Moving with both hands on gun

[Sandbagger123]

When I move between target arrays I have the habit of taking my support hand off of the grip. I noticed in a lot of vids of the top guys, they run with both hands on the gun. So I assume the advantage is no need to regrip the gun when acquiring targets.

So is this something people should strive to do in training ?

[Mark R]

yep...and some folks lower their gun as they move, just to raise it again to acquire a sight picture. Shave off a few hundredths of a second and keep the gun up coming into a new target/array. In a timed sport, every little time saver is an advantage...seconds add up.

[outerlimits]

YMMV, but for me, if i'm taking any more than a few steps to engage a target, i run much faster with only one hand on the gun. getting into the next position requires target acquisition, which includes re-gripping. worth it, IMHO.

[kneelingatlas]

I never noticed it before so the first video I grabbed of JoJo, sure enough he rarely lets go except to reload:

Edited July 7, 2014 by kneelingatlas

[Sarge]

YMMV, but for me, if i'm taking any more than a few steps to engage a target, i run much faster with only one hand on the gun. getting into the next position requires target acquisition, which includes re-gripping. worth it, IMHO.

Kind of how I had it explained to me as the best way to do it initially. Then as you progress you will develop your own technique/rhythm. By looking at the video posted by kneelingatlas it seems like JoJo keeps both hands on the gun a lot but then again he didn't really do any long distance movement. I certainly don't keep both hands on the gun nearly that much. If I'm just shuffling port to port or a few quick steps then I keep both hands in there but other than that I think it feels awkward to move very far without using the natural arm swing while running.

To an extent I think it will boil down to personal preference when finding the best time to drop one hand.

[MarkCO]

But at 0:12, when he moved more than just 1-4 steps, he took his support hand off the gun. Manny got me to take my weak hand off the gun when moving more than just 3 or 4 steps...my times were faster and my hits upon re-gripping were better as opposed to not taking the hand off the gun. Gun up also seems to help the times.

[2MoreChains]

I had to DQ somebody at the last Area match because they kept a two-hand grip while running hard going right to left along the 180 of the stage. Every step he took caused his shoulders and arms to swing side to side. Finally by the 3rd or 4th step the side to side movement was enough to break the 180. IIRC there was about 20-25 feet of movement required. When I shot that stage a couple days prior during the Staff Shoot I ran it more or less the same way but I one-handed the gun so I could keep it pointed down range while I was running right to left.

If I'm only moving a few feet/yards I keep a two-handed grip and try to keep the gun up. But if I'm making a big movement (more than a few yards) I one-hand the gun because I found I can run faster that way. Granted, I have to re-acquire my grip and get the gun up when I'm a step or two out from the shooting position, but doing it that way seems to work better for me. The amount of distance is the deciding factor for me, as well as direction of movement, but in the end it really depends on how the stage is laid out.

[EA308]

If I am moving short distances, I keep two hands on the gun or very close to the gun to maintain balance. If I am moving long distances, I take one hand off the gun so that I can run.

[pjb45]

A good friend of mine took a class from Mike Seeklander and Phil Strader in Tulsa.

Their comment was if you going more than a few steps, drop your support hand and 'pump it' similar to what you see sprinters do in a race.

I was watching a training camp for NFL prospects. The coaches talked about the importance of arm movement for adding quickness and speed.

Seemed like good advice.

[Nimitz]

While there is no exact formula, in general if you are only moving a few steps you will be faster by keeping both hands on the gun. Once you need to move any distance past about 3 yds you'll see top shooters let go with their weak hand so they can run as fast as possible to the next position. The trick of course it to remount the gun as you move into the next position so that the instant the next target becomes visible you are pulling the trigger. That's where the top shooters make their money and the average shooter ..... doesn't.

[Moltke]

Whatever is going to get you to your next sight picture faster is the right decision.

[tkheard]

For me, shooting single-stack and production, my support had almost always comes off -- because I'm doing g a mag change!

[Moltke]

So thinking about this again, taking your hand off the gun is only bad if the time it takes you to reacquire your grip is "in addition to" the time it would take you to have gotten off that next shot. If everything is happening concurrently and its a wash then it doesn't much matter now does it? So if its faster to pump your arms hard and run, then drop that hand and run - but if its faster to keep your hand on while you get into that next position then do it. This is going to be very situationally dependent.

[kneelingatlas]

Just be sure to keep at least one hand on the gun at all times

[Ultimo-Hombre]

Seems that the important factor is having the gun up and ready to fire as soon as the next target is available. In reviewing video with this in mind I see guys breaking their grip if the move is big enough to allow time to re-acquire grip and bring gun up before arriving in position/ target becomes available.

For me breaking the grip is fine, the sin is waiting too long to get it back up.

[nitrohuck]

For a couple of steps or side steps it is best (for me) to keep my hands on the pistol. If I am running more than that it makes sense to go one handed, it allows for faster and less awkward movements, smoothness is key, right?

Plus for some stages it is entirely impractical to keep both hands on the pistol when running in order to not violate the 180 rule (I.E. stages where you have to move "backwards" away from the line of fire, where you run and hold the pistol over your shoulder so as not to get DQ'ed.) Also if you are running right to left (and are right handed) it definitely is a lot safer to have only your right hand on the gun, so as not to break the 180.

As for getting your sight picture up quickly, that is just you needing to know when to get both hands back on the gun and get the sights up, which is unique to your stage and your body movements

[CSStreett]

Just be sure to keep at least one hand on the gun at all times

+1

[fwrun]

For me, shooting single-stack and production, my support had almost always comes off -- because I'm doing g a mag change!

Yes! I can't think of a time I've ever had to run to another position in production without a mag change.

And as far as pumping your arms for better speed- that is good advice if you already have some pre-existing abilities AND it's longer than a 10yd sprint. Otherwise, your best improvement for a sport like USPSA that doesn't require a 20-30yard movement is to work on your FOOTWORK (things like ladder drills). Quick feet = speed.

[garp]

What I see myself doing on just short steps, or just a turn from one side to the other with out taking a step, depending on the COF, is I drop the gun some, take that one step or slight turn, then have to bring my gun back up and re-acquire the sight picture. I have not broke my self of just turning, or taking that one step and keeping my sight picture in front of me. I do that little "gun dip." Arrrrggggg!!!

[Sin-ster]

Whatever is going to get you to your next sight picture faster is the right decision.

That, exactly, is the only answer.

You could set up several drills and run them both ways to figure out what's faster at what distance; some top level pro's do exactly that.

You could (after getting sufficiently comfortable with a hot gun to not be consciously thinking about its position during a CoF) just let your body figure it out, on the fly.

The choice is really yours, but if you're intent on having the gun up and on target as you stop in a new position, it shouldn't be something you have to consciously figure out. "Long run, one hand; short shuffle, both hands." And after that... you get the idea.

[waktasz]

Get a timer and try it. We found it was about 10 yards of movement or more before breaking your grip was worth it. When running left to right on a stage (I am right handed) I try to never break my grip. Right to left is different because of 180 concerns.