S&W M&P

[Patrick Sweeney]

I just spent a day at S&W, shooting one of the new M&P pistols. Basically, take all the polymer-framed pistols, take the best from each, let a building full of engineers work them over (with input from police and competitors) and out pops the M&P.

Can't make it croak. The trigger out of the box is not bad at all. And from a quick look inside it appears very amenable to tuning, for the crisp trigger pull we all crave.

Right now only .40, and only a 4.25" barrel. But 9mm and 5" barrel guns are in the pipeline.

Production could get very interesting in the near future. The first thing I'll have to do with mine is see about making it work with 130-135PF loads.

[Newguy]

Patrick,

How does the width of the grip feel compared to a small frame Glock? Is it thinner? Also, what about the trigger reach? Is it shorter than the SW99? Although the SW99 has an adjustable backstrap, it's long trigger reach -- even with the smallest backstrap -- doesn't make it especially good for small-handed shooters. Just wondering if SW took some design hints from the Steyr M series, at least in terms of ergonomics. Lastly, what about the reset? Short like the Steyr or long like the Glock?

Edited December 2, 2005 by Newguy

[R/T Performance]

Funny we where just talking about this take a look

http://www.hs2000talk.com/viewtopic.php?t=27872

[rubberneck]

I shot the Ct. State IDPA match with a couple of the Smith & Wesson shooters. In between stages I asked Tom Yost and Jim Dalton about the M&P and they were very bullish on the gun chances of success in production. They both mentioned that the trigger would be very easy to tune. I have been shooting a Glock 35 in production but if this gun is as hot as everything I have read and heard about it I'd be willing to switch.

[Patrick Sweeney]

The gun comes with three gripstraps, that allow you to adjust width and length of pull. the reset is short. The grip is high. The barrel appears easy to make, so we can get match tubes if we feel the need. (Poor, overworked Irv!)

[DougCarden]

For Smith's sake I hope it is a winner. They have burned up most of their following in the LE circles with the SMIGMA debacle. If it is good as it looks then they will have a chance to at least compete with Glock.

[Patrick Sweeney]

They kept us trapped in a classroom for several hours, explaining how they had learned from the Sigma situation, and how the M&P was better than not only the Sigma but all other polymer pistols, too.

Me, I only had problems with the Sigma grip. I found it too round, and the gun would squirm in my grip. Apparently S&W is selling a boatload more Sigmas than anyone realizes. You'd be surprised at the annual sales figures. I was.

One series of tests was deliberately designed to set up the kB! Glock senario. They lodged bullets in the bore, and even filed case heads to initiate case failure. Most M&Ps tested would keep on working after that. "Here's a full-power .40 round with the case head filed. Go ahead, shoot it." That had to be a fun one to explain to the troops.

[Chuck Anderson]

I would imagine that the Sigma figures are inflated a bit by military sales. S&W has huge contracts with the U.S. military to supply Sigma 9mms to the Afghan National Police Force.

I am really looking forward to the M&P. Any idea when we'll be seeing them?

[eerw]

a 9mm 5" would be pretty nice..

looking forward to seeing one..

[JD45]

What will the street price be? If it is somewhere between a glock and an XD they should sell a few.

[revchuck]

What will the street price be? If it is somewhere between a glock and an XD they should sell a few.

List is $695; street price will be ~$500 - same as Glunks.

[B.J. Norris]

Anybody know when the 9mm's will widely hit the shelves?

[Clay1]

Anyone else look at the production gun numbers at nationals? Glock has 54 guns, the next closest was Sig with 9 and then it was stated that CZ, Springfield XD and one more that I can't remember - maybe SW had about 6 guns each.

New firearm introductions give shooters more selection and keep the competition on it's toes. To say that any new introduction will unseat "King Glock" (USPSA's wording not mine) anytime soon is not realistic. The Glock is the standard, because it works and has a huge history of working.

With that said, I wish S&W good luck on their new introduction. Another new piece in this same vein is the Tarus PT99 and the Steyr. I look forward to seeing one on the range soon.

Rick

[Chriss Grube]

I seriously doubt SW or Beretta will knock off the Glock from top spot. Smith makes great revolvers but let's face it there autos suck. They have to overcome the Sigma debacle, ask NJSP about that one, and the jumping in bed with Clinton. You'll see a few show up but Glock will still be the gun in production.

[BritinUSA]

Just to set the record straight it was not S&W that jumped into bed with Bill Clinton. It was the British company that owned S&W at the time that moved it into that position.

Once S&W was sold off they had a meeting with AG John Ashcroft and the whole 'deal' was dropped before it was ever formalised.

[Trader]

I shot a prototype SW M&P a month or so ago. The trigger was "worked" a bit and very nice. Trigger reset was good and I thought lock time was very quick. The gun was very managable. It felt like a 9mm but was .40. and I can't remember what brand or weight ammo was used.

I think many who have tried Glocks and found they did not point well for them will be interested in the M&P.

[zhunter]

I presently carry a Glock22, but HATE the point of aim, as ALL of my practice is on my STI Frame. The Glock point of aim is way too high for my taste, especially for self defense!!!!

I do like the point of aim of the XD, as it is the same grip angle of the 1911/2011 frames.

What is the grip angle of the M&P?

I will be buying a new carry gun in Feb.

[dirtypool40]

Marketing spin aside, this thing really looks like a repackaged Sigma.

Same trigger as far as I can see, which was the worst part of the Sigma. It was winner of the dubious "only trigger WORSE than a Glock" award if I recall.

I do like the grip and the rail, not to mention the beavertail the Glock should have added a DECADE ago. Although it looks like they get you in so deep in the backstrap you might not even need that beavertail. Styling all around is very mod. Better looks no doubt.

I like the repackaging, but is it still a Sigma underneath?

Come on Smith, get back in the game with a NEW, ORIGINAL design.

Edited December 4, 2005 by dirtypool40

[Run n Gun]

I do like the grip and the rail...

It's funny, my first thought when I saw it was "can you get one without that damn rail?"

Ed

[Trader]

Marketing spin aside, this thing really looks like a repackaged Sigma.

Same trigger as far as I can see, which was the worst part of the Sigma. It was winner of the dubious "only trigger WORSE than a Glock" award if I recall.

I do like the grip and the rail, not to mention the beavertail the Glock should have added a DECADE ago. Although it looks like they get you in so deep in the backstrap you might not even need that beavertail. Styling all around is very mod. Better looks no doubt.

I like the repackaging, but is it still a Sigma underneath?

Come on Smith, get back in the game with a NEW, ORIGINAL design.

The grip angle on the M & P is the same as the Sigma, that is the only thing they have in common.

[dirtypool40]

I hope you're right. It sure looks like the Sigma trigger.

Edited December 4, 2005 by dirtypool40

[Chuck D]

Funny no one has mentioned that seriously annoying "bump' in the frame around the mag release button. In Production Division, seeing that reloads are the order of the day, one might expect that "bump" to be a pain.

Like the beavertail though and I'll wait to get one in my hand before I judge the trigger.

Edited December 4, 2005 by Chuck D

[GTOSHootr]

I was at a match at S&W in Springfield today. I asked about the M&P in the shop and the guy said he didn't know when they were going to be available. He said they were supposed to be out last month (I'm not positive he was not speaking just for MA, which requires all sorts of crap to make a new handgun available). I was disappointed that I couldn't see one after seeing this thread.

[Patrick Sweeney]

The grip angle is 18 degrees, the same as the 1911. The trigger may look like a Sigma, but it doesn't feel like it and doesn't work like it. As for when they will be available, everywhere we went in the plant there were M&P parts flowing through the system. Forging bins full of slides and barrels, CNC machining stations with more flowing through.

I didn't have a problem dropping mags. However, if you're planning on using the M&P in Production, get it with the larger slide stop. The lo-profile one for carry is not fun, and you need to "slingshot" the slide closed. The bigger one is a lot easier.

[ampleworks]

However, if you're planning on using the M&P in Production, get it with the larger slide stop. The lo-profile one for carry is not fun, and you need to "slingshot" the slide closed. The bigger one is a lot easier.

Is that available as a factory option? If not, that'd obviously be an external modification.

I still cannot get over the magazine disconnect. Why do they have these retarded feel-good devices on them?