Class movement in different divisions, are some easier than others?

[sstephns]

Driving home from the Tennessee Atomic Blast, and I got to wondering. 

 

I currently float around 74% and tend to compete well in Limited B. I'm not fixated on getting to a certain classification, just want to improve and see where that takes me. I've always had the inclination that I would like to be solid in A or possibly M class in whatever division before switching to something else. 

 

So, while driving I began to wonder, if I was shooting Open, would I see quicker progress into higher classifications? What about any other division? Is there anything inherent to a particular division that makes progress easier/ faster than others? 

 

Just curious really. Thoughts? 

[Sarge]

46 minutes ago, sstephns said:

if I was shooting Open, would I see quicker progress into higher classifications?

God NO! Open is tough. Everybody is so much faster so you have to be really fast too. Do an imaginary entry into one of the classifier calculators using Production, limited etc. Then enter the same info under OPEN and see how much lower the percentage is.

[aandabooks]

Currently PCC is probably the easiest division for upward movement.  Especially if you cherry pick the classifiers you shoot.  Competing at higher levels is always going to be tougher.  

[sstephns]

33 minutes ago, Sarge said:

God NO! Open is tough. Everybody is so much faster so you have to be really fast too. Do an imaginary entry into one of the classifier calculators using Production, limited etc. Then enter the same info under OPEN and see how much lower the percentage is.

I'm aware of the difference in percentages, my times are usually on the faster side of all the limited shooters, I just tend to sacrifice accuracy for that. 

 

I guess the question becomes, is open easier to progress in if you're already decently fast. 

 

I agree pcc has that opportunity currently due to using open classifications. I imagine co would be similar. 

Edited September 18, 2017 by sstephns

[rowdyb]

If you're already fast then I say switch to Prod. You still get deep fields to compare yourself against. You still have awesome people at the top setting the curve. Everyone can eventually be accurate. Not everyone can eventually become fast. So I say drop "down" to Prod and see how you progress.

[HoMiE]

Shooting with a dot will help in giving you instant feedback on what the gun is doing over shooting with iron sights. In Production and PCC you still have to shoot accurate if you want to move up, as shooting fast sloppy points won't  win matches. 

[StuckinMS]

I would agree with rowdyb. You could also go to SS.  Both will make you focus on being more accurate and faster on the reloads.  To get to master in any division you will need accuracy to match your speed.  I can out run a couple of masters I know, but they are far better at shooting alphas.  Hence why I am stuck in b class.  I am working hard on the accuracy and shot calling, which I hope will get me to A class.  That's my 2 cents worth.  I wish you the best. 

[Shadyscott999]

Go where the heat is.  Looks like you are in SC.  All the heat here is Limited and Open with PCC coming on strong.   Open is a meat grinder.  

[RJH]

Actually with the exception to PCC, moving up in classification will be about the same in across all divisions.  All shooters will be handicapped the same as far as equipment goes and all the best shooters have shot all the classifiers and that is more or less who you are shooting against

[Shadyscott999]

Making M is easy in PCC.  Making GM is most certainly not.  

[zzt]

ss, the difference when going from Limited to Open is huge.  When you first start you'll play find the dot a LOT.  A lot of dry fire will eventually cure that.  What is harder to get used to is having the dot 2" above the bore.  That means you have to do a lot of quick POI calculations on real close head shots (eg.) covered by No Shoots.  In Limited, the bullet goes where the FO is pointed.  Not so in Open with a frame mounted dot.

 

If you really want to change divisions, pick one that uses iron sights.  It will be less disruptive.

[jcc7x7]

8 minutes ago, zzt said:

  It will be less disruptive.

where is the fun in that!!!  While probably true!!!!

 

Open is addictive, go ahead drink the cool aide!

[motosapiens]

i suggest practicing more is the best way to improve your classification. As a bonus, it works for match performance too.

[wtturn]

16 hours ago, sstephns said:

Driving home from the Tennessee Atomic Blast, and I got to wondering. 

 

I currently float around 74% and tend to compete well in Limited B. I'm not fixated on getting to a certain classification, just want to improve and see where that takes me. I've always had the inclination that I would like to be solid in A or possibly M class in whatever division before switching to something else. 

 

So, while driving I began to wonder, if I was shooting Open, would I see quicker progress into higher classifications? What about any other division? Is there anything inherent to a particular division that makes progress easier/ faster than others? 

 

Just curious really. Thoughts? 

 

 

That seems arbitrary.

 

What is your goal?  To simply have higher classifications or to become a better shooter/win matches?

[Hi-Power Jack]

IMHO, Limited (where you currently are shooting), is The Easiest Division to show progress.

 

Revolver, SS, Ltd 10, Production are all specialized - need lots of training to get real good at them.

 

That leaves Open and Limited - as has been mentioned, you have to be Really Fast to get into the

A category in Open - and You are almost there in Limited.

 

I'd stay in Limited until you get to at least a solid A - then think about OPEN.

 

Another advantage of shooting OPEN, is that it will make you faster in Limited - and a better 

competitor, IMHO.     

[sstephns]

37 minutes ago, wtturn said:

 

 

That seems arbitrary.

 

What is your goal?  To simply have higher classifications or to become a better shooter/win matches?

 

My goal is to perform better, period. 

 

The point of the post wasn't intended to be " can I get a higher class in  a different division".

 

The question of "are certain divisions easier to advance in" was merely a by product of contemplating another division, not a goal. 

 

Would I like to be able to say I'm a xyz class shooter, sure. I just want to get better and be competitive though. If that brings an A or M class in the process, great. It's not the end goal, but more of a side effect I guess. 

Edited September 18, 2017 by sstephns

[wtturn]

9 minutes ago, sstephns said:

 

My goal is to perform better, period. 

 

The point of the post wasn't intended to be " can I get a higher class in  a different division".

 

The question of "are certain divisions easier to advance in" was merely a by product of contemplating another division, not a goal. 

 

I see. 

 

I imagine the class distribution curves are very similar among the divisions.  Would be nice if someone more savvy than me would make a chart.

 

In a qualitative sense, a shooter will probably advance fastest if he shoots in a division that is deepest/most talented in his locality.  This varies from region to region.

 

Advancement is a function of individual effort more than any inherent trait of a specific division.

Edited September 18, 2017 by wtturn

[Trent1k1]

I came up through the ranks on Single Stack, then Limited.  I got sort of stuck in Limited for about a year, not moving up or down.  I do think you have to get 'x' number of rounds downrange, or dryfire time to improve.  At the start of my second year of Limited, I took a class.  Screwed me up for about 2 months trying to in-learn and learn the right way to do stuff (Grip, what is acceptable sight pictures at distance, starting to see my sights lift, etc.)  The class got me from C class to high B.

 

I switched to Open at that point as I had a great deal on a used gun.  What Open did require of me, was to dryfire like a demon.  Had to try every possible shooting position to make sure the dot was where it was supposed to be, every time.  All that dryfire, with strange start positions, uprange/downrange starts, is I think what got me over the top (simply putting the time in to improve). 

 

I don't think it was the Open gun that allowed me to improve, but the excitement of a new gun and the way a red dot was either "there" or "not there".  It was very easy to see in dryfire the progress.  I think that is what is the hardest thing about dryfire, it is hard to see any sort of improvement.

 

Open allowed me to shoot as fast as I WANTED to shoot my Limited gun and get my hits.  It really is a couple of steps up from Limited in speed for sure.  Every little /10th of a second counts in Open if you want to be competitive.

 

I think what i'm trying to say is, try a different division if you want.  Whatever will get you really excited about practice and dryfire is the key.  There is no magic bullet to this but time and effort.  (something about 10k hours to get really good at something)

 

BTW-if you do shoot Open for a month or so, when you go back to Limited, you will shoot Limited even better....

[SlvrDragon50]

On 9/18/2017 at 4:37 PM, Trent1k1 said:

I came up through the ranks on Single Stack, then Limited.  I got sort of stuck in Limited for about a year, not moving up or down.  I do think you have to get 'x' number of rounds downrange, or dryfire time to improve.  At the start of my second year of Limited, I took a class.  Screwed me up for about 2 months trying to in-learn and learn the right way to do stuff (Grip, what is acceptable sight pictures at distance, starting to see my sights lift, etc.)  The class got me from C class to high B.

 

I switched to Open at that point as I had a great deal on a used gun.  What Open did require of me, was to dryfire like a demon.  Had to try every possible shooting position to make sure the dot was where it was supposed to be, every time.  All that dryfire, with strange start positions, uprange/downrange starts, is I think what got me over the top (simply putting the time in to improve). 

 

I don't think it was the Open gun that allowed me to improve, but the excitement of a new gun and the way a red dot was either "there" or "not there".  It was very easy to see in dryfire the progress.  I think that is what is the hardest thing about dryfire, it is hard to see any sort of improvement.

 

Open allowed me to shoot as fast as I WANTED to shoot my Limited gun and get my hits.  It really is a couple of steps up from Limited in speed for sure.  Every little /10th of a second counts in Open if you want to be competitive.

 

I think what i'm trying to say is, try a different division if you want.  Whatever will get you really excited about practice and dryfire is the key.  There is no magic bullet to this but time and effort.  (something about 10k hours to get really good at something)

 

BTW-if you do shoot Open for a month or so, when you go back to Limited, you will shoot Limited even better....

 

I keep hearing shooting a dot will improve your iron sight shooting... I really want to get a CO gun since Open guns are a wee bit too pricey for me.

[3gunDQ]

On 9/17/2017 at 7:12 PM, sstephns said:

Driving home from the Tennessee Atomic Blast, and I got to wondering. 

 

I currently float around 74% and tend to compete well in Limited B. I'm not fixated on getting to a certain classification, just want to improve and see where that takes me. I've always had the inclination that I would like to be solid in A or possibly M class in whatever division before switching to something else. 

 

So, while driving I began to wonder, if I was shooting Open, would I see quicker progress into higher classifications? What about any other division? Is there anything inherent to a particular division that makes progress easier/ faster than others? 

 

Just curious really. Thoughts? 

 

You are a good shooter and you are getting better. You will be in limited A in no time. Shooting is like anything else... set some long term and short term goal and do what it takes to make them happen. If all you want to do is make A rip some classifiers (Zero or hero) and do dryfire a lot, see Ben Steogers book. If you want to get better at shooting stages I would recommend some formal training from Bill or Chris in the off season. 

Edited October 11, 2017 by 3gunDQ

[sstephns]

22 hours ago, 3gunDQ said:

 

You are a good shooter and you are getting better. You will be in limited A in no time. Shooting is like anything else... set some long term and short term goal and do what it takes to make them happen. If all you want to do is make A rip some classifiers (Zero or hero) and do dryfire a lot, see Ben Steogers book. If you want to get better at shooting stages I would recommend some formal training from Bill or Chris in the off season. 

 

Thanks Craig. More of a pondering than anything. I'm sitting 0.45% off of A. But I realize that its going to take a lot more than making A to win in A. I just want to win, not necessarily go up in class. Going up in class is more of a by product of wanting to win. 

[SWprotected]

11 hours ago, sstephns said:

 

Thanks Craig. More of a pondering than anything. I'm sitting 0.45% off of A. But I realize that its going to take a lot more than making A to win in A. I just want to win, not necessarily go up in class. Going up in class is more of a by product of wanting to win. 

Your last two sentences are it. Learning to shoot in a way that will allow you to win stages or matches is the real goal and your class will be a by product.

Each division has the ability to teach us something. I don't know that any one division is easier to be competitive in vs another, maybe at locals but not at nationals. 

I tend to agree with the thought of shooting the division that has the deepest talent pool where you are. It gives you the chance to learn from others and some friendly competition will help make you work harder to improve.

Edited October 12, 2017 by SWprotected

[Medicaptain]

On 9/20/2017 at 3:56 PM, SlvrDragon50 said:

 

I keep hearing shooting a dot will improve your iron sight shooting... I really want to get a CO gun since Open guns are a wee bit too pricey for me.

I second that....Got my STI DVC and saw immediate improvement...and then back to where I was before.  As I get older and my eyes are aging quickly....I am very interested in getting into CO.  Seems like about 10-15% of our match numbers are in CO.....hope it continues to grow.

[rowdyb]

if your goal is to "win" then go where the competition is weakest generally. Or at least fewer. L-10 and SS. Division like Prod and Lim are stacked with talent at M and A and plenty of bags holding sand in B.

[3gunDQ]

15 hours ago, rowdyb said:

if your goal is to "win" then go where the competition is weakest generally. Or at least fewer. L-10 and SS. Division like Prod and Lim are stacked with talent at M and A and plenty of bags holding sand in B.

 

This is shit advice.... if you want to win go shoot against people that suck.

 

We have some very tanlented SS shooters in our area... you want to get smoked in SS show up in NC/SC. L10 is only a real division in mag restrictions states, so not around here.