Eric802 Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 (edited) I appear to have a thing for stage plans...when I sign up for a match, I check Practiscore religiously until the match book comes out, download it, and pour over the stage designs. Part of it is that I just find them interesting, but I'm also getting an idea in my head as to how I'll shoot each stage, reload positions, etc. Of course, flexibility is required because the real stage never quite matches the design, or there's a popper that you can't see from where you thought, etc. I was at a match last month and heard a couple other (much more experienced) shooters talking about it, and one of them said they didn't really look at the stage designs much - the only real use they got out of the match book was the round count for the match and that was about it. They show up, walk through the stages, and develop their plans. I'm guessing there's no "right" or "wrong" thing to do, just wondering how y'all use the plans if they're available. About half of the matches I normally shoot usually have the plans available ahead of time, and I will say that I don't think my performance is any better or worse depending on whether they are. Edited April 13, 2021 by Eric802 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regor Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 Match books are useful for identifying potential skills you need to brush up on before a match; unloaded starts, non-standard start positions/draws, etc., but I've never found them to be adequate for actual stage planning purposes. There's pretty much always something that needs to be changed about a stage plan based on what is actually on the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broadside72 Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, regor said: Match books are useful for identifying potential skills you need to brush up on before a match; unloaded starts, non-standard start positions/draws, etc., but I've never found them to be adequate for actual stage planning purposes. There's pretty much always something that needs to be changed about a stage plan based on what is actually on the ground. Pretty much this but as a production shooter I do a touch of general planning because of reloading needs, but nothing specific or rigidly planned by any means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeBurgess Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Eric802 said: 1 Part of it is that I just find them interesting, 2 I'm also getting an idea in my head as to how I'll shoot each stage, reload positions, etc. 3 the only real use they got out of the match book was the round count for the match and that was about it. 4 They show up, walk through the stages, and develop their plans. 1) yes its fun to look and try to figure out the flavor and just think about the match 2) NO, NO, this is a waste of energy at best, and likely to make you lean towards a bad plan because it looked good on paper, do not do 3) you get 2 things from published stages, 1 approximate round count, 2 are there any out of the ordinary things you will need to do (shoot prone, weak hand, unloaded start, etc) and at that if there are weird tasks just practice it enough to be comfortable doing it so the first experience is not at the match, don't make it a training focus as it will still only be a very small part of the match score. 4) Yes get to the match ahead of time and walk the stages, I do not like to get to carried away I basically want to find all the targets and where I need to be to shoot them, I will then do some light stage planning but I wont set anything in stone, no going back to the hotel and visualizing my runs over and over. I want to leave myself the option to find a better plan as I walk the stages with my squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkapot Posted April 13, 2021 Share Posted April 13, 2021 If there's a hide/seek type of stage, the diagram helps me (when shooting STSK or Prod) break down my positions and reloads. As others have said, I do NOT create a stage plan based on the diagram, but helps me identify particular stages or arrays within stages to go look at FIRST. If I can identify array 3 on Stage 5 as tricky, I will prioritize that when I walk the stages. Getting that one array squared away in my head clears my mind and reduces my stress level. IF they publish stage diagrams early enough, I'll spend a little more training time on oddball start positions, etc. #4 in the post above is Good Stuff, something I should probably do. I tend to develop a stage plan and not deviate from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric802 Posted April 14, 2021 Author Share Posted April 14, 2021 Thanks for the replies, everyone. Mike, what you're saying makes perfect sense. I'll make an effort to look at the stage plan but not plan my stages based on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted April 14, 2021 Share Posted April 14, 2021 Stages will ALWAYS be different in real life versus the book on one way or many ways. So I only get what I can from the matchbook that doesn't require them to build it as shown exactly. total stages, total round count, possible stage i might start first on, stage that happens after lunch break. so simple scheduling stuff general amount of partials, whether from no shoots or hard cover. general amount of steel, its type. moving targets, and their position within an array. remembering it is only possibly this way. unique props or vision barriers. start conditions and procedures general flavor of the stages. hoser vs sniper and so on If I'm gathering intel on a place or match I've never attended before I also search youtube and instagram to watch prior locals and majors at the place to give me a feel for the bays, their dimensions and layout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happygunner77 Posted April 14, 2021 Share Posted April 14, 2021 Match books are not substitute to actual stage walkthrough on the day before your match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefVanHauwe Posted April 14, 2021 Share Posted April 14, 2021 Agree with happygunner77. I only use it to calculate how much ammo/spare ammo I need to bring to the match and to check the stages for starting conditions or target arrays I'm unfamiliar with, so I can dry or live fire train them as much as possible. It's also important to have and use a process for your walkthroughs, in the hole, on deck, online and at the unload and show clear. DVC! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waktasz Posted April 15, 2021 Share Posted April 15, 2021 21 hours ago, rowdyb said: Stages will ALWAYS be different in real life versus the book on one way or many ways. So I only get what I can from the matchbook that doesn't require them to build it as shown exactly. total stages, total round count, possible stage i might start first on, stage that happens after lunch break. so simple scheduling stuff general amount of partials, whether from no shoots or hard cover. general amount of steel, its type. moving targets, and their position within an array. remembering it is only possibly this way. unique props or vision barriers. start conditions and procedures general flavor of the stages. hoser vs sniper and so on If I'm gathering intel on a place or match I've never attended before I also search youtube and instagram to watch prior locals and majors at the place to give me a feel for the bays, their dimensions and layout. This, plus any strong hand/weak hand stuff. If a match has none of that, I will completely skip it in practice, and if it has 50 yard weak hand partials, I'll still skip it but at least I know I shouldn't have Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric802 Posted April 15, 2021 Author Share Posted April 15, 2021 (edited) I appreciate the replies. There are certainly better uses for the matchbook than I had considered. Edited April 15, 2021 by Eric802 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeBurgess Posted April 15, 2021 Share Posted April 15, 2021 3 hours ago, waktasz said: This, plus any strong hand/weak hand stuff. if it has 50 yard weak hand partials, I'll still skip it but at least I know I shouldn't have this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IVC Posted April 17, 2021 Share Posted April 17, 2021 For experiment, I analyzed a few stages on paper and matched them to the actual setup. Everything I looked at had angles that were either slightly off, or it was hard to tell whether a target would be visible from a specific location, so only the most obvious plans would work both on paper and in the match. Since then, I use match book just to get a general idea about the type of match it's going to be (and I find out which classifier will be included). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakerjd Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 I use it to find see how many unloaded, table ect... starts, where my first stage is and last for the day. Rounds count. That's about it. Mostly to see start positions durring day before walk through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 On 4/13/2021 at 3:25 PM, Eric802 said: I appear to have a thing for stage plans...when I sign up for a match, I check Practiscore religiously until the match book comes out, download it, and pour over the stage designs. Part of it is that I just find them interesting, but I'm also getting an idea in my head as to how I'll shoot each stage, reload positions, etc. Of course, flexibility is required because the real stage never quite matches the design, i would say making stage plans in advance is a complete and total waste of time, but if you have the time to waste, be my guest. I tried it once and that was enough to learn my lesson. 16 hours ago, Bakerjd said: I use it to find see how many unloaded, table ect... starts, where my first stage is and last for the day. Rounds count. That's about it. Mostly to see start positions durring day before walk through. I think this is the correct answer for most experienced shooters, although the start positions do often change when the stages are put on the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakerjd Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 8 hours ago, motosapiens said: I think this is the correct answer for most experienced shooters, although the start positions do often change when the stages are put on the ground. This is the most irritating thing ever for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Bakerjd said: This is the most irritating thing ever for me. when you build stages for matches, how often do they turn out exactly the same as your diagram? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakerjd Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 4 hours ago, motosapiens said: when you build stages for matches, how often do they turn out exactly the same as your diagram? Oh I get why it happens. Just sucks if you dont find out till match day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerTrace Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 On 4/13/2021 at 5:05 PM, regor said: Match books are useful for identifying potential skills you need to brush up on before a match; unloaded starts, non-standard start positions/draws, etc., but I've never found them to be adequate for actual stage planning purposes. There's pretty much always something that needs to be changed about a stage plan based on what is actually on the ground. ^^^^^^absolutely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 7 hours ago, Bakerjd said: Oh I get why it happens. Just sucks if you dont find out till match day. i find out the day before match day, when I show up to watch some of the staff shoot and inspect the stages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeBurgess Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 9 hours ago, Bakerjd said: Oh I get why it happens. Just sucks if you dont find out till match day. if you have enough of a plan for the stage in your head that finding out day of the match screws you up then you are making a mistake and planning stages without seeing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpYoursPal Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 In the rare occasions where I see a match book for a local match, I try to use it to plan my squadding so I don't end up shooting the classifier stage first! Other than that, pretty much like what @regor said - identifying weird start positions, under-used skills, or any potential curveballs. Personally, I'm bad at steel arrays. If a match has a few mini poppers at a distance, I'll try to set that up in dry fire to at least understand what kind of sight picture confirmation I'll need for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted April 30, 2021 Share Posted April 30, 2021 7 hours ago, UpYoursPal said: In the rare occasions where I see a match book for a local match, I try to use it to plan my squadding so I don't end up shooting the classifier stage first! why wouldn't you want to shoot the classifier stage first? seems like an advantage to do an easy stage with little/no movement to start out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waktasz Posted April 30, 2021 Share Posted April 30, 2021 Best to end on the classifier so there's only 3 or 4 stands to put away and very few, if any walls. That way I can start drinking beer faster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpYoursPal Posted April 30, 2021 Share Posted April 30, 2021 1 hour ago, motosapiens said: why wouldn't you want to shoot the classifier stage first? seems like an advantage to do an easy stage with little/no movement to start out. Because I haven’t quite figured out the magic technique of “shoot a classifier like a regular stage” yet, and I end up shooting them like a moron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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