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Bosshoss

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About Bosshoss

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    Scottsburg Indiana
  • Real Name
    Paul Francis

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  1. So we want participation trophies? OK I'm working/shooting the SNS 400 on June 7-8-9 there are now 3 revolvers signed up. If the match director(Jake Martens) does not have a problem with it here is what I will do if we get 2 more for a total of 5 or more I will pay for medallions or coins for everyone that shoots the match in revolver and has a score. If we get 3 in a class(GM/M/A/B/C/D/Senior/Junior) I will pay for a trophy/plaque in that class. AND if we get 10 or more revolvers with a score(you have to shoot and not just sign up) I will donate a free competition trigger job ($300 value) to be given away random draw to one of the revolver shooters. So odds are 1 in 9, or more if more sign up, since I won't be in the draw. If you don't want or need the trigger job it will be transferable so you can sell it. Match is almost full with 35 or so slots left so don't waste too much time. This depends on Jakes approval. Edit: Jake said this is OK. https://practiscore.com/sns-400-indiana-section-championship/register?fbclid=IwAR3H6TFSCqS2pDz_sh3WP69dq0N-mtMGF-opr7ktRmyop3gdBm9P_YhrFRg
  2. Thanks Jake for taking the time to post the data and figures. Been putting off posting for a few days because well I don't have any answers. Lots of opinions and ideas in this thread. I personally don't feel rule changes like optics, etc. are going to make any difference. Yeah a few want them but some don't so it would be a wash in the numbers. Forget the 6 shot speedloader as increasing numbers. While there are millions of these guns out there the owners are not going to just start showing up with them. In fact I have NEVER heard 1 person say that they wanted to bring out the old model 10 or whatever and speedloaders to try a match with it. NEVER Lower entry fee for revolver? The entry fee is a small portion of the cost of shooting matches. The travel and motels and equipment and ammo are much bigger than the entry fee's. I'm retired and I can only afford to shoot so many major matches a year so while money is very important to me, half price entry wouldn't make any difference to me about attending a match. BTW you know you can shoot most matches for free right? Just sign up for staff. Reduce the minimum number of shooters at majors for trophies? I probably shouldn't even answer this but this is just my opinion. I have been playing this game over 30 years and been a USPSA member on and off for 28 years. I really don't care about trophies that much. I have some that I'm proud of and some that don't really mean anything. I don't feel that lowering the minimum would change the turnout much if any. Many of the Majors I have shot I am the only revolver or 1 of 2 -3. I never thought about switching to another division(even with no chance of the division being recognized). Why? because I LIKE shooting the revolver and like the challenge, not so I have a chance at a trophy. Would I like to have more revolver shooters at the matches? of course I would but even if they don't show I will still be there as long as my hands hold out. I personally don't want any special treatment for revolvers. Just put stages on the ground that follow the rules and let me figure it out. I have heard the MOUTHS(you know the ones that talk better than they shoot) blame revolver for the 8 rounds from one position rule when this rule has nothing to do with revolver since it was the rule when we were shooting 6 shot guns. I here revolver called a hider division(always by someone that has never shot revolver) and lowering the minimum number of shooters would make this worse. Not that I care what those people think. I always tell them I'm not hiding you know where to find me. AT the local matches I find plenty of competition as I look at the overalls and I know the production and SS and limited shooters that are always close to me in the finish and see how I did against them. I have offered my backup gun and equipment and ammo to anyone that wants to try revolver and one person has taken me up on it and it was when his gun broke and he didn't have anything else to shoot so he shot it for one match. One person over several years. JMO
  3. I'm getting Deja ve about this. The last time they "saved" revolver division they chased away several revolver shooters in my area. A year or so after the rule change it picked up some but not sure if the rule change had anything to do with it or the into of the 929 spiked the interest. Last time one of the main reasons I heard for 8 minor being allowed in Revolver was "it is a place for the ICORE shooters to bring out their guns and shoot" Where are they at?. Please don't make a rule change based on getting the ICORE shooters to cross over because that hasn't panned out so far. My big complaint last time was what about the classifiers and while this wouldn't be as bad as last time there still should be a adjustment to them as optics will make some of them easier. But that won't happen. I'm actually fairly neutral on the optic thing as it will be a advantage but available to everyone. Just adds $300-500 to the entry cost of the division. 8 shot Major I don't know if a 929 can make major has anyone tried to see? I don't think it will without some problems. Rifle primers +heavier trigger pulls, Sticky extraction, etc. 75% of the guns that have come thru the shop in the last 3-4 years are 929's so you may be obsoleting a majority of the revolvers out there. Even a 627 will have to go to 38/357 brass as I don't thing Short or long colt will work.(Long colt might but I doubt anyone has tried). I shot some 38 super major a few years ago and while it worked would have to play with powder and bullet combo to get better extraction. I don't think any of this will increase the number of shooters and I still enjoy the challenge of the game the way it is now. While I would love to see revolver grow by leaps and bounds I realize that isn't going to happen but I have never seen any reason to eliminate it. Doesn't hurt or cost anything keeping it around. IMO Something I'm curious about is since PCC has opened up a lot of possibilities with PCC is only shooting against other PCC's that I hear all the time. Revolver is only shooting against other Revolvers so would this be possible/fair/fun? All revolvers have to make minor power factor at chrono. Optics are scored as minor and iron sights scored as major(even though shooting minor PF). Is the optic worth the points? It would still be easy to tell who shot optic vs Iron by their PF in the results. If optics are just thrown in to revolver the way it is now it will be a have to have to be competitive. Optic revolver should have been put in CO IMO
  4. I get the PC VS PRO question a lot and I tell my customers that both guns require the same amount of work to make race ready. The PC is more expensive BUT it is worth more when you sell it if you do. The PC's seem to sell a lot faster than the PRO's also.
  5. Yes it detents on to the barrel underlug. Pro has the standard front lock up on the ejector rod end.
  6. 627 PC also has a different front lock up than the Pro.
  7. Well they can complain but doesn't make a difference it is still a reshoot. It happens.
  8. I haven't been called a "range Lawyer" before but if that makes you feel better go for it. What I tried to say before was if the last shot wasn't picked up then the timer either isn't working correctly or RO wasn't close enough to get the last shot. Either way you can't record a incorrect time no matter what the reason. Does it suck that they get a reshoot yeah but it happens. This is the way I was taught and way I have done it for a long time. I will say that the quite PCC's have added to the challenge as you have to be within 2 or 3 feet of the muzzle to record the last shot. This has nothing to do with Popper calibration and don't even know why that was brought up. Someone Zeroing a stage has nothing to do with the original post. I don't make the rules. I don't make up rules. I just RO and try to the best of my abilities to make sure that everyone has a safe and fun match by the rules as I know them and understand them. Thanks George for posting Rule 9.7.4
  9. If the timer does not pick up the last shot I would argue that the timer was indeed faulty. If the time is not correct it is a reshoot.
  10. There is no rule that says you can't have different start positions either. I know you have been around long enough to know that if the rules don't say you can't then you can. The COF is the same no matter where you start as long as targets or fault lines are not moved. Just have to have a different game plan. Kind of like a SS shooter will have a different plan than a open shooter for the same course of fire. We have a lot of stages locally that have hands on marks and PCC muzzle on mark starts. The handgun shooter can get the length of their arm towards the first shooting position. A PCC shooter can hold the gun outstretched in one hand and with a lean be several feet closer to first shooting position. How is that not a different starting position? I'm not complaining about that because I'm not shooting against them just trying to make a point.
  11. Some would say they should have their own match Actually they do have their own matches. I worked (and didn't even shoot) the area 5(level 3) PCC match at my home club last year and it was PCC ONLY and this year they are having another level 2 PCC ONLY match this year. I could care less one way or another about PCC other than they can be a pain to RO and make sure to get the last shot on the timer, but just looking at the rules I still don't see where it says that PCC has to start in same location as Handgun.
  12. IMO 5.1.1 doesn't change anything with the question of different start positions or location for PCC. The courses of fire remaining consistent has nothing to do with start position or location. PCC already has different start positions than handgun for uprange starts. I still see nothing in the rules saying that handguns start on one set of x's at the back of the stage and PCC starts at another set of x's at front of stage isn't allowed. PCC is ONLY shooting against other PCC's so it doesn't matter RIGHT?
  13. I shot this match and CM 18-08 has a problem with the WSB. First page has 1 description for string 2 and second page has a different description for string 2. Looks like a copy paste error on second page but the page with the diagram was how we shot it at Nationals. https://uspsa.org/viewer//18-08.pdf Nice having some new classifiers 18-06 had a lot of shooters walking back shacking their head.
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