it appears they have they should be banned from the sport. Period. No probation, no stint in rehab. Gone. Some effort at safeguarding is a good idea but there will always be people who will find ways to cheat that you won't think of simply because your mind doesn't work that way.