2016 USPSA Revolver Nationals

[Bosshoss]

The 1911 and revolver have evolved over the years and maybe it is time for this match to evolve.

Perhaps a better way to put it is to let the SSC go back to being what it wants to be and take the USPSA Nationals on the road...

Yes and I have had this discussion with Mike Foley several times.

The down side for me is the nationals at PASA are close enough that I can make the trip. If they move west I don't know if I can afford to go.

Might be worth it for awesome stages and a better local things to do.

I vote for Silver Creek Conservation Club where the Indiana 400 is held. Great range(15 bays) and more things to do than anyone could want

[Bosshoss]

I hate to even bring it up but I think the rule change hurt attendance.

Which one is that?

6 Major/ 8 Minor

Also what I said above about the stages. Just want to clarify that the design of the stages was/is not the problem. It is the round counts and balance of the match that I don't like.

I shoot 4 or 5 Majors every year and a local pretty much every weekend and other than the classifer at locals I don't shoot as many 20 round or less stages ALL YEAR as I do at the nationals.(one match)

I really hate to complain because as a revolver shooter I love the challenge. I'm spoiled a little to as the local majors are all high round count matches(all the Indiana matches including the Indiana 400 with 18 stages and 400+ rounds and the Kentucky Sectional with 10 32 round stages)

32+ rounds I don't care, lots of steel I don't care, long shots I don't care, hard cover and no shoots I don't care, 8 shot friendly I don't care as we all have to figure out how to shoot the course of fire.

I love the Texas star and Polish plate rack but can see them slowing down the match.

As a old and fat guy I hate the low ports and other very physical challenges and I will bitch about them but I'm bitching about being old and fat and not the stages.

I understand the tradition of the SS Classic but I also here a lot of SS shooters complaining about the short round count stages.

The 1911 and revolver have evolved over the years and maybe it is time for this match to evolve.

That being said I'm glad to have a Revolver Nationals and will shoot it.

Thread drift...

You actually enjoy 10 32 round stages? That sounds awful to me, variety is the spice of life.

And your local match directors must have some serious hate of short courses if you shoot every weekend and don't see them. Super technical short and medium courses are way more interesting to me than big field stages. We have those regularly around here. 10-22 rounds, and you have to absolutely get it right. We had one a couple months ago that was a full size popper, mini popper, and a plate on one side of a wall and 3 turtles (3 per paper) on the other. That tiny 5 second stage probably had as much or more discussion on the best way to shoot it than most of the other stages in the match. That is awesome.

Back to topic...

I do think there should a couple more longer courses at this match, since it is the nationals and all. Testing as many skillsets as possible seems logical to me.

Yes I do like 32 round stages. If I'm going to drive over a hour one way to a local match and pay a entry fee I want the most shooting I can get.

Yes I enjoy a challenging stage like you described but I have seen challenging 32 round courses also.

I don't mind a short course here and there in fact some of our locals have gone to 7 stages with a classifer and a short course in 1 bay. I would guess that out the 4 locals I shoot a month other than the classifer I probably see 2 stages that are less than 28 rounds.

Yep every one has different opinions and that is what makes the matches interesting.

[Alaskan454]

As much as I love the 5-10 second stages, hosing 30+ rounds while running down range is darn pretty fun. I'm with BossHoss on this one. We average slightly over 20 rounds per stage including any classifiers.

[PatJones]

Just walked the stages. I think that major/minor might be pretty even at the match, but the disaster factor is higher with the 6 shot.

[71Commander]

Just walked the stages. I think that major/minor might be pretty even at the match, but the disaster factor is higher with the 6 shot.

Getting ready for the single stack this AM. Find out soon enough.

[PatJones]

I give up. I had too many makeup shots in single stack.... minor it is.

[underlug]

I give up. I had too many makeup shots in single stack.... minor it is.

The intelligent choice. The further down the skill level you get, the more advantage the 8 has. When you get to me forget about it. Congratulations to TGO on his win and the perspicacity to not "accept the challenge" and shoot major 6. High major was Shannon Smith who is a Grand Master in every other class and finished 26th. Face it. The eight shot killed the 6 shot competitively in this division as predicted by many.

Edited May 9, 2016 by underlug

[jhgtyre]

I give up. I had too many makeup shots in single stack.... minor it is.

The intelligent choice. The further down the skill level you get, the more advantage the 8 has. When you get to me forget about it. Congratulations to TGO on his win and the perspicacity to not "accept the challenge" and shoot major 6. High major was Shannon Smith who is a Grand Master in every other class and finished 26th. Face it. The eight shot killed the 6 shot competitively in this division as predicted by many.

I prefer to think of it as "the 8 shot saved the division."

[PatJones]

It's unfortunate that there's not a single stage that stage out to me as really great. Some of the stages were challenging, the shots were difficult, but the stage design was very "meh."

[PatJones]

Did any of you sign the "newspaper" on stage #5 under "Brian Enos Revolver Posse" or was it just us on squad #2?

Edited May 9, 2016 by PatJones

[underlug]

I give up. I had too many makeup shots in single stack.... minor it is.

The intelligent choice. The further down the skill level you get, the more advantage the 8 has. When you get to me forget about it. Congratulations to TGO on his win and the perspicacity to not "accept the challenge" and shoot major 6. High major was Shannon Smith who is a Grand Master in every other class and finished 26th. Face it. The eight shot killed the 6 shot competitively in this division as predicted by many.

I prefer to think of it as "the 8 shot saved the division."

How? Has participation increased? Or does it just make it more interesting (and saved it) for you? I know people that have left. I had direct communication with Strader in which he said that the division was never in jeopardy

[71Commander]

I was/am embarrassed. I stunk up the place. I sat in the corner in my room for several hours. All that was missing was a dunce cap.

[Tom Freeman]

How? Has participation increased? Or does it just make it more interesting (and saved it) for you? I know people that have left. I had direct communication with Strader in which he said that the division was never in jeopardy

Increased a lot in this area.

[underlug]

Down to 2 regular (but excellent) shooters in mine (though I cannot honestly attribute that directly to the 8 shot rule). Soon to be 3. What has been lost in my area are the casual revolver shooters. The northwest had a tradition in the fall where somebody would call an unscheduled revolver shoot and people would just show up with their revolvers. There were a few people that would get a wild hair and just show up sometimes at any given match. That doesn't happen much anymore.

What is the extent of your increase? Is it reflected nationally? I am all for it, if true. Do you attribute it to the fact that 8 shot is easier? Any theory has to why nationals participation tanked?

Edited May 9, 2016 by underlug

[alecmc]

Any theory has to why nationals participation tanked?

Mothers Day.

There is absolutely no good reason for it to be this weekend every year.

The match, while basic , had its tough areas. Lots of tight shots, no shoots, hard covers.

I shot a decent match, nothing crazy & didn't tank anything. Finished 9th place overall.

Congrats to all the winners.

Edited May 9, 2016 by alecmc

[revoman]

Any theory has to why nationals participation tanked?

Here is my theory on why and it is on the topic I started labeled "Premier Revolver Match 2016"

Looks like this year's IRC will again be the place to be for revolver competition. With 131 signed up in just 7 days from the opening of registration. I think this goes to show that a stand alone Revolver match whether it be the IRC or USPSA Revolver Nationals can draw the number of shooters when held by themselves.

I myself could not attend the Revolver Nationals this year due to medical reasons but even with me there total count would only be 89.

To me that is a sad showing for a national match and I do believe the turn out and declining numbers are due to the piggybacking on the SS Nationals and being held on Mother's Day. Run this as a stand alone Nationals, a 2 to 3 day format, not coinciding with any other national matches and I truly believe that the numbers would go up and have as many shooter's as the IRC.

This is just one man's opinion and I have been known to be wrong before but given what the IRC has done year after year for the last 25 years and is still going strong it seems like they are doing something right.

Edited May 9, 2016 by revoman

[Tom Freeman]

Any theory has to why nationals participation tanked?

Because shooting a revo is hard.

[Flexmoney]

Face it. The eight shot killed the 6 shot competitively in this division as predicted by many.

I prefer to think of it as "the 8 shot saved the division."

How? Has participation increased? Or does it just make it more interesting (and saved it) for you? I know people that have left. I had direct communication with Strader in which he said that the division was never in jeopardy

Increased a lot in this area.

Can you quantify that a bit?

[Flexmoney]

To me that is a sad showing for a national match and I do believe the turn out and declining numbers are due to the piggybacking on the SS Nationals and being held on Mother's Day. Run this as a stand alone Nationals, a 2 to 3 day format, not coinciding with any other national matches and I truly believe that the numbers would go up and have as many shooter's as the IRC.

This is just one man's opinion and I have been known to be wrong before but given what the IRC has done year after year for the last 25 years and is still going strong it seems like they are doing something right.

I would say the opposite. I think the Revo match gains shooters as they carry over from the SS match. Shooters have already made the trip, and get to shoot another division in the process. Many don't shoot Revo on a regular basis during the rest of the year. (SS too, for that matter.)

I know one of my local buddies went out to shoot because of both. Too bad he had a 6 gun (1st year for 8). I don't think he has shot revo much since.

[ktm300]

I would say the opposite. I think the Revo match gains shooters as they carry over from the SS match. Shooters have already made the trip, and get to shoot another division in the process. Many don't shoot Revo on a regular basis during the rest of the year. (SS too, for that matter.)

I would say you are correct. I know of 9 or 10 that I talked to that when asked if they were going to shoot Sunday said yes but only because they were already there.

[MWP]

I agree, keeping it with SS is only helping the numbers.

[revoman]

The numbers speak for themselves. In 2013 there were 119 in 2014 113 in 2015 106 and this year 86. Seems to me that if you take the 9 to 10 that stay over per year to shoot revolver the numbers are still dropping. If it was a stand alone nationals and held on Friday Saturday or Saturday Sunday I think you would see more participation as would be more apt to spend the money and time to travel for a few days instead of 1 on a Sunday. Especially on Mothers Day.

If you do not shoot SS why would you spend the extra $225 entry fee for SS and extra days in a hotel just to shoot the revolver nationals if you are a revolver shooter? Saturday for SS is usually filled by slots and I imagine that the 9 to 10 shooters that stayed shot SS on Saturday. I could be wrong on that. Myself I shoot both as I only live 120 miles away from Berry but most don't have that luxury.

So back to SS only helping with the numbers. If you take out the 9 to 10 that came over in 2013 and the 9 to 10 that stayed in 2016 the number of revolver shooters dropped from 109 to 76. That is a drop in revolver shooters by 30% in just 4 years. Seems like we are going in the wrong direction.

Don't get me wrong I think it was great of Pasa Park to put on the revolver nationals and the 3 I attended were fantastic (my performance was not LOL). I just think that a stand alone would bring the numbers back up. An idea would be to try SS on Wednesday, Thursday and Friday and Revolver on Saturday. Maybe even let revolver shoot with the SS as the stages are not changed that much or at all. I don't have all the answers but revolver nationals is headed in the wrong direction.

Congratulations to this years winners in SS and Revolvers.

[EEH]

We need video

[Flexmoney]

The numbers speak for themselves. In 2013 there were 119 in 2014 113 in 2015 106 and this year 86.

What were the numbers in the four years prior to that?

[revoman]

The numbers speak for themselves. In 2013 there were 119 in 2014 113 in 2015 106 and this year 86.

What were the numbers in the four years prior to that?

That I don't know.