2021 Locap Nats, what did you think?

[Bakerjd]

33 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

I would recommend to anyone that has substantive constructive criticism on the match to send it to mike, troy, and jake. You can post stuff here too, and it's interesting discussion, but email it straight to them. I send them an after-action-report after every match I work, calling out the good things and the shortcomings in a respectful way. That's how things get better.

You must be new to this era of USPSA. Emailing them will change nothing. Mike Foley was looking happy as a lark while everyone was trying to figure out what was going on durring the prize table fiasco. Didnt mention anything about the fact that they ran OUT of food before I'd guess 100 people got any. 

 

Like I said before the actual match itself ran smooth IMO. But I know my girlfriend was non to pleased about the LACK of being able to use a porta potty. She at one point on the first day checked every single one in the B range area and ended up having to go up to the parking lot to use the actual restrooms in the building. How does a company royally screw up this? Especially considering this isnt their first go round at a national level match. 

 

But its whatever, nothing will change unless someone else is willing to step up and seriously run against him next election. 

 

Another thing I want to add was I thought the practice bay being closed until the same time as the first shots at your stage was a little odd. For me it's not a huge deal as I almost never use it but I did here some people say it was less then ideal. 

 

I can say I'll probably go to another nats as I enjoy the shooting. I just wont have high expectations of any other part of it. 

 

Anyways that all i got to say about nats. 

[Conner]

53 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

I would recommend to anyone that has substantive constructive criticism on the match to send it to mike, troy, and jake..

I’ve seen all 3 of them interact with members on various forms of social media enough to know that emailing them and hoping for improvement is laughable. 

[Chills1994]

5 minutes ago, Bakerjd said:

You must be new to this era of USPSA. Emailing them will change nothing. Mike Foley was looking happy as a lark while everyone was trying to figure out what was going on durring the prize table fiasco. Didnt mention anything about the fact that they ran OUT of food before I'd guess 100 people got any. 

 

Like I said before the actual match itself ran smooth IMO. But I know my girlfriend was non to pleased about the LACK of being able to use a porta potty. She at one point on the first day checked every single one in the B range area and ended up having to go up to the parking lot to use the actual restrooms in the building. How does a company royally screw up this? Especially considering this isnt their first go round at a national level match. 

 

But its whatever, nothing will change unless someone else is willing to step up and seriously run against him next election. 

 

Another thing I want to add was I thought the practice bay being closed until the same time as the first shots at your stage was a little odd. For me it's not a huge deal as I almost never use it but I did here some people say it was less then ideal. 

 

I can say I'll probably go to another nats as I enjoy the shooting. I just wont have high expectations of any other part of it. 

 

Anyways that all i got to say about nats. 

If you want to keep women and their kids away, having UNserviced port-a-johns will certainly do it.

 

Ideally, there needs to be women only port-a-johns (as indicated by the pink plastic/fiberglass walls).  In a really perfect world, there should be real bathrooms with real running water toilets and sinks like 20 yards from the bays.

 

All the other port-a-johns need to be of the larger handicapped variety.

 

What you do with you belt rig and handgun inside a handicapped port-a-john is your business.

[ima45dv8]

Since some political commentary has made it into this thread, please consider this a gentle reminder of the restriction on political discussion...

 

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[mach1soldier]

1 hour ago, motosapiens said:

Unless there is something mechanically defective about the popper  (which does actually happen occasionally, and I have observed it on 2 separate occasions at area matches, and it's infuriating), that doesn't actually make a difference. Did anyone else on the supersquad leave it standing? or have to take multiple shots?

The super squad followed my squad all day. We had two people the popper didn’t fall for. One didn’t call for calibration soon enough, the other one it fell over for during calibration. The shooter was shooting major and had a dead center hit. The other was shooting 140 PF but didn’t realize she should call for calibration. 
 

that popper was a problem. We all knew it when we shot. The super squad obviously didn’t know. The squad in front of us had a calibration on the same popper but I don’t know the result.

 

if a Rangemaster visits the same popper repeatedly in a match, something is wrong 

[motosapiens]

26 minutes ago, mach1soldier said:

 

 

if a Rangemaster visits the same popper repeatedly in a match, something is wrong 

 

true story. i sometimes project a little and assume that because i am extremely diligent about checking and maintaining my poppers, that everyone else also is. that is probably not realistic.

[motosapiens]

45 minutes ago, Conner said:

I’ve seen all 3 of them interact with members on various forms of social media enough to know that emailing them and hoping for improvement is laughable. 

your concerns are not entirely unreasonable, but every time i personally have observed them be jerks to someone, it was in response to some pretty jerkish behavior.

 

to me, it seems like the last few nationals have been vastly superior to the ones i worked and shot a few years ago, but i am optimistic to a fault sometimes.

[BritinUSA]

Nationals is not what it used to be; I’ve been involved in this sport for a long time, I’ve competed in three IPSC World Shoots, three European Championships, one pan-American championships and numerous Nationals.

 

With the resources available in this country our Nationals could be the envy of the world. But they are not, too much money ends up in the prize tables, and not enough on the match. 
 

Typically, vendors/sponsors in IPSC matches support the matches with cold-hard cash which is spent on the range, props etc. A competitor can see where the money is spent, it’s all around them.

 

They book a large ballroom for the awards with food, tables and chairs for all competitors and staff.
 

Prizes were awarded to the top three in each division and that’s it.

 

 

[motosapiens]

7 minutes ago, BritinUSA said:

 

They book a large ballroom for the awards with food, tables and chairs for all competitors and staff.
 

Prizes were awarded to the top three in each division and that’s it.

 

 

 

why would you go to that ballroom if you weren’t in the top 3?

 

do you think the whole scamdemic thing has had an affect on what is possible?

 

i haven’t been allowed to play hockey in over a year now, but i still get to shoot....

[rowdyb]

Here is my match vid, since I started the thread and we're talking about a specific match.

 

[BritinUSA]

The vast majority of competitors would go to the awards, it was part of the experience.

 

COVID may have played a part in this years Nationals, but it has been going down hill for a while. 

The match lacks prestige, it should be bigger, better, more challenging than any other match. Live coverage, constant match updates and information, all these build interest in the match.

[BritinUSA]

Your shot cadence is very consistent through those videos, looks like you had a solid match.

[Bakerjd]

3 hours ago, BritinUSA said:

The vast majority of competitors would go to the awards, it was part of the experience.

 

COVID may have played a part in this years Nationals, but it has been going down hill for a while. 

The match lacks prestige, it should be bigger, better, more challenging than any other match. Live coverage, constant match updates and information, all these build interest in the match.

You hit the nail on the head on all three accounts! 

 

When I went to my first nats in 2019, locap in FL, it was a great match IMO. All around, from start to finish. It was memorable for me. And not just because it was my first nats, or first L3 match. Everything just seemed to be very planned and calculated. The stages had themes, and it showed in the decor of the stage props. 

 

2021 locap..... very blah. To the point I was disappointed that my long time girlfriend who also shoots USPSA and has shot big matches didnt get to experience what this match should have been. From certian match staff being down right rude to porta john issues ALL 3 DAYS. And then the disaster they called a banquet. I've been pretty careful on how I word stuff on here but honestly unless USPSA as a company, that's what they are dont fool yourself, doesnt step it up big time at hicap nats AND show proof they are going to do better if they have it at CMP again I personally wont attend. I can shoot 2 other majors, and still spend less money and get a better experience then I got here. 

 

For example, and yes I know Foley was involved, Area 5 almost didn't happen last year due to C19. But Lafe and his team got the entire match put together, everything all the little details like porta John's, solid fun stages, working poppers, excellent match staff in less then 2 months. I mean if they can do that and USPSA has a year to do this? Come on....

[wchangose]

It was a very good match.  The ROs were competent and friendly.  I liked the format, and the combination of large, medium, and short stages within a zone was fun.  The weather was for the most part, fantastic.  I liked that the clubhouse was right there for the banquet.  My experience from other nationals is that the banquet/award ceremony is often quite a drive from the range, which I think deters some shooters from attending.  If not for the rain, the venue would have been perfect.  I don't know why the food ran out and that was frustrating, but overall it was an excellent event.  

[rowdyb]

54 minutes ago, wchangose said:

, and the combination of large, medium, and short stages within a zone was fun.

You're right. I also enjoyed not shooting twenty 32 round stages. The variety in that respect was fun.

[pskys2]

13 hours ago, mach1soldier said:

The super squad followed my squad all day. We had two people the popper didn’t fall for. One didn’t call for calibration soon enough, the other one it fell over for during calibration. The shooter was shooting major and had a dead center hit. The other was shooting 140 PF but didn’t realize she should call for calibration. 
 

that popper was a problem. We all knew it when we shot. The super squad obviously didn’t know. The squad in front of us had a calibration on the same popper but I don’t know the result.

 

if a Rangemaster visits the same popper repeatedly in a match, something is wrong 

And if it can't be remedied the stage gets tossed.

[T3P_Guy]

It was my first nationals as well and I have a pretty huge mixed bag of feelings on the whole thing. 

 

Good:

I thought the stages were very vanilla uspsa courses which I don't think is a bad thing for a nationals as it seemed pretty representative of all the various skills needed to be successful in our sport. 

 

I liked the mix of short medium and long courses in a zone, my only grieviences with this was the flow of zone A. I think they really needed 1 more short/medium course packaged in with the chronograph stage to even out the flow and help prevent a backup on stage 1. I'm sure the number of bays available was the main issue here. 

 

The range and location were excellent! Reasonable drive to our hotel in Oxford with lots of restaurants right there. I would love to shoot more majors at CMP even though it's 1/2 way across the country from me. 

 

ROs seemed to be in good spirits and were helpful and seemed to really try to do a good job for the most part. 

 

Constant supply of cold water in between each bay was very great and they seemed to do a great job of keeping the coolers stocked and full of ice. Huge props to them on that! 

 

Sorry for the guys that didn't get food, I thought it was really good as I was one of the first 50 or so thru the line. Too bad they didn't have more of it. 

 

 

Things they should work on improving:

Bathroom situation was embarrassingly bad. Whoever decided to save a few bucks by not having a minimum of 1 outhouse for 2 bays should be forced to use on the the nearly overflowing outhouses for a month. 

 

Target presentation, I liked seeing them use 2x2s for target sticks, I wish more than 1 bay would of been equipped with door shims to shim them into the target stands though so they didn't blow around in the wind and it just makes pasting easier as well. 

 

Poppers were old and a few of them were super jankey. I didn't experience any issues with stuff not falling when shot but that comes down to luck, they should of had newer equipment then that out there to determine a national championship. I ended up watching a top 10 shooter on my squad get knocked out of the top 10 by having to shoot a popper 3 times in the calibration zone to get it to eventually fall. 

 

RO instruction prior to the match, we had a number of shooters on our squad with flashlights. You could tell the ro staff was given no formal training or instruction as to how to check if a flashlight worked. There was no proper range commands given any of the times I saw guys get checked, I swear I saw 1 ro put his hand in front of the light to see if it turned on. I don't blame the ro staff, this is an issue that the NROI should of addressed prior to the match and instructed everyone on. 

 

I don't mind people smoking cigars and enjoy them myself but if you are an RO at a major match I don't think you should have the timer in one hand and a lit cigar in the other when you're running shooters but maybe that's just me. 

 

A little instruction as to if beer was OK or not to have at the awards ceremony would of been nice, possibly something they needed to clarify in the match book so more people could of been in there earlier instead of enjoying a cold beverage in the parking lot. 

 

Not having preprinted official match books was super annoying. I know our organization doesn't like commiting to things in hard print but it would of made referring to the schedule way easier.

 

I don't think there is any valid reason at any major match to not have the written stage brief laminated and posted with each stage from the prematch through the entire match. It's annoying to me that the ROs seem to only have 1 copy of it and they keep it stored away and it disappears with them if they aren't on the bay. 

 

Prize table seemed to be a CF. It blows me away that more matches don't handle it like they used to at the IRC when it was at the Hogue Range in CA. They had the prize packages all bundled up, numbered and the entire list printed off and given to all the competitors. They would just go through the list of finishes and you go up, grab the number of the package off the board and turn it in so they can hand you the prize pack. It was fast, efficient, you could see what was still left and what was taken as it went. The other thing is it highlights the sponsors and shows what everyone donated and who the big donators were. Not that I'm there for a prize table as we left when that mess started but it would of been neat to know what was all in that room. 

 

 

Overall it thought it was a pretty good match but the whole thing kinda blurred together for me as all the stages were very very similar. Looking back it's tough for me to remember which zone each stage was in, I'm not sure if it had to do with the fact they named everything in Italian with no translations until a social media post on day 2 or if it was overload from it being my first nationals. I think they should of color coded each zones walls or something to differentiate them other than zone C being pretty much all classic targets and A and B being totally interchangeable. 

 

Overall match experience I would give it a 7/10, would shoot again. 

[rowdyb]

19 hours ago, BritinUSA said:

Your shot cadence is very consistent through those videos, looks like you had a solid match.

Thank you.

[T3P_Guy]

2 more likes about the match:

 

I love that AL is in the Central time zone and I liked the late starts for AM and PM as well.

[BARRYJ]

Somebody mentioned tossing the stage.  If the stage would have been tossed, who would have won?  

[pskys2]

2 hours ago, BARRYJ said:

Somebody mentioned tossing the stage.  If the stage would have been tossed, who would have won?  

That should be the last resort and hardly ever applies with steel, unless they just run out.  

It has happened with props failing though.  It usually doesn't have much affect, unless it was a COF fraught with peril that just a few at the top happened to navigate perfectly.  The top guys many times are so close though that there's always the chance.

Easy to determine as it's just math, if one has the time or interest.

[motosapiens]

we don't toss stages for things that happen entirely within the rules just because someone used underpowered ammo and is sad about it.

[RJH]

5 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

we don't toss stages for things that happen entirely within the rules just because someone used underpowered ammo and is sad about it.

Yep

[mreed911]

27 minutes ago, motosapiens said:

we don't toss stages for things that happen entirely within the rules just because someone used underpowered ammo and is sad about it.

 

A repeatedly failing target, on the other hand, goes against competitive equity.

[Racinready300ex]

5 minutes ago, mreed911 said:

 

A repeatedly failing target, on the other hand, goes against competitive equity.

 

The problem is the way the rules are since it fell when hit with a calibration round there is nothing wrong with the popper. So as things are the stage is legal and the results are final.

 

I do think forcing a reshoot would be a better way to go. And if the staff were to get tired of reshooting people they might be more likely to fix or replace the problem popper. As it is there isn't a incentive to fix the issue, so some will just let it go