Bshooter Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Doesn't a gun have to be readily available to the public and so many sold before it can be used in a match? Don't know the revolver rules but if Jerry shoots a 929 there should be more than one available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Yeah if youre shooting production division Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Classifiers getting dropped? Who cares. Seems there's tons of non-revolver shooters that are plenty pissed at the dropping of the classifiers. There's quite the discussion going on in another thread here on Enos. Guys are acting like their favorite pet was just put to sleep. It's not like the remaining classifiers are good enough anymore . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrest Halley Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Doesn't a gun have to be readily available to the public and so many sold before it can be used in a match? Don't know the revolver rules but if Jerry shoots a 929 there should be more than one available. Yes there should be. He is the revo king, for now, and as such with rank comes privilege. Production rules are very lax for revos. Any smith model with a barrel up to 8.375" IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revoman Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 6 shot neutral does not mean 6, 6, 6, 6 it means a course of fire that can be completed in the same amount of reloads. You can have a 16 round course and if set up properly it will take 3 reloads with both 8 shot and 6 shot. Example would be 7, 4 and 5 would force 3 reloads with an 8 and can be shot with a 6 with 3 reloads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdpaz Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Classifiers getting dropped? Who cares. Seems there's tons of non-revolver shooters that are plenty pissed at the dropping of the classifiers. There's quite the discussion going on in another thread here on Enos. Guys are acting like their favorite pet was just put to sleep. It's not like the remaining classifiers are good enough anymore . More like five or six people making tons of posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I see this thread hit 30 posts. That should be about everybody shooting a revolver at nationals! I guess the mods can lock this one up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 Classifiers getting dropped? Who cares. Seems there's tons of non-revolver shooters that are plenty pissed at the dropping of the classifiers. There's quite the discussion going on in another thread here on Enos. Guys are acting like their favorite pet was just put to sleep. It's not like the remaining classifiers are good enough anymore . More like five or six people making tons of posts. Believe me, there are more than 5 or 6 non revolver shooters who think this is a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosshoss Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 There's no reason for non-revolver guys to even have an opinion on this. The rule change has no meaningful effect on them at all. Really? I joined USPSA and while I don't shoot anything but revolver I still have the right by paying my dues to have a opinion about the other divisions that I MIGHT shoot in the future. Some of these people that are not happy MIGHT be future revolver shooters. When this was being discussed on the USPSA forum and on this forum a LOT of the people that responded said they didn't shoot revolver but IF THEY DID they would like to do it with a 8 shot. I guess we should have told them to get lost that their opinion doesn't count. Classifiers getting dropped? Who cares. By the looks of it more shooters care about the classifiers being dropped than shoot revolver division. Regardless, better to get bashed but still have a Revolver Division in which to compete, Bosshoss. We were not going to survive at the previous participation levels. United we stand divided we fall if they ever have a vote to kill revolver division these people will remember this and not what a dedicated bunch of nice guys that we really are . We had survived for over 10 years with out this change and while we were the smallest division we weren't costing them anything to keep us around. We still don't know if this rule will help or not but I truly do hope it does. The more the merrier. BTW Mike how many revolver shooter were at the indoor match last weekend? I hope the rule change makes a difference, but I'm not holding my breath. But--having already signed up for Revolver Division at most of the major USPSA matches in my area, I'm putting my money where my mouth is. I hope everybody else who enjoys shooting revolvers in competition does the same thing. I don't want to win plaques or prizes by default.......I want lots of good healthy competition in the division. Mike I will shoot as many matches as I can afford to as I usually do. I have stated my position on this rule several times before and I hope the revolver division grows by leaps and bounds in spite of these start up problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 BTW Mike how many revolver shooter were at the indoor match last weekend? Twice as many as the last time I shot the match. It was always a match heavy with 8 shot arrays. All it would take to get the classifiers back is a little change to the "Stage Proceedure" wording. To do that you start by figuring out which ones need attention, then you take them "out of service" before they screw up the already screwy classification system even worse.... Then you fix them. At least that would make sense to me FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdpaz Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) Classifiers getting dropped? Who cares. Seems there's tons of non-revolver shooters that are plenty pissed at the dropping of the classifiers. There's quite the discussion going on in another thread here on Enos. Guys are acting like their favorite pet was just put to sleep. It's not like the remaining classifiers are good enough anymore . More like five or six people making tons of posts. Believe me, there are more than 5 or 6 non revolver shooters who think this is a big deal. Not saying there aren't. I was just pointing out that there are only a half dozen people in the other thread posting over and over. And, rather than rationally addressing the decision to remove the classifiers itself, those few seem to have decided to vilify revolver shooters and start a witch hunt to declare 8 shot minor as inherently evil. Just to be clear, no revolver shooters that I know had any say in the decision to eliminate the classifiers. Edited February 8, 2014 by bdpaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 OK, there are no top guys who have no problem shooting As all the time. That's exactly what a top guy would say to trick the underlings! If jerry and leatham and matt and other gm's shoot minor it will be because they brought both rivs with them, walked the stages, and saw an advantage. My 2 cents...if I go I am bringing both... I don't think Jerry has much of a choice in what he shoots at the Revo Nats, after all the promoting he has done for the 929 and they got him one early it would look pretty bad to abandon it for a 6 shooter. He has been wanting to shoot minor for a while now but it was too much of a disadvantage for him with a 6 shooter. Jerry will be shooting his 929. Jerry will shoot the gun that he thinks he will win with, end of story. Actually, I'd rephrase it as, Jerry may well win with whatever he shoots! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) There are a lot of classifiers that have been and should be retired, not just for shot count. USPSA tries to weed them out intermittently. And there is no LIST of approved Revolvers, as in Production. And the options available to customize are about the same as Limitied/Limited 10. You also don't need a Tactical Holster. I just wish the snow and cold would go away so I can get out and play! Edited February 8, 2014 by pskys2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 How about this. I'm shooting minor because it's freaking fun! I just never enjoyed shooting the 4" 625 of mine, maybe I should have tried a 5" who knows. I get to stay a extra day and shoot another nations with a bunch of screw balls what's not to like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) And, rather than rationally addressing the decision to remove the classifiers itself, those few seem to have decided to vilify revolver shooters and start a witch hunt to declare 8 shot minor as inherently evil. Which is exactly the reaction the opponents of 8-minor wanted to see. Too bad I can't get away with starting a "Last Shot Fired" thread for those oh-so-precious departed classifiers. Edited February 8, 2014 by Carmoney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeg1005 Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I have a strong feeling that they will make the match mostly 6-shot neutral. I would say you are correct. Last years SSN, granted it was a tribute to the guy who passed away that used to set up stages, had a lot of 6 and 7 shot arrays, leading me to believe they Revo match to be 6 shot neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericjhuber Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 An interesting statistic...... according to my count of the posted roster, 42% of the 85 shooters signed up for nationals are shooting minor. I hope it stays roughly like this. I pretty much gave up on using statistical analysis for trying to figure out the statistically significant differences between major and minor in Single Stack. There just aren't enough people shooting minor...especially at the Grand Master level...to give me enough good data to work with. I've really been hoping the 2014 Revolver nationals will see diversity between major and minor at all skill levels so I have a decent data set to work with in the end. I learned to shoot a lifetime ago as a police explorer on Smith and Wesson revolvers so I have a massive soft spot for revolvers and the Smith and Wesson product line. Sadly, I don't own any revolvers, but I'd just love to get a 929 at some point and shoot revolvers with you folks someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericjhuber Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 How about this. I'm shooting minor because it's freaking fun! I just never enjoyed shooting the 4" 625 of mine, maybe I should have tried a 5" who knows. I get to stay a extra day and shoot another nations with a bunch of screw balls what's not to like? That's yet another reason why I'd like to get my paws on a proper 929. I'm moving into Single Stack next and I'm making shooting a Single Stack Nationals as one of my goals. The long term goal is to actually earn a slot, but I'll take what I can get just to attend one to shoot with the skilled people. If USPSA is going to stick with the model where the Revolver nationals the day after, how is that not awesome? If I'm going to pay the money to have a ball being pummeled in the Single Stack Nationals, why not add on an extra day of fun so I can say I had a blast getting creamed by some of the best revolvers shooters in the world? I could even make some money selling t-shirts..."I got annihilated by Jerry at the 2014 Revolver Nationals and all I have is this t-shirt to show for it." And, yeah, one of the reasons why I love watching Jerry Miculek on YouTube is he's pretty much the physical embodiment of pure joy when shooting. This is a guy who just loves what he does. Check him out taking the 929 for a spin for the first time. Okay, granted the compensator is on the 929 when Jerry shoots it, but...wow. That thing hardly moves at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosshoss Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 BTW Mike how many revolver shooter were at the indoor match last weekend? Twice as many as the last time I shot the match. It was always a match heavy with 8 shot arrays. All it would take to get the classifiers back is a little change to the "Stage Proceedure" wording. To do that you start by figuring out which ones need attention, then you take them "out of service" before they screw up the already screwy classification system even worse.... Then you fix them. At least that would make sense to me FWIW. Well you made me look it up there were 2 revolver shooter at the WIIT so twice as many is a huge improvement but forgive me for not calling it a success on the first weekend. The 8 shot arrays should have played into the 8 shot guns wheelhouse and brought more of them out. I agree on the classifiers and they may show up again with a different procedure for 6 and 8 shot guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 BTW Mike how many revolver shooter were at the indoor match last weekend? Twice as many as the last time I shot the match. It was always a match heavy with 8 shot arrays. All it would take to get the classifiers back is a little change to the "Stage Proceedure" wording. To do that you start by figuring out which ones need attention, then you take them "out of service" before they screw up the already screwy classification system even worse.... Then you fix them. At least that would make sense to me FWIW. Well you made me look it up there were 2 revolver shooter at the WIIT so twice as many is a huge improvement but forgive me for not calling it a success on the first weekend. The 8 shot arrays should have played into the 8 shot guns wheelhouse and brought more of them out. I agree on the classifiers and they may show up again with a different procedure for 6 and 8 shot guns. All they need to do with the classifiers is change WHEN you make the madatory reload. The problem isn't the mandatory reload, just it's TIMING. After the seventh shot is a killer for a six shooter. I think "After the first shot but before the last shot" would work across the board on the classifiers that always sucked with a six shooter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcb Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I think I am going to flip a coin. I am just filling out my National Registration form. I cant seem to make either gun run significantly better than the other. I just got my Short Colt load worked up for my 627 so maybe Minor revolver will start sustaining a lead. As it presently is my scores rarely differ by more that 2% in a given match shot with both Major and Minor Revolver unless I totally crash and burn on a stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Z Sr Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Went last year, not going this year. I love shooting REVO, always have, that's about all I shoot in USPSA. My views on 6 vs. 8 are just my humble opinion, but I think it was a bad idea, to fix a problem that did not exist, we had to "pass it to see what's in it" mind set, again in my opinion. My match yesterday, was set up with 1 stage having 24 rounds, 3 -8 shot arrays, 1 less reload,,, 1 Stage with 26 rounds, 1 less reload,,,, a 7 shot stage, NO RELOAD, an 8 shot stage, NO RELOAD,, a 32 round field course with 4 - 8 shot arrays, 2 less reloads and the classifier was 3- 6 shot strings, no advantage. Bottom line, it was absolutely NO FREAKIN' FUN shooting it with 8 rounds. Yes, my hit factors were way above my average for a basic match,, 6 less reloads,,, 12-15 seconds off total match time or more. No cool REVO stage plan, just hit the arrays and go. Sorry guys, bash me if you want, the 8 shot is a great gun, but I will use it in ZSA 8 Division every so often, never at USPSA REVO. Best of luck to all my friends from REVO world at Nationals this year, I'll save the 16 hour drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcloudy777 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Major. I never found a deal on a 627, and I doubt I'll be able to find a 929 any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Bottom line, it was absolutely NO FREAKIN' FUN shooting it with 8 rounds. It wasn't fun because it wasn't as challenging as shooting a 6-shot revolver? Just trying to make sure I follow what you're saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom E Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 it was absolutely NO FREAKIN' FUN shooting it with 8 rounds. Then shoot your six shooter. Just because you can shoot 8 minor doesn't mean you have to... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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