Cleaning at safe table

[broadside72]

So my centerfire pistols I can easily pull the slide to quickly clean my gun if need be at a safe table.

 

However my rimfire Steel Challenge pistol I can't do that without pulling the rail, etc. since it's a buckmark.

 

Anyone have options for not getting DQ'd while cleaning it without disassembly? If gate to lose a small screw at the range. I can get 6 stages or so before it starts to have issues

[HCH]

Don’t load your mags at the Safety Area?

 

I’m really having a hard time figuring out how you WOULD get DQ’ed at the safe table. 

[BobT]

A Buckmark should not be having issues after 6 stages....

[Lastcat]

57 minutes ago, broadside72 said:

 

So my centerfire pistols I can easily pull the slide to quickly clean my gun if need be at a safe table.

 

However my rimfire Steel Challenge pistol I can't do that without pulling the rail, etc. since it's a buckmark.

 

Anyone have options for not getting DQ'd while cleaning it without disassembly? If gate to lose a small screw at the range. I can get 6 stages or so before it starts to have issues

 

 

You can repair, clean, etc..your gun at the Safe Table. Just no ammo handling. Have you considered a Bore Snake? Or were you thinking about a full tear down and clean?

[broadside72]

Don’t load your mags at the Safety Area?
 
I’m really having a hard time figuring out how you WOULD get DQ’ed at the safe table. 

If I can't disassemble the gun some I can still be DQ'd for sweeping my hand. That's what Troy said during RO class.

[broadside72]

A Buckmark should not be having issues after 6 stages....

It's a significantly modified one that I need to send out to be tweaked more than I can do myself.

I've tried 4 different brands of ammo and it's all the same. Gets a little dirty and FTF

[HCH]

26 minutes ago, broadside72 said:

1 hour ago, HCH said:

Don’t load your mags at the Safety Area?
 
I’m really having a hard time figuring out how you WOULD get DQ’ed at the safe table. 

If I can't disassemble the gun some I can still be DQ'd for sweeping my hand. That's what Troy said during RO class.

 

10.5.5 specifically states “during a course of fire”

 

 

[broadside72]

 
10.5.5 specifically states “during a course of fire”
 
 

I know that rule but i swear Troy had a specific example of sweeping still applying at safe table. Maybe I misheard.

[outerlimits]

5 minutes ago, broadside72 said:

I know that rule but i swear Troy had a specific example of sweeping still applying at safe table. Maybe I misheard.

do you have any idea how many people sweep themselves when un bagging while the gun is in a bag?  i know, it's in a bag so it can't go bang.

[broadside72]

do you have any idea how many people sweep themselves when un bagging while the gun is in a bag?  i know, it's in a bag so it can't go bang.

Sweeping only applies when the gun is in the hand. In a bag is not in the hand. That's why you should be verifying orientation before removing the gun

[outerlimits]

7 minutes ago, broadside72 said:

11 minutes ago, outerlimits said:

do you have any idea how many people sweep themselves when un bagging while the gun is in a bag?  i know, it's in a bag so it can't go bang.

Sweeping only applies when the gun is in the hand. In a bag is not in the hand. That's why you should be verifying orientation before removing the gun

i understand the rules just fine- i still don't enjoy people pointing gun bags (read ppc) at me.

[broadside72]

i understand the rules just fine- i still don't enjoy people pointing gun bags (read ppc) at me.

PCC has additional rules about sweeping.

But I'm still trying to understand sweeping at a safe table. Some here imply it applies, others it doesn't.

I just need to clean my gun [emoji16]

[Hi-Power Jack]

I'd check with Your Local R.O. - just in case he interprets the situation differently    

[Flatland Shooter]

• At Area 4 a few years ago I got a stern warning about sweeping while working on a pistol in a safety area.  It came from the RM as he walked by.  He decided to stick around a few minutes to see that I complied.

Edited June 3, 2019 by Flatland Shooter

[motosapiens]

I'm curious what rules apply to sweeping while disassembling a gun at a safe table. I only looked cursorily, but I couldn't find any.

[motosapiens]

also, wtf are you doing to your buckmark? is it a new tight gun? Are you using dirty ammo (like the cheap armscor stuff)? Mine will go several matches without cleaning. 500-1000 rounds easily. 

[CSEMARTIN]

1 hour ago, motosapiens said:

I'm curious what rules apply to sweeping while disassembling a gun at a safe table. I only looked cursorily, but I couldn't find any.

I’m still trying to figure this one out too. 10.5.5 doesn’t say what happens after the course of fire is over.

[Flatland Shooter]

The closest thing I can find is Rule 2.4.1 Competitors are permitted to use the Safety Areas for the activities stated below provided they remain within the boundaries of the Safety Area and  the firearm is pointed in a safe direction.

 

Sweeping occurs when the gun is pointed in an unsafe direction and by the rulebook is defined as "Pointing the muzzle of a firearm at any part of any person’s body, while holding it in the hands, or placing it on or removing it from an object."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

s

[motosapiens]

8 hours ago, Flatland Shooter said:

The closest thing I can find is Rule 2.4.1 Competitors are permitted to use the Safety Areas for the activities stated below provided they remain within the boundaries of the Safety Area and  the firearm is pointed in a safe direction.

 

Sweeping occurs when the gun is pointed in an unsafe direction and by the rulebook is defined as "Pointing the muzzle of a firearm at any part of any person’s body, while holding it in the hands, or placing it on or removing it from an object."

 

 

 

I can't believe that was intended to complicate cleaning and working on guns, but I can see where an overzealous person would try to screw over a shooter by interpreting it that way.

[egd5]

"Overzealous"  That's the word I was looking for. Some peoples worry and obsession about sweeping is just plain stupid and devoid of any common sense.

[MikeBurgess]

I can only think of 2 scenarios where I would be concerned about sweeping while a shooter was at a safe area, working on it or moping the bore or whatever would not be a issue for me. 

 

1 pointing the gun at somebody else (part of not pointing it in a safe direction) I've seen it when people start focusing on the work at hand and forget that there may be people off to the side.

2 somebody looking down the bore from the muzzle of a assembled gun. 

 

 

[broadside72]

also, wtf are you doing to your buckmark? is it a new tight gun? Are you using dirty ammo (like the cheap armscor stuff)? Mine will go several matches without cleaning. 500-1000 rounds easily. 

I think it's the extractor that needs some more work. It's a newer barrel (swapped 1000 rounds ago maybe) and new slide on old frame. I've tried both a new extractor I've fit myself (to a point where I'm comfortable) that it runs for a while. I put the old extractor from old slide in and it runs better but still isn't perfect. I've also run both with new and old extractor springs.

I've shot Winchester, armscor, aguilla and Norma through it and they all hang up after a bit. Haven't tried federal or cci yet because I've got a bunch of ammo already and it's rather the gun run anything like it used to

[broadside72]

 
I can't believe that was intended to complicate cleaning and working on guns, but I can see where an overzealous person would try to screw over a shooter by interpreting it that way.

"Overzealous"  That's the word I was looking for. Some peoples worry and obsession about sweeping is just plain stupid and devoid of any common sense.

I can only think of 2 scenarios where I would be concerned about sweeping while a shooter was at a safe area, working on it or moping the bore or whatever would not be a issue for me. 
 
1 pointing the gun at somebody else (part of not pointing it in a safe direction) I've seen it when people start focusing on the work at hand and forget that there may be people off to the side.
2 somebody looking down the bore from the muzzle of a assembled gun. 
 
 

I'll just ask the RM and see what he says, at least for the range I'm shooting SC at.

[zzt]

My Buckmark had the same problem when using dirty ammo and a highly touted oil that turned out to be not so good.  I used a bore snake.  I dropped the brass end down through the empty magwell and out the ejection port.  Then I dropped the brass weight into the chamber and fed it down the barrel.  When you pull the snake out of the barrel you clean the feed ramp, chamber and barrel.  Do this two or three times and you are good.  I added oil between the slide and frame.  The fit is loose enough that it got in.

 

Changing to CCI AR Tactical ammo and Weapon Shield oil completely eliminated the problem.  Trying some of the new CCI Patriotic poly coated ammo brought is back with a vengeance.  That stuff is incredibly dirty.  It is even worse than the Federal Automatch I had been originally using.

[davsco]

so you're going to lock the bolt/slide back and insert a cleaning rod from the muzzle end?  seems inert at that point and i wouldn't consider that sweeping yourself.  but, sweeping someone with a pcc with flag inserted (ie, inert) is a dq so who knows...