RO Suspected of Cheating in USPSA Matches

[deerassassin22]

What do ya'll think have you seen the news?

http://www.gunssavelife.com/?p=12564&utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=breaking-uspsa-cheating-scandal-uncovered

[outerlimits]

IBTL

[sirveyr]

IBFNTT

(In Before Flex Nukes This Thread)

You can't discuss real USPSA issues here. Go to The Doodie Project.

[PKT1106]

This has been discussed over on some other forums for the last 24 hours and has garnered MAJOR attention. Word has it that his RO certs have been suspended and the BOD is working this issue. Barring a formal statement from Strader or Amidon, I think that's where we're at right now. If anyone else has other info or I need corrected, please do speak up.

[PKT1106]

IBFNTT

(In Before Flex Nukes This Thread)

You can't discuss real USPSA issues here. Go to The Doodie Project.

As long as we don't violate any forum rules, why would he nuke it?

[deerassassin22]

I'm curious to see if this will be investigated. I mean does USPSA do formal investigations into things? I have never seen this before.

[Chills1994]

screw this cheating scandal! Have the classifier high hit factors been published yet?

How about a records webpage of the top 10 best HF's shot on each classifier per division?

Boy, wouldn't that be funny if we noticed a trend of somebody shooting a bunch of 110% classifiers?

[Jayohee]

Wow. Hope they perma-ban that guy. Or susupend him for a few years at least

Edited June 19, 2014 by Jayohee

[deerassassin22]

I would home Permanent ban on any type of shooting sport including air rifle, archery, anything

[PKT1106]

Wow. Hope they perma-ban that guy. Or susupend him for a few years at least. Douche

This is why these threads get locked. If you want to sling mud and call names, take it to doodie. If you want to talk about it here, at least follow the forum rules.

[Jayohee]

No problem

[Magnus DUX]

His membership should have been suspended as well.

[deerassassin22]

I agree but how are they going to prove it. I'm in bed and don't feel like getting up but don't the rules say you can't use videos as evidence? I know it pertains while shooting a match

[JoeBoboutfitters]

Not the most stealthy way to cheat...

Hopefully the awareness brough to the situation will set a standard and nip others in the bud or stop if they are currently operating similarly

[hitman]

This is another good reason to show the timer to the shooter.

But as poorly as I shoot and slow as I move I just shoot for fun now.

[Lifeislarge]

I am certain that the court of public opinion is going to nix the guys future in any shooting events other than the lowliest of local club matches in parts of the country that perhaps don't have the best Internet access. Regardless of what the USPSA does, I doubt that he would get through the gate at one of my local matches.

[deerassassin22]

I never look at the timer but at major matches looks like I might start

[Sarge]

I would think this might lead to some changes down the line. I see offering a view of the timer to the shooter becoming the norm, if not in fact a rule. As for revoking all credentials of a PROVEN cheater of this magnitude, I am all for it. But I am also a big fan of due process.

[L3324temp]

The shooter also needs to review the times of last split if they want to keep the RO honest.

[Red Ryder]

I am pretty sure "this guy" is not the reason I'm still high C class.

[Chris Keen]

The shooter also needs to review the times of last split if they want to keep the RO honest.

Agreed. There are too many ways for an RO (anyone holding the timer) to cheat, by either flicking/tapping the timer to add time, or covering the mic on last few shots to reduce time, etc. I for one will be asking to see me last shot AND my last split at all matches (both Majors & locals) from here on out. I think all 3 people at the end of the stage (Timer RO, Clipboard RO, & shooter) should review the time visually & verbally OUT LOUD for all to witness. And regardless of admission into arbitration or anything else, anyone who videos another shooter should ALWAYS make sure to keep the camera rolling long enough to hear the time called out loud. It may not stand up in an arb, but it goes a long way in the court of public opinion. IMHO

[motosapiens]

I would think this might lead to some changes down the line. I see offering a view of the timer to the shooter becoming the norm, if not in fact a rule. As for revoking all credentials of a PROVEN cheater of this magnitude, I am all for it. But I am also a big fan of due process.

As usual, I agree with everything Sarge has so thoughtfully typed. The accusations look dire, but we are americans, so we shouldn't convict someone by mob rule. I have read enough to be convinced that the appropriate authorities are looking into it.

For shirleys I will be even more careful than I already am to show the timer immediately to the scorekeeper and to the shooter as soon as the range is clear. Based on my experiences at major matches, and with 1000's of uspsa shooters, I personally cannot believe that something like this is anything other than an extreme aberration.

[BritinUSA]

And regardless of admission into arbitration or anything else, anyone who videos another shooter should ALWAYS make sure to keep the camera rolling long enough to hear the time called out loud. It may not stand up in an arb, but it goes a long way in the court of public opinion. IMHO

I typically stop recording when RO calls ULASC as it just saves a little bandwidth, I may change that going forward, not as a response to this anomalous behavior but rather as it provides a little more information for the viewer, if we have electronic scoring and the RO's can call out the Hit Factor after scoring is complete then I can add that to the video title as well.

We typically call out the shooters Hit Factor at local matches.

[okorpheus]

I agree but how are they going to prove it. I'm in bed and don't feel like getting up but don't the rules say you can't use videos as evidence? I know it pertains while shooting a match

Troy McManus mentioned this in the thread on the doodie Facebook post, but it's buried where I can't find it. Basically video can't be used in arbitrations, but it can be used by the BOD in a discipline issue like this.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

[Nik Habicht]

Since I'm a fan of due process, and have a little experience in the still side of photography, I sincerely hope they consult with someone who is experienced with forensic videography. I'm not at all convinced that putting a timer to youtube videos is scientifically accurate -- when we know nothing about the equipment used in filming, the settings selected, whether or not clips were edited or had frames clipped in any manner, the accuracy of sound synchronization with the picture, and the effect of various compression algorithms......

And I haven't even touched on the potential effect of Youtube's software, or content delivery over the inter webs.....

It looks like something at first glance. If we had an RO doing this that's pretty bad -- but if the whole situation is a lot of smoke with no fire, then a good man's reputation got dragged through the mud. That would be a way worse outcome. Now, where's my copy of Miller's The Crucible? It's starting to feel a bit like Congress in the 1950s here.....