Can someone help me with the finer points of brass cleaning?

[Obvious]

I’ve only been reloading for a couple months, and have always used my frankford arsenal wet tumbler with stainless steel pins. As of lately it’s been about 1/3 full of brass, fill with water and a squirt of dawn/pinch of lemi shine. The cases all come out shootable and haven’t given me any problems, but after a day or two the brass starts to dull a lot more than I’d expect. I’ve also noticed it seems like the primer pockets are hit or miss on whether the pins cleaned them or not. Harbor freight has a cheap 2.5L ultrasonic cleaner for ~$75, would this be worth looking into? I’d like to get my brass to factory level of shiny and stay there, along with nice clean primer pockets. I currently tumble for about an hour to an hour and a half, not sure if much more time would make any significant difference there. I don’t want to dry tumble because of dust getting in the air, so wet tumbling for now. 

[Joe4d]

I missed out on al the wet tumble pins craze... never heard of it when I quit shooting, came back and its suppossed to be all super duper..
Seems like way more work and expense to me.
Basic Dillon Brass tumbler,, corn cob media, couple shots of your favorite media additive on occasion..  leave it over night,, done. Brass is nice and shiney... been working for me for 30 years.

 

[Sandbagger123]

depending on the water you may need more lemi shine.  i fill mine up 3/4 full with brass and put about 2 oz of lemis shine and 2 oz of dawn and steel pins and they come out shiny.  i run it for the full 3 hours.  brass dulls when exposed to air so it losing it luster would seem normal. i keep mine in a 5 gallon airtight bucket and close it tightly . i also dry mine with a food dihydrator 

 

seems odd the primer pockets are not getting clean. how long are you running it?

[Farmer]

You may not be getting them rinsed good enough and the leftover Lemi shine is causing oxidation. I also add some Turtlewax, Wash and Wax and others use armor all wash and shine. It helps with water spots and slicks the brass up plus helps keep it from getting dull so quickly. I’ve gotten to where I don’t always use the pins unless the brass is really dirty. 

Edited October 9, 2022 by Farmer
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[Rustygun]

4 hours ago, Joe4d said:

I missed out on al the wet tumble pins craze... never heard of it when I quit shooting, came back and its suppossed to be all super duper..
Seems like way more work and expense to me.
Basic Dillon Brass tumbler,, corn cob media, couple shots of your favorite media additive on occasion..  leave it over night,, done. Brass is nice and shiney... been working for me for 30 years.

 

I gotta agree with you, just don’t see the need to get super shiny brass.  I dry tumble in a Frankfort arsenal tumbler with walnut media bought at harbor freight and it works just fine for me.  My goal is to fill it with burn carbon and immediately eject it into the dirt.  
can somebody explain to me how extra clean brass presents any sort of mechanical or accuracy advantage?

[Sarge]

3 hours ago, Rustygun said:
can somebody explain to me how extra clean brass presents any sort of mechanical or accuracy advantage?

It doesn’t. Just some prefer the extra shine. Also, some prefer that it eliminates dust if they tumble in enclosed areas. 

[Obvious]

1 minute ago, Sarge said:

It doesn’t. Just some prefer the extra shine. Also, some prefer that it eliminates dust if they tumble in enclosed areas. 

Exactly what sarge said. If factory brass can stay shiny for months I don’t see why mine shouldn’t. And I live with family members and don’t want to expose them to lead/dust if it can be helped, so I prefer wet tumbling. 

[Kwontanamo]

7 hours ago, Sandbagger123 said:

depending on the water you may need more lemi shine.  i fill mine up 3/4 full with brass and put about 2 oz of lemis shine and 2 oz of dawn and steel pins and they come out shiny.  i run it for the full 3 hours.  brass dulls when exposed to air so it losing it luster would seem normal. i keep mine in a 5 gallon airtight bucket and close it tightly . i also dry mine with a food dihydrator 

 

seems odd the primer pockets are not getting clean. how long are you running it?

When I shot open with 38SC I would do this as well. However, there was a problem that I started to notice and I'm not sure if tis entirely because of the wet tumble. I would load my ammo as usual and I would get some rounds where the back of the case, near the case head, would blow out. It wouldn't blow my magazine our or shoot out of the ejection port. It was weird none the less and out of the 2-3K worth of 38SC, it was impossible to tell which were faulty. I ended up turning it all into a scrap yard for money and bought new brass from Starline just to be safe. 

[Intel6]

I have found the wet cleaning works better when you have more brass in there. I try to make sure I have it at least half full if not 3/4. If I have to, I will try and plan on cleaning other brass of the same caliber or even throw in some brass I already cleaned just to bulk it up.  It is more work separating etc.  but it is worth it to get the clean brass.

 

I use citric acid (same thing as lemishine about 2x .45 ACP cases full) and Armor all wash & wax and only run it for an hour and have excellent results. I rinse well and my brass stays shiny for quite a long time. Supposedly the wash & wax leaves a bit of a wax coating that keeps it from tarnishing too fast.  Not sure if that is it but it seems to work for me.

 

Armor All Wash & Wax

[Sigarmsp226]

I eliminated the Dawn and Lemi-Shine completely so that the PH of the water does not need to be controlled.  

 

I now use Armor All Car Wash-Wax (The orange-ish yellow color stuff in the link above that INTEL6 kindly provided)) and Simply Green and I clean 3000-4000 pieces of brass in a 45 minute cycle - then rinse twice with tap water from the water hose, separate the pins from the brass, and let the brass dry in the Mississippi summer sun (2-4 hrs) on a mesh tarp (allows excess water to drain thru to the concrete.  I usually clean 15k-20k during a cleaning process.

 

All my brass is de-primed before cleaning (Rollsizer Depriming Machine) and my primer pockets get 95+% clean using this process. Many have said, and I agree, that pistol primer pockets do not need to be cleaned before reloading but I am pretty OCD when reloading so that is why I de-prime before cleaning.

 

I also schedule these cleanings when my wife is out of town because this electric concrete mixer with 3000 pieces of brass, 10lbs of SS pins, and 4 - 5 gallons of water makes a heck of a racket - I wear ear plugs and head phones when it is running and now I also run these cycles outside the shop rather than inside - a lot less water and mess to clean up.

 

 

 

Edited October 9, 2022 by Sigarmsp226
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[Farmer]

2 hours ago, Intel6 said:

I have found the wet cleaning works better when you have more brass in there. I try to make sure I have it at least half full if not 3/4. If I have to, I will try and plan on cleaning other brass of the same caliber or even throw in some brass I already cleaned just to bulk it up.  It is more work separating etc.  but it is worth it to get the clean brass.

 

I use citric acid (same thing as lemishine about 2x .45 ACP cases full) and Armor all wash & wax and only run it for an hour and have excellent results. I rinse well and my brass stays shiny for quite a long time. Supposedly the wash & wax leaves a bit of a wax coating that keeps it from tarnishing too fast.  Not sure if that is it but it seems to work for me.

 

Armor All Wash & Wax

2X^  You can feel the difference if you don’t use the wax and if you happen to size it later it’s much easier with the wax. I tried using some Plow Wax (for snowplows) but a little too much and the brass would get sticky. 

[HesedTech]

On 10/8/2022 at 10:20 PM, Obvious said:

I currently tumble for about an hour to an hour and a half, not sure if much more time would make any significant difference there

I tried it all and ended up with this, a Frankford wet tumbler and Brass Juice. 
https://www.thereloadingstation.com/products/brass-juice-case-wash

 

Without a doubt this cleans my brass better than anything, comes out brilliantly shiny and just the other night at a competition I was asked how I got it so clean. 
 

No pain in the rear pins, just fill up the tumbler with brass, hot water and a little Brass Juice then tumble for about 2 hours. Rinse and dry with a cheap food dehydrator resulting in clean shiny brass. 
 

Yes I tried all the home made formulas of Lemi, soap, car soap, polish, pins, and such. Nothing does as well as Brass Juice. 

Edited October 10, 2022 by HesedTech

[Sigarmsp226]

HesedTech - Thanks for this reminder about Brass Juice. I have not read a single negative comment about this brass cleaning solution so with your post I am going to order some and give it a try.  
 

Thanks for your post and feedback on the Brass Juice….

[Speedwagon]

I had the same dulling issue with the Lemishine and detergent mixture. I read somewhere that the citric acid causes this on brass. I switched to the Frankford Brass Cleaner and my brass looks better than factory brass and stays that way. I tumble in a Frankford wet tumbler with pins, about 1000 cases at a time for 2 hours. I never heard of Brass Juice though I might try some next time I need some. 

So, some say all this work is only to make brass shiny but I don't see it that way. I dry tumble my brass for 2 hours, decapp and then wet tumble. The water that comes out of the wet tumbler looks like mud so if I didn't wet tumble I'd be putting all that crap through my dies and gun. 

This is just me, we all have our own preferences. 

Edited October 17, 2022 by Speedwagon

[B767capt]

I just switched to brass juice to eliminate the pins in my FART.  I have used pins for several years both pistol and rifle with no problems.  Recently I cleaned about 300 Lapua 6.5 Creedmoor cases and was having trouble getting the bolt closed with the finished round.  I am using Whidden's bushing resizing die and a Sheridan case gauge to check fitment.  The cases wouldn't fit in the case gauge.  I emailed John Whidden thinking the die might be off and after several email exchanges he asked how I cleaned the brass.  He said the pins are known to peen the case mouth and try eliminating the pins.  That's when I ordered the Brass Juice.  Sure enough after looking closely, the case mouth looked like it had been flared by a powder die.  Hard to see but running your fingernail over the edge you could feel the flair.  The bushing in the die would not straighten them out so I trimmed .002 off with my Henderson trimmer and and then the bushing did straighten out what was left.  Cases then slid easily into the case gauge.  Funny I hadn't had this issue on my other cases.  So no more pins for me and I just finished my first batch with the brass juice and they look like new and the clean up without pins was much easier. 

Edited November 8, 2022 by B767capt

[Speedwagon]

44 minutes ago, B767capt said:

He said the pins are known to peen the case mouth and try eliminating the pins.  That's when I ordered the Brass Juice.  Sure enough after looking closely, the case mouth looked like it had been flared by a powder die.  

 

This is interesting. I've been noticing that "flare" on my 9MM brass and was wondering what might be causing it. I also have been using stainless steel pins when wet tumbling and recently bought some of this media but haven't tried it yet. It seemed the crimp die was taking it out and they are gauging fine so I didn't worry about it.

 

Since I have more of the Frankford brass cleaner I'll try that without pins or other media and see how it comes out and eventually may try some Brass Juice.

[PhotoRecon]

I'm using the Extreme Rebel tumbler.

 

In my experience there is a sweet spot of time, brass size and quantity.

 

I use pins, warm water and Dawn.  For 9mm I run at least and hour with 500 cases.  Too little brass and/or time and the cases don't fully clean or tarnish later on.

 

I use allot of range pickup so cleaning is mandatory before roll sizing. Nor do I want any fouling or crud introduced into my progressive loading equipment and pricey firearms.

 

I tumble all my rifle and pistol brass before any processing. Have yet to notice any problems whatsoever.

[PhotoRecon]

On 10/9/2022 at 8:10 AM, Kwontanamo said:

I would load my ammo as usual and I would get some rounds where the back of the case, near the case head, would blow out.

 

Had this exact same problem with 9mm brass produced in the last year or two. It only happens with Winchester and brass produced by Winchester for other headstamps such as Browning and Herters.

 

I'm guessing they're brass isn't as good as it used to be.

 

I stick with Blazer brass, Federal and Remington for 9mm major which I tumble with pins after each firing.

 

I have one lot of Blazer I've loaded to major 8 times so far to see how long it lasts. So far holding up well.

[Joe4d]

anybody else tumble in corncob and end up with purple brass ?

[Farmer]

@Joe4dWhere’d you get your corncob media? Did it have polishing rouge/compound on it?

Edited November 25, 2022 by Farmer

[SnipTheDog]

14 hours ago, Joe4d said:

anybody else tumble in corncob and end up with purple brass ?

I have heard where some people would have too much acidity in the water and leach out the brass leaving the rounds pink.   Haven't heard that for dry tumbling though.

[Sigarmsp226]

Joe - I remember a couple of years back folks on this forum talking about Winchester or Federal manufacturing a “training round” that was loaded in a brass case that had a purple coating (I think).  Could it be that the brass you tumbled looked to be heavily tarnished and once your cleaned the brass ot brought out that purple coating?  
 

Just a thought…..

[Farmer]

3 hours ago, Sigarmsp226 said:

Joe - I remember a couple of years back folks on this forum talking about Winchester or Federal manufacturing a “training round” that was loaded in a brass case that had a purple coating (I think).  Could it be that the brass you tumbled looked to be heavily tarnished and once your cleaned the brass ot brought out that purple coating?  
 

Just a thought…..

I remember those but weren’t they steel?? Never saw any so don’t know for sure. 

[RudyVey]

On 11/7/2022 at 7:47 AM, B767capt said:

I just switched to brass juice to eliminate the pins in my FART.  I have used pins for several years both pistol and rifle with no problems.  Recently I cleaned about 300 Lapua 6.5 Creedmoor cases and was having trouble getting the bolt closed with the finished round.  I am using Whidden's bushing resizing die and a Sheridan case gauge to check fitment.  The cases wouldn't fit in the case gauge.  I emailed John Whidden thinking the die might be off and after several email exchanges he asked how I cleaned the brass.  He said the pins are known to peen the case mouth and try eliminating the pins.  That's when I ordered the Brass Juice.  Sure enough after looking closely, the case mouth looked like it had been flared by a powder die.  Hard to see but running your fingernail over the edge you could feel the flair.  The bushing in the die would not straighten them out so I trimmed .002 off with my Henderson trimmer and and then the bushing did straighten out what was left.  Cases then slid easily into the case gauge.  Funny I hadn't had this issue on my other cases.  So no more pins for me and I just finished my first batch with the brass juice and they look like new and the clean up without pins was much easier. 

.."eliminate the pins in my FART".. glad you did, must be hurting like hell....;>)

[Nolan]

2 hours ago, RudyVey said:

.."eliminate the pins in my FART".. glad you did, must be hurting like hell....;>)

 

Ohhh, where's the Like button when you need it!

 

Nolan