What's the best value in a 1911?

[Revopop]

So here's my story:

Sometime in the next year, I'm planning on buying a 1911. It will primarily be used for USPSA shooting, and I may occasionally carry it.

I have owned a S&W 1911SC and a Wilson KZ45. I currently own a 1911, it is a "parts gun", built by a USPSA shooter. I got it here on the forum classifieds. It is an Auto Ordnance GI frame built up with various parts, Caspian slide, genuine Bo-Mar rear sight, etc. It's a fine gun and it runs like a top, but I want something a little nicer.

What I specifically don't like about my current 1911 is minor. The Bo-Mar sight picture is great, but IWB carry is not an option. The sharp edges of the sight aren't compatible with my love handles. It has a duckbill grip safety, not the high grip style like the Ed Brown part. It has a poorly fitted barrel, the same one that originally came with the complete Auto Ordnance GI 1911. It's accurate enough for most things, but I need all the help I can get.

I'm willing to pay up for quality, but I want to get the most (pardon the pun) bang for my buck. I want a 5" 1911 with fixed sights that I can rely on in a match or on the street. Doesn't seem like too much to ask, right?

I also posted this on another forum that's more general in scope. I'm interested to see the differences in opinions of competition shooters who actually shoot their guns versus those of curmudgeons who spend a lot of time on the internet while polishing their old Colts.

Edit to add: Looking for a single stack.

Edited November 30, 2008 by Glockopop

[chirpy]

The Tauris seems to be a great value but I don't think it's rated for +P (for carry ammo). Para just announced a low end SS at a good price. Kimber has a lot to choose from.

You can always pick up a starter gun and have it built the way you want but that's a whole different thread!

FWIW

Richard

[sperman]

The Tauris seems to be a great value but I don't think it's rated for +P (for carry ammo). Para just announced a low end SS at a good price. Kimber has a lot to choose from.

You can always pick up a starter gun and have it built the way you want but that's a whole different thread!

FWIW

Richard

+1 on the Taurus. It's inexpensive enough that you can have a gunsmith do some customizing and it's still cheaper than anything else out there.

[prreed10]

I would go for the Springfield Armory Loaded, model PX9109LP or model PI9132LP if you want stainless/adjustable sights. Only changes you might want to make is removing the Internal Locking System by changing the mainspring housing and have a trigger job done. I picked up mine (PX9109LP) a couple years ago for $675 off gunbroker.

Here is a picture of mine. I added a S&A Magwell and different grips.

If you want a gun to build up, I recommend the Mil Spec - PB918LP. It already has the ejection port lowered and flared and the sights are usable. I purchased a GI - their base model and built it up myself. I ended up spending almost 1K on it - $170 for Novak sights and sight cuts alone. I could have bought a nice TRP for that price. I did learn some valuable info about the 1911 though.

Here is my GI:

I say Springfield because their customer service has been outstanding. Hope this helps.

[Steve J]

From all the semi-custom shops, the very best build, most reliable, and most accurate 1911 guaranteed by test target from Ransom Rest for the money will be a Les Baer every time.

[Paul Burtchell]

From all the semi-custom shops, the very best build, most reliable, and most accurate 1911 guaranteed by test target from Ransom Rest for the money will be a Les Baer every time.

+1

[Bill J]

From all the semi-custom shops, the very best build, most reliable, and most accurate 1911 guaranteed by test target from Ransom Rest for the money will be a Les Baer every time.

+1

I agree, I have 2 Les Baers and I can't find anything to complain about with either one of them.

Bill

[Rocket35]

You can now get replacement sights from Dawson Precision for the Taurus as well. The Spartan is a good low price gun. But the Trojan is a better "value".

[ima45dv8]

I'm still convinced that dollar-for-dollar, the best value in a 1911 is a Baer Premier II.

You can spend a lot more, but you won't get much more.

[HSMITH]

Baer or full custom, none of the production guns are even close. Money well spent IMO.

[herky]

The Baer "guys" are right. I have the Premier II's daddy from 1994, called the Combat Pistol. It is as tight now as it was when new. Of course, now they cost alot more now than in 1994, but as Howard says - money well spent.

[XD Niner]

There are hundreds of choices. Given that you want to shoot USPSA and are willing to pay for quality but don't want to just waste your money a Les Baer is certainly a strong candidate. If I were looking for an entry level pistol I'd buy the Taurus without a second thought. It is a terrific value for the money.

I have a full size Springer Black Stainless which is set up for competition right out of the box. I've added a FO front sight, a one piece FLGR, changed the grips (I have large hands) and added a nice trigger job. It is very accurate (way more than I am), has been very reliable and looks great to boot.

I have used it for carry as well although I like my Commander sized S&W1911PD better for that role. It can also be used as a backup gun for competition in a pinch.

The choice is yours. Check out what the various manufacturers' provide and find one that meets your needs or that can be modified for a reasonable cost.

Good luck!

Edited November 30, 2008 by XD Niner

[Peakbagr]

I have 2 Les Baer Bullseye guns. Fantastically accurate and reliable.

Just got a Baer P2 in .38Super with accuracy guarantee and some custom features. Can't wait to work up loads for it.

Edited November 30, 2008 by Peakbagr

[cnote]

Didn't Front Sight just write a nice review about STI's spartian. Brazo's list price is $594. Seem's like a nice entry level 1911 to me.

[Revopop]

Just to clarify, I'm not looking for an entry level gun. I consider the parts gun I already have to be that. What I want is a 1911 that will be the last one I ever have to buy. So far, the Baer is looking good. I'm sure guns from guys like Nighthawk or Wilson are very well built, I just think that for that kind of money I could have a full custom build done from the ground up. Seems like the consensus is that Baer is the way to go if I want that kind of quality for less.

Don't worry, Snob Club members, I'll still probably buy more 1911s after I get this one.

[Steve J]

Just to clarify, I'm not looking for an entry level gun. I consider the parts gun I already have to be that. What I want is a 1911 that will be the last one I ever have to buy. So far, the Baer is looking good. I'm sure guns from guys like Nighthawk or Wilson are very well built, I just think that for that kind of money I could have a full custom build done from the ground up. Seems like the consensus is that Baer is the way to go if I want that kind of quality for less.

Don't worry, Snob Club members, I'll still probably buy more 1911s after I get this one.

Right you are. You don't get a better gun from Wilson, Nighthawk, Ed Brown. You just pay more. Les Baer = the best bang for the buck. Production guns like Kimber, STI, Springfield, ?Taurus? are not even in the same race and are usually WAY over priced for what you get.

[MisterB]

I'm getting into this late, but just wanted to give my .02 worth. I have had a a LB Prem II w/acc. guarantee since the mid 90's and I have never been disappointed. I have a custom build 1911 that I shoot more just because it fits me better. My wife just got a S&W per.ctr. 1911. We've only put 100 rounds or so through it, but seems to be worth the money, and she thinks it is "pretty".

Any of these are heads above the Colt combat elite I started out with.

Sounds like you know the features you are looking for. The pistol smiths guild might be a good place to get info about custom builds.

Good luck with your quest.

[Baer45]

I'm for Baer Premier II as starter also. I own Nighthawks, Wilsons, Ed Browns but the Baer beats them all hands down for a few hundred or more less. After my first Premier II I've ended up with 5 Baer 1911's and 3 AR's. As another member alluded to; once you have one it is hard to shoot anything else...

[Duane Thomas]

It's hard to make a case against the Baer Premier II. A few years ago I got in three Les Baers for article purposes. The one I fell in love with was the Ultimate Master. However, it did not escape my attention that, had I fallen in love with the Premier II, I could have brought it up to functional parity with the Ultimate Master just by having a mag funnel installed, and wound up with, essentially, the same gun for a lot less money.

[Carmoney]

I guess I have a different perspective from those who recommend the "semi-custom" guns like the Baer, Wilson, Nighthawk, etc., for sombody who is looking for the best value. If you have plenty of money to burn, OK fine, they're all very nice. I'm in a position to afford several nice high-end 1911 custom pistols myself. But from a practical perspective, I defy anyone to tell me what's wrong with my lightly-modified Springfield Loaded (which I have shot at several Single Stack Classics as well as a whole bunch of smaller SS matches), or my lightly-modified Kimber .38 Super (which I shot at the Single Stack Classic this year as well as a bunch of smaller SS matches). These guns have trigger jobs that are a little light for street carry, but otherwise they have proven themselves to be extraordinarily reliable and functional 1911s. Bottom line: I think a nice production 1911 would be the next logical step for you.

[HighVelocity]

Not a damn thing wrong with a tweaked SA Loaded model. Trigger job, springs and some grips that you like and you're good to go. But, I've owned a few dozen Springfields, Kimbers and Colts and none of them have/had the "feel" of a Baer or Wilson built gun. The refinement just isn't there. When I pick up one of my Springfields, it feels good but when I pick up a Baer or Wilson, I feel lust in my heart.

[chirpy]

Just thought I'd add another .02...that makes.04! It's a shame you aren't closer to Wayne Novak's shop in WVA. I have seen a number of his guns and have had tons of work done by his shop and it is top shelf, second to none. Looks and feels good too!

Richard

[buddy_fuentes]

I understood you to say that you wanted nicer than you have. I'm with the rest of the gang, Baer. I have three and as stated, you can spend more money, but you won't get more gun.

I also have a KZ-45 like the one that you said you use to own. Super pistol....accurate as any gun out there and reliable as anything, too.

If I were getting a new pistol with fixed sights, I would have the builder put on Heinie race cut sights. They are the closest thing to a Bo-Mar sight picture that I have found. And as far as I'm concerned that is the best.

[Revopop]

Yeah, I really liked my KZ, but ultimately the only thing it's really ideal for is IDPA CDP. It's a helluva gamer gun in that division. Once I found SSR, I decided that's the only IDPA division I was interested in. After an IDPA match one day, I took it out to burn through some unreliable handloads and a guy offered me more than I paid for it. I didn't have much use for it, so I decided to take the money and run.

[John_C]

But from a practical perspective, I defy anyone to tell me what's wrong with my lightly-modified Springfield Loaded, or my lightly-modified Kimber .38 Super. These guns have trigger jobs that are a little light for street carry, but otherwise they have proven themselves to be extraordinarily reliable and functional 1911s. Bottom line: I think a nice production 1911 would be the next logical step for you.

I'm also shopping for a good 1911 to shoot USPSA Single Stack, and L10. It will be my first 1911, and I don't plan to spend $2,000 like some of the semi-customs are going for. Is thee any production models out there that we should stay away from?