okc icore Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 Iam wanting to build an sti or sv gun 5inch would you build with a bull barrel or a bushing barrel and if you pick one over the other why would build the gun that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 (edited) Brazos is hard to beat. Those guns go boom, boom, boom. Plus Bob stands behind the guns and he supports USPSA. Great gun, what else do you need to know. If you shoot up to the gun you are a GM. Edited July 24, 2011 by Coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okc icore Posted July 24, 2011 Author Share Posted July 24, 2011 Iam wanting to know whats the difference between the bull and bushing barrel guns? not who to build the gun for me thanks chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RH45 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I've run both, and prefer a bushing bbl because it's lighter, and transitions faster. It's also legal to use for IDPA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudden Death Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) I would suguest talking some shooters into letting you shoot their guns, different ones as to the way they are built, see what works for you, weight, reduced grips, sight tracker, etc. I cant speak for all shooters , but most of them are happy to let other people shoot there guns. good luck Edited July 25, 2011 by Sudden Death Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al503 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 For a beginner/intermediate shooter, I'd suggest the bull bbl for the extra weight. It will help with the recoil especially if you're shooting major. For the intermediate/advanced shooter, you'll know, or at least have a better idea of what works best for you by then. One thing to keep in mind: its usually easier to take off weight than it is to add it out in muzzle end of the pistol. There are several things you can do to cut weight but not too many to add weight out in front of the gun. Regardless, I would wager the vast majority of all limited shooters (U-GM) are shooting bull bbls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CocoBolo Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 For a beginner/intermediate shooter, I'd suggest the bull bbl for the extra weight. It will help with the recoil especially if you're shooting major. For the intermediate/advanced shooter, you'll know, or at least have a better idea of what works best for you by then. One thing to keep in mind: its usually easier to take off weight than it is to add it out in muzzle end of the pistol. There are several things you can do to cut weight but not too many to add weight out in front of the gun. Regardless, I would wager the vast majority of all limited shooters (U-GM) are shooting bull bbls. +1 on all the above. I spent many hours searching for a Brazos then I acutally got a chance to shoot one, while I will say it is an excellent gun I preferred my weighty Edge to the feel of the Brazos. To put things in prespective I shoot with two Limited GM's one shoots a bushing gun the other shoots a bull gun, one shoot only jacketed the other Precison moly but both shoot WST and they are both incredibly fast. Being a scientist I pondered this a length and determined the GM with the light gun a diesel mechanic handled the recoil better than the guy that flew planes for a living, a lot of wrist strength difference, hence the preferece for a heavier gun. When it all boils down its about your preferece and skill level, either is capable of doing the job in the right hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoothdraw Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 + 1 on heavy gun. Try 6" bull barrel with heavily lighted slide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warpspeed Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Bull barrel for reasons stated above; more weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I have a bull barrel gun with a short dust cover. I added a few ounces of weight with a heavy magwell and I'd add even more weight if I could! I'm not sure how strong the guys are who prefer lighter guns but I love my 9mm single stack and I'd have a 50 ounce limited gun if someone would make me one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Biondi Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Bull barrel... no other way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I prefer my guns light. Both my 5" and 6" guns weigh in at 36oz and I can tune an oz out of both with a mainspring housing swap if I want it lighter, but I like the weight in my hand. I have spent a LOT of time working on my grip strength and have found that a strong grip and light gun is faster for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel1212 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 as you've noticed there isn't a wrong answer. Your going to have to shoot some guns to find out what you like. I prefer a bushing barreled gun. Several of the top GMs run edge type guns with radically lightened slides. ITs just a choice you'll have to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okc icore Posted July 25, 2011 Author Share Posted July 25, 2011 thanks for all the info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodownzero Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I'm actually not that convinced that it makes much of a difference. I've met GMs and Ms with really heavy guns, so it must not be that much slower. Sometimes I think perception = reality when it comes to this stuff, and the lighter gun (just like using lighter bullets) might *seem* faster even if the timer wouldn't indicate that. I'm not saying that there isn't a difference at all, but most shooters probably wouldn't see a remarkable performance difference between a 35 ounce gun and a 45 ounce gun in Limited. Because of that, I think it's more about what you prefer than what is absolutely better, even for you as the individual shooter. In other words, I think you could shoot a match with a bushing barreled/short dust cover 5" gun today and the same match with a bull barreled Edge the next day and the differences would be minimal. I haven't confirmed this theory by shooting someone else's gun in a match, but I tend to think that any perceived equipment advantage is more in our heads than reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stardust tommy Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 take a look @ www.chamberscustom.com and you can see there is another option than bullbarrel/bushing... Joe builds great bullseye pistols and uses bushings, bullbarrels and conventional barrels with sleeve cones. all shooting sub 1.5" @ 50y go to the site - gallery and the first picture of a double stack, look at the barrel gr T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
818-DVC Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I'm actually not that convinced that it makes much of a difference. I've met GMs and Ms with really heavy guns, so it must not be that much slower. Sometimes I think perception = reality when it comes to this stuff, and the lighter gun (just like using lighter bullets) might *seem* faster even if the timer wouldn't indicate that. I concur 100%. If a top GM can shoot a light gun well, They should technically be able to shoot the heavy gun just as well/better dependent of the load. I don't think even the most sensitive professional shooter can relate much difference. I suck and I love 5" long dust cover sight tracker or bull barrel guns with tungsten guide rods and now I really like steel grips & magwells. There's 4 ways right there to add weight to a gun and or muzzle. I like the sight tracker because to the front sight doesn't cycle with the slide, helping me find my sight picture faster. I wish the rules for single stack allowed a bull or ribbed barrel in my 5". JL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Anderson Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 My first 2011 Limited Gun was built by EGW. At the time Edge guns were all the rage (it's been awhile). I talked to George at length about what I wanted in a gun. I was running a Glock 35 at the time and not having trouble with the recoil. His recommendation, and what he built me, was a short dust cover, bushing barreled .40 with a lightened slide and a tungsten guide rod. I've got two set up the same right now. If you're looking for peak performance you'll want to use the lightest gun you can absolutely dominate and control. If it takes an Edge with 20 oz of lead hanging off it to do so, well man up Nancy boy. Just kidding...kind of. The lighter gun will allow you to draw and transition between targets more rapidly. That's why Steel Challenge guns are light. It's all about draw and transitions. USPSA adds the element of recoil management with multiple shots as well as higher powered ammo. If you have the ability to deliver fast accurate fire with a light gun, there is no advantage to adding weight. It just makes you slower. If you have trouble controlling a light gun, a heavier gun might be your pick. I'm a fairly substantially sized individual (read big fat bastard). What works for me may not work for you. As far as the specific question about Bull/Bushing. Bull barrels have the advantage in strength and durability. There is no bushing to fail. Bushing barrels get the nod for a lower reciprocating mass (at least that's was EGW said). Less weight moving back and forth translates to less flip. Bushing barrels, fit properly can also be more accurate. This isn't really an issue for USPSA as a bull can be fit very well. Certainly well enough for anything we do in USPSA. The Bushing accuracy really doesn't show up till you get into NRA AP or Bullseye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircooled6racer Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Hello: Why not get a pistol setup for both barrels. Get it with a bushing barrel to make it IDPA legal and get a bull barrel fitted for USPSA. Then decide which one you like better. I like a light quick reacting pistol so a light slide and barrel setup works for me. Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blaster113 Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I think it depends on one's skill level with light vs heavy. If a shooter is relatively new to the game I'd suggest a bull barrel gun with a full length dustcover just cause the heavier gun is a little easier to control. For a veteran shooter maybe a std. profile gun with a bull bbl. Ive seen M and GM shooters absolutely kick ass with heavy Edge type guns so I dont think the weight will slow one down too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBoyle Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 [quote name='Chuck Anderson' timestamp='1311623571' Bushing barrels get the nod for a lower reciprocating mass (at least that's was EGW said). Less weight moving back and forth translates to less flip. I never understood how people can say it is less reciprocating weight. The bushing itself has weight that is added to the slide! My opinion is that a bull barrel would have less reciprocating weight except for the "unique" slide which is heavier than a standard slide. I have shot both light and heavy and, to be honest, on the pressure of the clock I could not tell a difference. An informal shooting test always reveals something that I like about any configuration. Just pick one and do not second guess it. Springs and loads are also different ways to make a gun recoil like you want it to. Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIIID Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 This discussion boils down to one thing the shooter. A person with upper body strength will be able to manage/control a gun easier than one who is out of shape and weak. I would suggest a bushing barrel, extra weight can always be added if needed. Tungsten guide rods and barrel sleeves are the easiest options that increase the most weight. Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latech15 Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I agree with the others. You should get one and shoot the piss out of it. You will learn the timing of the gun and get used to which ever one you shoot enough. I am one of those individuals who swaps guns and divisions a lot so I never get enough time behind a gun to get the timing down the way I should. Just a personality quirk I guess. That being said, I would go with a bull barrel and a lightened slide. To steal the term used above, "less reciprocating weight" and more weight out front to fight muzzle flip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okc icore Posted July 29, 2011 Author Share Posted July 29, 2011 all this info is great i got to shoot some limited guns from local gun club members i shot a bull barrel gun with lightened slide not much recoil with 200 gr bullets and also shot a bushing barrel gun with 180gr and the sights return fast with a little more recoil the guns only weigh a few ounces different but the bull barrel shot much better groups and the transitions felt the same with either gun thanks for everyones info now have to find someone to build me a awesome limited gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.roberts Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I never understood how people can say it is less reciprocating weight. The bushing itself has weight that is added to the slide! My opinion is that a bull barrel would have less reciprocating weight except for the "unique" slide which is heavier than a standard slide. Brian Remember, the barrel moves with the slide for a short time. And I'm pretty sure that a bull barrel weighs more than a barrel and bushing. So, while it might be too negligible to notice, a bushing would technically have less reciprocating mass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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