prone and props

[p7fl]

Over the years our local club has taken out props and low positions from our stages.

I have added some back in for this coming Sunday. But, now I am getting some pushback from people who say USPSA has changed and things like shooting from prone and carrying a rubber duck around are not part of a newer USPSA.

Thoughts..

[GuildSF4]

Is it challenging? Can it be done safely? If so then it is part of USPSA.

[JAFO]

We get complaints as well, mostly from those competitors who cannot go prone easily or at all. We usually plan for the prone portion to be at the end of the COF, so people aren't going down and back up on the clock, and also plan out ahead of time what, if any, special penalty your RM will asses for those competitors not able to go prone (see 10.2.10).

Low ports and prone can be challenging, and I have seen more than one way to tackle them.

[EricWilliams]

There is almost always a low port or a spot where you have to crouch at our local matches. A couple weeks ago there was a large spool laid down and you had to crouch inside of it to shoot a group of poppers on each side. Makes it challenging and fun.

[bagdad45]

Nationals stage 12 had a low port, everyone had to crouch or go prone. Don't see as much of the carrying props but hear about it often.

[p7fl]

From OP for Sunday:

Regarding penalties. I agree that giving a shooter the option up front is fair. Yes, these are the last shots fired in the stage.

Per shot fired ? Or one penalty for the array?

It is a 7 shot array (popper, non-dispapearing turner, classic and 2 plates)

thanks everyone for the responses, i was beginning to think that after 17 years of USPSA I had missed a major change in direction.

jon

[Vlad]

props, low ports, cooper tunnels, etc are all part of the game. Bring it.

[Supermoto]

Props are usually annoying, I don't want to carry stuff just for the sake of carrying it. It brings nothing to the stage and it is almost always better to take the penalty.

Being forced to go prone sucks too. Building a stage were there is a benefit to going prone is much more interesting

[D.Hayden]

For a stage that requires (vs. it's an advantage like the above) prone or really low ports, etc. - Just remember to consider/think about the alternative and penalty for shooters that can't physically get into that position, could be bad knees, back, wheelchair, whatever

[Panic Flinch]

I would be ok with almost any shooting position that did not give too fair of an advantage because of body size/type. It would be nice to incorporate all statures of shooters without giving one or another an advantage or disadvantage. Yes... Its tough to do.

[Cd662]

Agree with supermoto, holding stuff doesn't add anything to the stage, I think holding-things stages should be reserved for IDPA.

[Vlad]

What do you guys have a against the P in USPSA?

[Jim Norman]

You are carrying a briefcase with the days cash receipts in it. Are you going to throw it away or are you going to hang on to it while you shoot your way clear? Practical! Holding a fussy bunny that you are allowed to put one sloppy wet disgusting ear into your mouth, NOT Practical. Holding a doll the size and weight of a one year old, defending it and yourself, Practical.

If teh scenario is remotely linked to a practical situation bring it on.

[Steve RA]

The real fun ones are where you have a wall with 6 or 8 alternating high and low ports.

[BulletWhisperer]

Everyone has to shoot the same stage. I'm down for anything. It is all practical. We are fat, skinny, tall, short, fast, and slow. It's not like every stage has a prone position. It's part of the mix, don't take it away! I'm tall, and there are much low ports for short shooters, advantage for them, so what ?! I'm not going too accommodate one bad knee. That bad knee could be a scenario. No one is forcing the bad knee to shoot.

There's is Bullseye , Trap , or Skeet if you want to "stand-n-shoot" in one spot.

[Yagi]

part of a newer USPSA.

What is the new USPSA???

[Glshooter]

Props and prone suck!!

[jacketjoed]

im all for it, and wish our local matches would have more of it. makes it interesting and keeps you thinking.

[JupiterAdam]

An awesome speed vs prone was stage 13 at the US IPSC Nationals. Essentially, the penalty for slowness was to force the shooter to get prone to engage three targets. Check it out at:

Note the differing strategies from removing mag prior to opening box (in my opinion, the best strategy), to just shooting the three targets last in the prone position.

Looks like a great challenge and I am all for it.

[Flatland Shooter]

An awesome speed vs prone was stage 13 at the US IPSC Nationals. Essentially, the penalty for slowness was to force the shooter to get prone to engage three targets. Check it out at:

Note the differing strategies from removing mag prior to opening box (in my opinion, the best strategy), to just shooting the three targets last in the prone position.

Looks like a great challenge and I am all for it.

If I'm getting it correctly, on the buzzer you retrieve your gun from the briefcase and engage the targets before the door slides shut.

If you are slow, you can still engage the target after the door has closed but you must use the low (prone?) port.

Oh, that is mean. Really mean.

I like it.

[JupiterAdam]

Correct - awesome mechanism. The window begins sliding upon opening the box. Your unloaded gun is in the box. Only the best we're able to engage all three targets through the window. Most ended up on the floor.

[thermobollocks]

I would love to see more club matches that use the shooter-must-hold-open-window-with-one-hand type of port. That seems like an excellent way to get some SHO action in a field stage as opposed to having to carry something.

Edited November 8, 2013 by thermobollocks

[JAFO]

I've tried that a few times. Without something like a barrel in front of the port, a lot of people step into the window, rest the port cover on their heads, and shoot freestyle. Putting a barrel, table, or some other obstacle in front of the port eliminates most of that. Of course, I suppose I could always make it less attractive to set the port cover on your head. Protruding nails, maybe?

[Jaxshooter]

Penalties for shooters that cannot go prone etc are not per shot fired they are from no penalty to a maximum of 20% of the shooters score as shot on the stage. If going prone is at the end of a stage where you do not have to get up on the clock most of us with physical problems can shoot them.

Remember it could be you tomorrow that cannot go prone. Age and accidents are things you have no control over.

[TroyB]

I haven't shot a USPSA match that has the shooter go prone or any prop that forces a shooter to use SHO. I don't mind going prone with a rifle, just as long as it's not on the gravel which our club has done in the past.