Choke selection for 3 gun

[Eric1231]

Is there any general guidelines out there for choke selection on steel and clay targets? For example at 20 yards on steel target I need modified with 7-1/2 shot. Or do I just need to go to the range pattern each choke with some different shot and play around with different targets? To understand get a good understanding of what is going on?

[Moltke]

There are very successful shooters who change chokes every course of fire to "optimize" their shotgunning, and others who are also very successful that don't bother with it. If you are going to change chokes then the only way to do know what to do is through trial and error to understand what works and what doesn't. Gun, choke, load, target and distance all come into play during the testing and the decision making before every stage. However if you're not choked up for the hardest target then you're going to have a bad time... so that's really what you need to know. What is the hardest birdshot target and what's it going to take to bring it down?

The people who don't want to mess with changing chokes all the time just choke up to a LM or MOD. There are several benefits to doing this such as using that tighter constriction all the time will give you the best chance of knocking over steel, plus you'll always be throwing the same pattern, and your slug zero won't be affected by changing chokes, so you don't have to worry about what to do - just shoot the gun. The idea here is to choke up for the hardest targets and just leave it that way all the time which is easy to train with & prep for but the drawback is sometimes on a really close target the pattern hasn't opened up and you need a more precise point of aim.

Personally I've been shooting Remington Gun Club #7.5 shot at 1200 FPS through a MOD choke and haven't left a steel standing all year, only changing chokes to something lesser if its all clays or the steel is very close - but not because someone said to do that, because I went and tested what worked and what didn't.

[ziebart]

Some general rules, LM or MOD work for 99% of targets, IC will work for 80% out to 17 yards. Small 4" steel need tighter choke or solid hits. They are stable on the base and won't catch as many pellets as a 12" knock down.

Pat Kelly has a great article about chokes. But the biggest thing is you need pellets on target and putting a cyl in still means you should aim somewhat. Missing means loading, and loading is slow.

[P.E. Kelley]

http://www.multigunmedia.com/3gn-choke-and-loads.pdf

[MarkCO]

Turkey full works for all targets.

Read Patrick's article. A few thoughts:

1. Most people over choke which racks up misses.
2. A pattern board, your chokes, and a few boxes of ammo is needed..
3. Reading about chokes may not apply to your gun and ammo.
4. Understanding what each target type needs to score is important.
5. Stage designers use different targets at different ranges.

Edited October 14, 2015 by MarkCO

[MustangGreg66]

MarkCO pretty much said it.

I've found the best thing to do is to test your chokes and the ammo you plan to shoot. The chokes that came with my VM Competition seem to be on the tight side. I have an older Benelli M1 that I bought used with an extended LM choke and it shot as wide or wider than the VM with IC... cheaper shells had more gaps in pattern and stray pellets where the AA and STS kept a uniform pattern.

I used the large Steel challenge steel as a target at 10 and 15 yards to check the pattern. The skeet choke filled it at 15 yards. I want to go back to 20-25 but may need a bigger target to tell the whole story.

I also tested on poppers. I could knock down a mini popper to 20 yards with the skeet choke, ~27 with the IC and LM worked all the way to 40... the smaller the target, the closer those distances will be and I need to go back and test it with plates. Poppers are large targets, get more pellets on them and I had them set to min USPSA calibration, so they fell easy. When poppers are set heavy, it's a different story.

Again, this is just for my gun. I'd suggest you go out and test yourself so you know what your combo will do.

[P.E. Kelley]

[Eric1231]

Great articles I am definitely over choking . Which is resulting in some misses. Can somebody clarify something for me. Looking at the charts basically the lighter load by dram produced nearly identical results and the choke determines the knockdown power. My question is if I go from 1-1/8 ounce 3dram to a 1 ounce 3dram load does the recoil go down? Does the knock down power change. Basically does the dram tell you the recoil force or is it best to figure recoil by velocity ^2 x shot weight?

[MarkCO]

From a recoil perspective, 3 dram feels the same to me regardless of payload. However, 1-1/8 ounce 3 Dram load has more cycle reliability than 7/8 ounce 3 Dram which might make a difference in some guns. I have found that the lower dram loads have a shorter shot column and better patterns within the same shell type...that results in slightly better performance on some target types.

[Vlad]

This season I've experimented with the notion of a single choke for everything. I've used LM for every stage at every match. I haven't decided yet if I think this is the one true answer, at some stages with close targets there were lots of possible doubles that I didn't get that maybe I could have gotten with a more open choke, and I for sure missed some close targets that I went too fast on that might have been easier to hit with a more open choke. On the other hand, it simplified my stage planning for lots of stages with mixed in slugs, and on MOST targets I didn't have to think to hard about it, I just pointed and shot.

On the OTHER other hand, I'm not that good or fast so don't take my experience as gospel. I think next year I'll try the opposite, carry 3-4 chokes to every stage, known where they shoot and change them around a lot and see what works better for my brain.

Edited October 15, 2015 by Vlad

[DocMedic]

I ran IC pretty much exclusively this year in my M2, and there was two stages this whole year that burn me because I decided to use IC instead of chocking up to mod or higher, One was at RM3G at a 25ish yard Angle Iron stage, and at the Pikes Peak Shotgun Challenge where I couldn't get enough shot on the spinner to get it to go over this year. The later I was ROing and seen some shooter choke up as tight as IM and getting the spinner with one shot. While choke selection is important much of it can be defeated by proper shooting ability, but it doesn't eliminate them all.

[Daft]

I truly appreciate PE's pdf, printed it out, read it more than twice and have it in the paper 3gun file. Sprung for extended chokes cause I can be stupid about whats in it to begin with. I just shoot local, but there is a lot of variety in distance and target, so at some stages changing from an IC to something tighter keeps from getting misses and using up time and $. Have not shot paper to pattern yet.

[Eric1231]

What is the lightest loads that you can run in benalli m2 reliably?

[DocMedic]

I've done 1180fps 1oz 7.5s as the lightest. Make sure you got a good grip on the gun or it will stroke, but fine otherwise

Edited October 17, 2015 by DocMedic

[MarkCO]

What is the lightest loads that you can run in benalli m2 reliably?

2 3/4 dram on a broken in gun. Can go lighter with the right parts, but not worth the effort for me.

[kellyn]

Two contradictory questions from Blue Ridge 2015:

1) Q to Kelly or Daniel H: What choke would Kurt Miller use? A: Light mod

2) Q to Kelly or Daniel H: What choke are you using on this stage? A (depending on stage): cylinder, IC, light mod, mod.

Of course, Blue Ridge is "special." Some match I never change chokes (all IC or skeet all the time), some I change every stage. And yes, I've spent some time on the patterning board with different kinds of ammo.

[RPatton]

When in doubt use one that is one size tighter, just for the one target that was set up just far enough away to make you shoot at it multiple times and screw up the load sequence that you had planned in your head.

[Eric_Vmax]

Some general rules, LM or MOD work for 99% of targets, IC will work for 80% out to 17 yards. Small 4" steel need tighter choke or solid hits. They are stable on the base and won't catch as many pellets as a 12" knock down.

Pat Kelly has a great article about chokes. But the biggest thing is you need pellets on target and putting a cyl in still means you should aim somewhat. Missing means loading, and loading is slow.

I like LM for 3Gun but what I do not know is do slugs negatively affect the choke tube in the long term?

[kurtm]

It hasn't on my M1 since 1996. Still right at spec. for a LM choke and it has had around 30 cases of slugs through it. It is on 276, 250 rounds total right now.

Edited October 20, 2015 by kurtm

[wgj3]

LM for the win. Keep it simple.

[EaZeNuTZ33]

This topic pops up every so often........and for KurtM, the answer has never really changed.

I run a Diffuser or Spreader (M2 vs A5) for most steel inside 15-17 yards, and clays.....which if you step off the targets and check them out (nothing set heavy, or far), the majority of targets I've seen all year were 6" squares or bigger, set reasonably, and inside 15-17 yards. I run a Light Mod for almost everything else. I do keep an Improved Mod on hand in case there are tight no shoot targets or small/distant targets. I don't think it has to be overly complicated. Go shoot targets, see what falls, and how far away. Choke for your hardest to get target.

Disclaimer:

I probably run a choke more open than most

I run almost 100% 1145fps 1-1/8oz 7.5's with some specialty shells mixed in. My pattern opens up a LOT faster if I am using higher velocity loads and that distance shortens up FAST!

I keep 1300fps 1-1/8oz #9's on hand for matches that put nothing but a bunch of clays out there for shotgun....then tend to get a little trigger happy!

[T Bacus]

For me, if the stage is all clay targets I run a Cylinder Bore tube. If there's any steel targets then Light Modified. those are the only two chokes I own for my VM.

[RPatton]

For me, if the stage is all clay targets I run a Cylinder Bore tube. If there's any steel targets then Light Modified. those are the only two chokes I own for my VM.

After finishing the last Remington Versa Max match one thing still rings true.

If you THINK the choke you selected is going to be OK then you will KNOW after you finish the stage.

I like to KNOW that I am that I am not going to wish I had used more choke after the stage is over.

It was a long day for some LM shooters. I went to a Full on one stage and was glad I did.

[Lead-Head]

Good point Randy.

I shot 6 stages with mod and 2 with IC.

For me The IC stages were all clays, and all buck/slug.

Anything with steel required at least MOD from my perspective.

[Bryan 45]

My simple rules- Under 14 yards, IC.

Over 15 yards, MOD.

Over 25 yards, Improved MOD.

When in doubt choke up.

"Shoot it like a rifle." -Clark Kennedy.