Nevadazielmeister Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Seems like most clubs do the tarp thing (from the responses). Over the past 8 years I've shot at 16 different ranges (not including the Nat'ls in Las Vegas). Each has a different way of handling brass. Seems to me if the MD shoots a .38 super, they seriously allow everyone to pick up their brass any way they like. If the MD shoots a 9mm, he has very little interest in anyone picking up brass, and feels it impedes progress of the match without any real benefit. Totally up to the MD. If you're going to bring it up, I'd bring it up gently, and perhaps privately. Or, get a ground swell before the meeting, if the MD doesn't like the idea. I don't know if that's 100% true about MD's. But for my matches I welcome shooters to pick up THEIR brass before we leave the stage. But I do not let the brass whores pick it clean. I don't allow any extra brass pickup until everything is cleared off of the bays and put away. This encourages a few to stay and help. But I personally get highly irritated when me(MD) and a handful of people are carrying everything to the barn to be put away and the chickens are taking home a thousand pieces of brass and didn't lift a finger to help. Sure I get some extra brass out of the deal but those that stay and help all get some if they want to pick it up. I like this approach and agree. Being a MD myself and just getting back into USPSA, this is smart thinking. There are always those who seem to somehow get out of helping out. Luckily, here in Reno, NV, they all pitch in and the stages are torn down super fast. When I came over to watch my wife shoot, I stayed and helped put away stages while she rested, as she has a minor back injury. After that was all done, THEN I went out and collected some brass. Man, there was a ton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimitz Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 at our local matches we remind everyone that if they don't stay to help teardown there is a fairly high likelyhood that their scoresheet will have problems finding its way into the official record ... nobody ever goes to the bays to scour brass until breakdon is complete .... you just have to find the right incentive for folks .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ming the Merciless Posted January 11, 2015 Share Posted January 11, 2015 at our local matches we remind everyone that if they don't stay to help teardown there is a fairly high likelyhood that their scoresheet will have problems finding its way into the official record ... nobody ever goes to the bays to scour brass until breakdon is complete .... you just have to find the right incentive for folks .... Wow! Do you also support adding time (+2) to the score sheets of shooters who don't help with teardown? (-2) scoring for shooters who do help with teardown? (-4) scoring for shooters who help with setup? Seriously, you would take a customers money for the match fee, then fail to deliver the services/product by "losing" their score sheet? If said scoresheet is lost as a result of club bias, are the match fees refunded, otherwise that's outright theft. Just for the record I always help with teardown, help with setup when I can (I live 2+ hours away from some matches 3+ from others), patch, set steel, RO, etc... But I consider your clubs tactics as unacceptable and unbecoming a volunteer sport! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chfields Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 at our local matches we remind everyone that if they don't stay to help teardown there is a fairly high likelyhood that their scoresheet will have problems finding its way into the official record ... nobody ever goes to the bays to scour brass until breakdon is complete .... you just have to find the right incentive for folks .... Wow! Do you also support adding time (+2) to the score sheets of shooters who don't help with teardown? (-2) scoring for shooters who do help with teardown? (-4) scoring for shooters who help with setup? Seriously, you would take a customers money for the match fee, then fail to deliver the services/product by "losing" their score sheet? If said scoresheet is lost as a result of club bias, are the match fees refunded, otherwise that's outright theft. Just for the record I always help with teardown, help with setup when I can (I live 2+ hours away from some matches 3+ from others), patch, set steel, RO, etc... But I consider your clubs tactics as unacceptable and unbecoming a volunteer sport! Wow....that flies in the face of what this sport is all about. I understand what its like to watch people just shoot the match and leave without helping clean up afterwards, but that doesn't give you the right to "punish" them by "losing" their score sheet. That is despicable and bordering on illegal. If I caught a range doing that to me, there would be he!! to pay......On our range, they require all brass to be picked up and either taken home or put in the brass buckets. Some of the shooters bring tarps, (I actually just bought the black mesh one) and lay them out as we shoot. At the end of the match, those that want their brass (especially the 38Super guys), we divvy up between us...everyone has been very cooperative and easy going about it. I'm thinking of getting the brassmower as well, as I can't bend down very easily anymore...LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 at our local matches we remind everyone that if they don't stay to help teardown there is a fairly high likelyhood that their scoresheet will have problems finding its way into the official record ... That could turn ugly when word of that gets to the SC, AD or HQ. Do what you think is right, but I don't think this is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickT Posted January 18, 2015 Author Share Posted January 18, 2015 My wife and I can (and do) get to the steel challenge matches early enough to help set up. Tear down takes no time at all since we only have four bays each of which is switched over at the 1/2 way point of the match. The last squad in a bay does the change-over or if at the end of the match tears down and stacks the stands, etc. at the bay opening. I've not stuck around for the brass distribution, but that's got to take some time - 30 shooters, 300 rounds ea., that's 9000 rounds that have to be sorted. Added to that the interest some, probably myself included ,who would like to get a decent percentage of their own brass back and I can't imagine that process not taking 45 minutes. The club could have a sign-up at registration for tear-down and not start the match until they had a sufficient number of folks. I think the approach to brass distribution favors a small group of folks who don't care how long the match takes and have traditionally benefited from sticking around getting 2x-3x more brass than they shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willz Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 (edited) The way Zack does it doesn't take more than a minute or two with the tarp at your 4 o'clock. Grabbing your brass off the tarp takes less time than that. Picking it out of the dirt or grass, now that takes time. I like the tarp. I hate shooting a match and leaving my brass because everyone is in a rush to hurry up and shoot and get to the next stage. Most everyone at My club will help paste and police brass. A match I shot in Utah. No one was picking up brass. I tried to get mine or as much as possible. To make it worse some guy from the squad behind us kept showing up when we were about half finished and scooping up our brass. Very unsportsmanlike in my opinion. I've only shot a couple of big matches (200+ shooters) and I'm amazed no one picks up brass. Edited January 18, 2015 by Willz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I've only shot a couple of big matches (200+ shooters) and I'm amazed no one picks up brass. Were those level II matches? If so, they are typically lost brass matches anyway. Not allowed to pick up your brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxshooter Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 When I first started shooting the next shooter get ready to shoot and the shooter in the hole did the same. Two people on the squad would go pickup the brass while the balance of the squad pasted reset targets. By doing it between shooters it did not take anty time and sorting was not a problem. For this to really work all the squads have to do it this way so only the last shooters brass is on the ground. Brass recovery was better because it did not get stepped on or kicked around like it does if you wait on the entire squad to shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piney Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I'd be happy to just recover what I've shot at t match. It's become such a big deal at some matches I've shot at, I usually just leave it alone. People almost getting into arguments, 2-3 people roaming around downrange pecking at the brass while we all wait, lack of folks taping/resetting targets because they're pecking at the brass, folks not helping to tear down, etc etc. Loss brass matches aren't too bad of an idea, IMO. One group I know of collects their brass as a club, then sells it by the bucket from a list of interested members-- once its your turn you get to buy a bucket, then go to the bottom of the list. Another group lets the SO's have access to the brass first-- a perk for taking their time. Yet another collects the brass and anyone a member get a baggie full of mixed at the end of the match once its torn down. That's a perk for those staying to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obsessiveshooter Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 In Colorado, the outdoor matches I've shot typically have 12-15 people on a squad. A few people tape, a few pick up brass and it all gets handed to you or put in your brass bag that you dropped near the starting position. It works and people are getting their own brass back. I would be pretty unhappy if I used really expensive brass or shot an odd caliber and wasn't getting it back or had to rummage through a giant pile at the end of the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbarker13 Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 The tarp idea for Steel Challenge matches seems to make sense - something that could be done without really interrupting the flow of the match. To me, that's the key. I don't care what people do about their brass as long as they don't slow down the match. Few things are more annoying than bringing a squad onto a bay, where we have to wait 5-10 minutes for the squad ahead of us to finish picking up brass before moving on their next bay. It's not just the 5-10 minutes, but rather the extra hour that adds over the course of the entire match. Fortunately, at most of the matches around here, everyone waits until the stages have been torn down before picking up brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ming the Merciless Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 To me, that's the key. I don't care what people do about their brass as long as they don't slow down the match. Few things are more annoying than bringing a squad onto a bay, where we have to wait 5-10 minutes for the squad ahead of us to finish picking up brass before moving on their next bay. Oh, there's lots of things more annoying that having to wait a couple of minutes for the squad ahead. Such as not having a chance to get a drink, grab a bite to eat, have a minute or two before you shoot to relax, load magazines, etc... because you're too busy RO'ing, painting steel, resetting stages (only 4 bays for an 8 stage match), trying to keep 4 sets of magazines loaded (the wife also shoots two divisions) all because a bunch of impatient jerks want to ramrod the match to a finish before 2pm. That's really annoying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 almost all place i shoot do it at the end. they treat it as a reward for staying to the end to help tear down and clean up. leave early and you don't get any brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanb Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Depends but most of the time all he brass hits. A table and then it gets scooped up at the end if no one wants it. We typically shoot with 10 plus shooters Ina. Squad though so there are equal parts brass hawking and those doing tape etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 Few things are more annoying than bringing a squad onto a bay, where we have to wait 5-10 minutes for the squad ahead of us to finish picking up brass before moving on their next bay. It's not just the 5-10 minutes, but rather the extra hour that adds over the course of the entire match. If it takes more than 2-3 mins to pick up a squad worth of brass, they're doing it wrong. I personally would love a couple minutes downtime tho, to clean mags and reload. At any rate, it sounds like most places have worked out a system they are happy with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave33 Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) The range I shoot steel challenge at also holds USPSA and IDPA matches and has lots of tarps already in PVC frames, about 10' by 10'. They stake one on the ground and one vertically, sort of a brass deflector, so the area to collect brass is very small. That way two folks paint targets and 2-3 collect brass between shooters. Range policy is you are welcome to keep your brass but any unwanted brass goes to the range to help pay for supplied drinks during the match. Very fast to collect brass and you keep your own personal brass. Edited January 21, 2015 by dave33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDanCheck Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 One word Revolver... I get all my brass back. People even pick it up and hand it back to me. For all the bs about people from other squads on the stage your shooting. Take a shot of harden up and tell them to get off your stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 We pick up brass for each other between shooters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordfan485 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Must be a regional thing but every USPSA/3gun/IDPA club match around me is a lost brass match. You guys are lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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