Zero - What Distance?

[JohnnyD]

I should have all of the components for my PCC in the next couple of days.

 

What distance should I zero my C-More at?  I picked up the 4 MOA dot because I will also being using this for 3gun and not just USPSA.  Will either being using 124gr or 147gr Xtremes depending on what my guns likes.

 

Thanks

[Flatland Shooter]

For UML my zero is 75 yards (since that's where the MD likes to place the plate rack).  

[MikieM]

Lots of different answers here. Almost everyone has there own preference. I zero at 15 yards just like a pistol shooter might because we're almost always shooting a course designed for pistols. 

At our range we have those pesky little 6 x 6 inch hinged squares that are usually set out at the 15 yard mark. I want to make sure I center punch those. 

[JohnnyD]

12 minutes ago, Flatland Shooter said:

For UML my zero is 75 yards (since that's where the MD likes to place the plate rack).  

 

Thanks.  The 1 of 2 clubs that allow PCC appears to be switching to UML this season.  They were a 3GN club last year.

 

I know last year the few times they used their longer bay they had 6 or 8" plates around 75 yards for the PCC shooters while the rest were shooting at gongs at 200.  I was thinking a 50 yard zero would work but I might have to rethink that.  Have to hook into how much drop I should expect.

[Hi-Power Jack]

30 minutes ago, JohnnyD said:

 

  50 yard zero would work but I might have to rethink that.  

I'd set it for 75 yards, and know where the bullet hits at 10, 25 and 50 yards     

[Flatland Shooter]

With a 75 yard zero, once the bullet gets past 15 yards, POI will be less than 1.2 inch off from point of aim out to 85 yards.

 

Distance - Correction

15 yds - 0.7"  low

25 yds - 0.2" high

35 yds - 0.9" high

45 yds - 1.2" high

55 yds - 1.1: high

65 yds - 0.8: high

75 yds - zero

85 yds - 1.1: low

95 yds - 2.6" low

 

125 gr MG JHP @ 1085 fps

 

Calculated on Strelok and verified at the range.

[Flatland Shooter]

3 hours ago, JohnnyD said:

 

Thanks.  The 1 of 2 clubs that allow PCC appears to be switching to UML this season.  They were a 3GN club last year.

 

 

3GN had a 100 yard limit for PCC targets.    I don't see any reference to a PCC target distance limit on the UML rules.

[S&W686]

Since I use the same red dot on my PCC rifle as I do my Open Gun which is a C-More Slide Ride I zero at 15 yds.  The farthest we shoot at our local matches is 50 yds.  Most targets are set from 5 yds to 20 yds.

[stick]

I zero at 25 yards, but I'm only shooting USPSA, Action Steel and Steel Challenge.  Farthest shot is 35 yards. I agree with @Flatland Shooter  zero at 75 for UML.  I would also recommend Strelok+ to calculate your DOPE on closer targets.  I used Strelok for 3GN

[spininfirec]

On 3/13/2018 at 7:25 PM, Flatland Shooter said:

With a 75 yard zero, once the bullet gets past 15 yards, POI will be less than 1.2 inch off from point of aim out to 85 yards.

 

Distance - Correction

15 yds - 0.7"  low

25 yds - 0.2" high

35 yds - 0.9" high

45 yds - 1.2" high

55 yds - 1.1: high

65 yds - 0.8: high

75 yds - zero

85 yds - 1.1: low

95 yds - 2.6" low

 

125 gr MG JHP @ 1085 fps

 

Calculated on Strelok and verified at the range.

Very nice to know.  I set mine up at 15 yds.  Shot a pcc match and had a plate rack out at 75 and killed everyone.  no one knew there holds.  

[Alvin]

Okay, forgive me, but what does UML stand for?

[stick]

1 hour ago, Alvin said:

Okay, forgive me, but what does UML stand for?

united multi-gun league

[gerritm]

3 hours ago, stick said:

united multi-gun league

Newest 3-gun format & league that has several divisions where you can shoot PCC only or PCC combined with other weapons. Very inclusive and fun.

 

gerritm

[ChuckS]

6 hours ago, Alvin said:

Okay, forgive me, but what does UML stand for?

 

 

[JAFO]

I have my primary zeroed ~1" high at 25 yds.

 

What's a good distance for a side-mounted secondary optic?  I'm guessing I won't encounter a lot of long shots on hard weak-side leans, and I realize knowing the offset for close-up will probably be more critical than where the zero ultimately is, but I'm wondering what others are using.

[Xanatos903]

What's your holdover on the closer targets, say 7 yards, with a 1" high zero at 25? I just changed to a 25 yard zero and I'm having trouble reminding myself to hold higher on harder, close shots. 

 

Personally, I'd zero my offset optic the same as my primary. Less to think about, you know? 

[Flatland Shooter]

3 hours ago, JAFO said:

What's a good distance for a side-mounted secondary optic?  

 

The primary optic for my PCC used in USPSA and other bay matches (distances less than 30 or 40 yards) I sight in at 17 yards.  My laser and side-mounted optic are also sighted in at 17 yards.

 

One benefit for all to be set for the same distance is all I need is a wall at 17 yards to check that my sights have not drifted.  Place the green laser dot on the wall and verify the red dots for the other two optics agree and I'm all set.  If one does not agree, time to make adjustments.

 

Due to our glorious Texas sun, I run a large dot on my primary optic.  The laser is used on those pesky hard leans into close targets. The side-mounted optic is a much smaller dot.  Its still good for targets out there a bit and require a hard lean, but I'm also experimenting with using that smaller dot for tougher shots where the big dot is not precise enough to make a clean shot.  Like I said, its still in the experimenting stage but for me seems to be promising.

[Piracy85]

15 yards for uspsa.

Edited March 21, 2018 by Piracy85

[JAFO]

On ‎3‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 8:27 PM, Xanatos903 said:

What's your holdover on the closer targets, say 7 yards, with a 1" high zero at 25? I just changed to a 25 yard zero and I'm having trouble reminding myself to hold higher on harder, close shots. 

 

Personally, I'd zero my offset optic the same as my primary. Less to think about, you know? 

If I remember correctly, I need to hold at the top of the head box to hit the bottom of the upper A zone.

 

ETA: Actually, I think that was my 3yd holdover.

Edited March 21, 2018 by JAFO

[BartCarter]

It doesn't matter so much where you zero as much as knowing your offsets.  You can get your offsets with a ballistic program such as Strelok, which is available for phones.  There are also some ballistic calculators on line, but it is much easier to have a good one on your phone.  I think the Pro version was only $5. 

 

You need to measure your sight height over center of bore and put in the bullet information.  Very easy and you can sight in any distance you want.  I do confirm with live fire but have never found a measurable difference with 9mm out to 100 yards.

 

I sight in at 25 yards with a 2.7 inch sight height for my Vortex Venom.  With 115 FMJ 9mm at 1300 fps, my holdovers at different yards are:

 

5 > 1.8

10 > 1.2

15 > .9

20 > .4

25 > 0

30 > -.4

35 > -.7

40 > -.9

45 > -1.1

50 > -1.2

 

The first zero is at 25 yards and you aim low after that until the second zero at about 85 to 90 yards, where you would start aiming higher again.  You need to know your arc.  You are within about an inch from 10 to 45 yards.

 

If you are at an indoor range you are pretty much sighted in for a 25 yard zero if your shots are .9 below your aiming point at 15 yards.

 

I use a BC of .159, but it may vary for your choice of bullets.  Those of you into reloading will be able to dial in for your specific loads.

[Hi-Power Jack]

1 hour ago, BartCarter said:

It doesn't matter so much where you zero as much as knowing your offsets.   

 

The first zero is at 25 yards and you aim low after that until the second zero at about 85 to 90 yards. You are within about an inch from 10 to 45 yards.

 

 

The trick, IMHO, is to confirm those numbers by shooting a nice group at 50 yards.

 

I've found it is Much Better to sight in at a further distance (50 yards) and know your

offsets from there.   Much more precise     

[Pewpewlife]

For USPSA I've been using 25 yard zero but UML sounds like 75 yard makes sense

Edited March 22, 2018 by Pewpewlife

[BartCarter]

Again, it really doesn't matter what zero you use, you just have to know your offsets.  With my 25 yard zero my 75 yard hold is -.8.  I don't even need to allow for that small an offset. I am at zero again at about 86 yards.

[JohnnyD]

I got my C-More on my ULW zero'ed today at 25 yards.  I plan on zeroing it farther out but it took me quite of bit of time to even get it on paper.  Luckily the public range was dead this morning and the RO spotted me and I eventually got it on paper.

 

3.8 TG with the 124gr Xtreme grouped the best but it wasn't stellar.  Around 2" but I guess with a red dot it could be worse.

 

Going to load up more and test them at further distance and get it zero'ed for 50yards.

 

All my reloads and some remanufactured ammo I had functuned great.

[Bdh821]

I've been wondering the same. My variable is my PCC has an 8" barrel. So does that effect those numbers? 

 

I'm running 147 Xtreme on 3.1gr of titegroup, my pistol load. 

 

My PCC is a CMMG MK9 8" SBR with a DPP on the lowest leupold mount

Edited April 3, 2018 by Bdh821