seanc Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 So I was playing around with my 2011 today considering shooting it in an upcoming major. It is nothing special, essential a trubor with a brazos lightened slide. I was most struck by how little the dot moves on the 2011 with a 170 pf load compared to my 929 with a 125pf load. Its really remarkable, i barely have to hold the gun hard and the dot tracks up and down and never leaves the lense vs my revolver where I have to squeeze HARD with the weak hand to keep the dot in the lens. I get all the gas/comps etc explanations, i understand how major autos work I also sort of disregarded comps on minor barrels as foley and just another gap/port to collect lead/carbon but it did get me thinking about cutting some holes maybe midway down the barrel. Anyone have any good info on this? I see all manner of cuts and ports on open revolvers at the IRC but its unclear to me if there is any experience being applied to those cuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDanCheck Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Sean no one likes your idea[emoji3] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pskys2 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Magna Porting was very popular in Revolvers for years, more for hunting loads I believe, and they were a trapazoid cut rather than just holes drilled and they were cut an inch or so from the muzzle. Maybe someone has one they could experiment with in minor and post the results. Toolguy, I'd bet you've had at least one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatJones Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 I had 4 hybra ports cut into my last carry gun, a 38 special j frame that Jack Wiegand worked over. It recoiled slightly down. I've never shot magna ports that felt that effective. I'd probably look at 3 or 4 hybra ports if I was building an open gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnRodriguez Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 (edited) my major load use to be 11.8gr VV super mag powder with a 115gr Hornady RN and was about 175pf. it pushed strait back with no muzzle live. My current minor load is a 125gr Zero RN with 3.9 VVn310 at about 133 pf. never lose the dot. Magna ported back in 2002. I cant seem to paste the picture of my barrel, so I keep playing with it. Edited June 6, 2015 by JohnRodriguez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 I had a 625 with a Magnaported barrel. I couldn't tell much difference between it and a regular barrel, recoil wise. I ported a 3" M65 with 5, 1/8" holes along each side of the front sight. It seemed to help a little with .38 Spl. loads. A funny thing happened though. Now it shoots pretty much the same place with any load from light target loads to 180 grain magnums. The Magnum recoil is fairly reduced too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snertley Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Toolguy, have you chrono'd all those rounds through that gun with the ports? It would be intresting to see the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toolguy Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 No, never thought of that. I'm pretty busy right now, but if I ever get around to it I'll post the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothguy Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Power Pistol works well for a ported or comped revolver shooting minor loads. It's a little loud and flashy indoors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revofan Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 I run a 130pf out of my ported and comped 627 v-comp with 6.0gr of HS-6 behind a two alpha 135gr coated bullet out of starline short colt definatly helps revo shoots very flat !!!! Here's a pic of my barrel 4 tornado ports from pinicle customs and a custom made comp from a friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted June 6, 2015 Author Share Posted June 6, 2015 I run a 130pf out of my ported and comped 627 v-comp with 6.0gr of HS-6 behind a two alpha 135gr coated bullet out of starline short colt definatly helps revo shoots very flat !!!! Here's a pic of my barrel 4 tornado ports from pinicle customs and a custom made comp from a friend the big comp on the front, steel I assume? I know its subjective, but how is it when you take that off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revofan Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Better then stock for sure I'm planning on shooting monson icore this month I can bring it and you can shoot it both ways with and without and make your own assessment if you want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted June 6, 2015 Author Share Posted June 6, 2015 Better then stock for sure I'm planning on shooting monson icore this month I can bring it and you can shoot it both ways with and without and make your own assessment if you want Cool, I'd like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) So I was playing around with my 2011 today considering shooting it in an upcoming major. It is nothing special, essential a trubor with a brazos lightened slide. I was most struck by how little the dot moves on the 2011 with a 170 pf load compared to my 929 with a 125pf load. Its really remarkable, i barely have to hold the gun hard and the dot tracks up and down and never leaves the lense vs my revolver where I have to squeeze HARD with the weak hand to keep the dot in the lens. I get all the gas/comps etc explanations, i understand how major autos work I also sort of disregarded comps on minor barrels as foley and just another gap/port to collect lead/carbon but it did get me thinking about cutting some holes maybe midway down the barrel. Anyone have any good info on this? The slide and barrel assembly on an auto acts as a "recoil suppressor" by reducing peak recoil impulse using much of the energy to cycle the slide. IMHO, most of the "effect" of ports alone is psychological. All compensators have ports, but ports alone are not compensators. Compensators definitely reduce recoil and muzzle rise because there is an expansion chamber where forward moving gas slams into a flat "wall" causing a forward directed force cancelling out part of the recoil force. Ports in a barrel create very little (if any) forward directed force. Michael Plaxco posted some good info on this in "Shooting From Within" were he experimented with a compensator and showed that the benefit comes from the forward gasses, not the upward vents. Edited June 7, 2015 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatJones Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Shooting 38 special in a big n frame creates very little felt recoil, and often doesn't produce much gas volume. I don't shoot an open revolver, do we really need anything beyond some ports to help the gun flatter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted June 7, 2015 Author Share Posted June 7, 2015 So I was playing around with my 2011 today considering shooting it in an upcoming major. It is nothing special, essential a trubor with a brazos lightened slide. I was most struck by how little the dot moves on the 2011 with a 170 pf load compared to my 929 with a 125pf load. Its really remarkable, i barely have to hold the gun hard and the dot tracks up and down and never leaves the lense vs my revolver where I have to squeeze HARD with the weak hand to keep the dot in the lens. I get all the gas/comps etc explanations, i understand how major autos work I also sort of disregarded comps on minor barrels as foley and just another gap/port to collect lead/carbon but it did get me thinking about cutting some holes maybe midway down the barrel. Anyone have any good info on this? The slide and barrel assembly on an auto acts as a "recoil suppressor" by reducing peak recoil impulse using much of the energy to cycle the slide. IMHO, most of the "effect" of ports alone is psychological. All compensators have ports, but ports alone are not compensators. Compensators definitely reduce recoil and muzzle rise because there is an expansion chamber where forward moving gas slams into a flat "wall" causing a forward directed force cancelling out part of the recoil force. Ports in a barrel create very little (if any) forward directed force. Michael Plaxco posted some good info on this in "Shooting From Within" were he experimented with a compensator and showed that the benefit comes from the forward gasses, not the upward vents. yeah. I watched a video awhile back. I guess the whole idea started maybe with jim clark(?) trying to tame pin guns. The compensator had no ports, but was weight at the end of the barrel, the practical effect of it being that it slightly slowed down the action which was calming the gun down pretty dramatically. Ports and gas volume came later. I think way to much is made of it by a lot of gunshop level logic vs physics, but still curious. Is why I asked about having a big comp out on the front of a revolver matters. The weight certainly always helps , but mid ports, especially with a high volume powder like HS6, which happens to be a favorite in 38 supercomp guns, could have a meaningful effect aside from making the thing a lot louder. alec hurt my feelings for making this post. Squeezing harder with the weakhand is a good way to unf*ck other issues no matter the case... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underlug Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 I have 2 ported open guns. I use Ramshot True Blue in long colt at approximate .38 super max loads. The difference is perceivable. Whether it actually helps is not really perceivable at my level. Pay your money. Take your chances Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 Jerry when he shot and the now good open guys...Rich, Neil, Vic, etc. all have comps or ports on their open guns. If there was not a perceived advantage real or not they would not have them.... This has been discussed in the past ad nauseum....Lots of opinions.....Do whatever you like.... Disclosure.....(I have ports on my open revo as well....).... DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 (edited) Jerry when he shot and the now good open guys...Rich, Neil, Vic, etc. all have comps or ports on their open guns. If there was not a perceived advantage real or not they would not have them.... As I said in my post, compensators certainly do reduce recoil and muzzle flip. The reason is simple: recoil line of force is directed above the wrist so it generates rotational moment twisting the gun up. Reduce recoil force and you reduce muzzle flip. A compensator has an expansion chamber where gasses leaving the front expand out and then are stopped at the front wall of the compensator by the restriction of the small front opening. That is the source of the forward force offsetting part of the recoil. Ported barrels do not generate this forward force although the do create a tiny down force from the upward venting of gas. My point is that ports and compensators are not the same thing at all. Compensators do have gas ports, and certainly have been proven to reduce recoil but not simply because they are ported. Gas ports alone are not compensators, and the several ported barrels I currently own (9mm and .40) have only what could be generously described as a negligible effect at best. It's possible port effect might be slightly higher with higher pressure ammo, I shoot only factory load. But felt recoil is a perceived force so it is user's choice. The point I was making is that mixing ported barrels and compensators is apples and oranges. Edited June 7, 2015 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longbarrel Posted June 7, 2015 Share Posted June 7, 2015 I've had and do have guns with magna porting and compensators on them. They kick less. They shoot with a little less muzzle rise. I know what all is said about recoil physics and you cant make energy disappear and on and on. I say they kick less. Every one I have shot with a comp or ports kicks less. Some more than others. What Doug said. Troy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 (edited) I've had and do have guns with magna porting and compensators on them. They kick less. To my knowledge, nobody has ever said that compensators do not reduce recoil. My statements were only about ports. It's interesting I have never seen any "bench test" data published for "before and after" porting where g meters were affixed to the gun and recoil measured in the X and y axis. It would be a very easy thing to test. I conducted a test on porting some years back on a Beretta 92 with a ported barrel (two ports) where I added four more ports one at a time. I did not get reduced recoil but I got a barrel so noisy and flashy nobody would want to shoot it. If porting actually has any significant effect it should be very easy to measure it and quantify it. I know what all is said about recoil physics and you cant make energy disappear and on and on. Not sure what that's about either. Compensators don't make anything disappear, they simply trap muzzle gas, cause it to expand and then force it into a "wall" which is like slamming your hand against a wall. It just takes energy that exists anyway, and would issue out into the air, and cause it to hit something. That forward force partly offsets recoil so the net recoil force reduces. It is simple physics. Edited June 8, 2015 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 This is a good conversation. I guess I was really only talking midports. Open auto comps are all out there and at one point I had the notion to just get one of the "well known" ones to work with minor and have my rev barrel threaded and just screw it on there and see what happened. Its a lot of money to "just see" though. Its to late in the season to try and get anything done now, everything takes 6 months minimum to get done and I need the gun to practice for the IRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWP Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 I was under the impression that mid ports were to relieve pressure out the end of the barrel, not actually compensate for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregg K Posted June 8, 2015 Share Posted June 8, 2015 Its to late in the season to try and get anything done now, everything takes 6 months minimum to get done and I need the gun to practice for the IRC. Don't you have a Dremel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seanc Posted June 8, 2015 Author Share Posted June 8, 2015 Its to late in the season to try and get anything done now, everything takes 6 months minimum to get done and I need the gun to practice for the IRC. Don't you have a Dremel? I have a dremel AND a harbor freight drill press. That and some 50 cent drill bits from the bargain bin at home depot....nothing can stop me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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