dlaroe Posted April 8, 2011 Share Posted April 8, 2011 For seeing black sights on a dark background I read somewhere (Brian's book maybe?) take a single file swipe to the very tops of serrations just to brighten them a little. Not enough to glare but enough to see. I didn't even do it uniformly but its enough to pick the front sight out of a dark background. -D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gigamortis Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 This is a very interesting thread. As far as a front sight goes, I tried fiber optics at first and while quite functional in outdoor lighting, they were pretty much effectively "black" for our indoor matches. I wanted something that would work in most all lighting conditions without me having to adjust back and forth between two different front sight strategies. I then tried a gold bead up front. The gold was great for a wide spectrum of lighting conditions, but when the sun got down low in the afternoon, one side of the bead was "louder" than the other side. This caused me some misses on some long distance poppers, with all misses in the exact same spot just off the edge. The "louder" side of the gold bead was getting centered in the rear notch instead of the full diameter of the bead itself. I then went to a white bead up front. So far, this has been the ticket for me for shooting the same gun indoors and outdoors. I found some solid white round styrene rod at Hobbytown USA. You can get it in .040, .060, and .080 diameters. It melts and installs just like fiber optic. Since it doesn't gather or amplify light like a fiber optic, it is not near as "loud" as fiber in the daylight, but visible enough for finding the front sight in dim light. The melted domed end will reflect available light like the gold bead, but in a much more even, subtler way. I have found that the domed white bead is much more functional than typical concave factory white dots which are prone to shadowing over in dim light. The visible remainder of my front sight blade is serrated, which seems to make for a sharper outline for lining up the top of the blade with the rear for the long shots. The front sight serrations are also visibly distinctive as compared to my plain black Warren Tactical .150" notch rear sight. Even in our lights out indoor flashlight shoots, the white bead is easy to pick up without getting overbearing. During outdoor shooting, I can find that white bead just fine without the "in your face" attention diverting intensity of a fiber optic. If I was only shooting outdoors in the daylight, I would most probably give the narrow all black serrated front sight a try. A few master class shooters I have observed around here shoot with that setup. There's no doubt there is something advantageous to it if it is working for those guys. Of course, the IDPA blood that runs through my veins makes me stay with something that works for me in all lighting conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benos Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 Thanks for the interesting post gigamortis. I never thought of trying a white bead - everything you said makes sense though. Peripherally note the bead; focus on the edges. be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted July 27, 2011 Author Share Posted July 27, 2011 It does make sense.... but I can't see going to anything different unless my sight fails. I get all the info I need from a sight picture that isn't confusing. I haven't been sorry to ditch the fiber once in 2 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okc icore Posted July 27, 2011 Share Posted July 27, 2011 i run fiber optic front sights but i also have custom made rear sights that have a ( u ) notch thats only sligtly larger than the fiber this combo is super deadly even at fifty yards.but this wouldnt work if i used a standard bomar style rear sight thats why fibers have gotton such a bad warp ? my fiber works great indoors i dont know why others dont Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leftridge Posted July 28, 2011 Share Posted July 28, 2011 (edited) I think I'm in the same boat. I just put in a black broom bristle to try. I have been ignoring the fiber and my hits are good, but I don't think I really need the fiber now. Edited July 28, 2011 by Leftridge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangerTrace Posted July 29, 2011 Share Posted July 29, 2011 I've been fighting to resist this thread for months. I lost my fiber during a stage at the Double Tap Championship a while back. It was just before the last array, which was a swinging plate rack. It took me a few shots to realize what had happened and I had a bagillion misses, be fore I cleared the rack. Later, for other reasons, I was blessed with a reshoot on that same stage, AFTER I had installed another FO rod. I only had 1 miss on the plate rack and dropped my time by 6 seconds I guess my 42 year old eyes need the FO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan N Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 AFTER I had installed another FO rod. I only had 1 miss on the plate rack and dropped my time by 6 seconds I bet this this had more to do with your eyes being used to looking for and seeing the FO. However, stated in several previous posts, what works for one may not work for others. I am one of the guys that had used FO for several years. This year, I bought a 1911 and began shooting CDP with it using iron sights. Now I plan on going irons on all my pistols. I'm 39 with uncorrected 20/20 vision. However, I am almost to the point of needing reading glasses up close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xander Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I just installed a Warren Sevigny fiber optic front on my Glock G17 to try, I've been accustomed to the all black sights on my HK Tactical and Expert. I also had one of the all black Warren's on my G34. BE is right on though, my double taps is tighter with the fiber optic front. It's much more easier to track the front sight. But I'm having a hard time on taking farther targets, the red dot seems to bother me. I think I'm gonna go all black iron sights. Btw, is there any way for me to make the fiber optic front to all black again, I'm thinking Sharpies? TIA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justaute Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 (edited) Just use an automotive paint pen (the brush end) to either black-out top of the fiber or front-bulb of the fiber. Or, do both. It stays on well. And, when you are feeling up to it, you can just rub-off the paint and the FO is available again. btw... you can even "adjust" the intensity of the FO by blacking out parts/portions of the FO. I just installed a Warren Sevigny fiber optic front on my Glock G17 to try, I've been accustomed to the all black sights on my HK Tactical and Expert. I also had one of the all black Warren's on my G34. BE is right on though, my double taps is tighter with the fiber optic front. It's much more easier to track the front sight. But I'm having a hard time on taking farther targets, the red dot seems to bother me. I think I'm gonna go all black iron sights. Btw, is there any way for me to make the fiber optic front to all black again, I'm thinking Sharpies? TIA Edited August 8, 2011 by justaute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okie-Glocker Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 great thread... I'm gonna try the broom bristle trick on my DP FO front sight when i get back... I'm intrigued by the possibility of becoming a better shooter with a plain jane front sight... Have had FO from the beginning of USPSA competition involvement... didn't know any better and thought all along FO was the only way to go. We shall see! Good news is if I like it, a new plain black DP front sight is only $25. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwain C. Baer Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 (edited) I switched to a fiber optic front sight on my Glock 21, but I'm still not comfortable. My other Glock pistols have Hienie fixed sights, and are much better for pin-point shot placement. Maybe someday I'll be comfortable with the fiber optic...with a lot more reps. Edited September 9, 2011 by Dwain C. Baer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leftridge Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Update: I used the black bristle but I switched back to the FO. I have used the FO enough to cheat it on close targets and ignore it on tight shots. I shot only one match with the black, in the rain, overcast. Most stages were steel, had a stage with 13 paper, under and backed by black plastic. I could not see my sight at all (only negative during match). One thing I did notice, When, and I mean when, I saw my sights I could see every serration, it was awesome. However I did not Finish as high as I normally do, and because it was only three weeks before a level III match I switched back to FO. I will revisit this, probably on my Single Stack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwain C. Baer Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 It can take awhile to sort-out these types of issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephensOutdoors Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Last fall I switched out my FO & went to a black serrated sight (Dawson) basically because I felt it was detrimental to my shooting. I kept cheating myself with sight picture & was getting sloppy. The black sight helped me refocus & relearn front sight picture, management, & follow through. Kind of like a back to basics step. I just started using an FO sight again a few weeks ago on one of my rigs & I have mixed feelings. I really like the FO for point shooting & short, fast, & close range stuff. But I really like the black sight for longer distances & shots that require more accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwain C. Baer Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Last fall I switched out my FO & went to a black serrated sight (Dawson) basically because I felt it was detrimental to my shooting. I kept cheating myself with sight picture & was getting sloppy. The black sight helped me refocus & relearn front sight picture, management, & follow through. Kind of like a back to basics step. I just started using an FO sight again a few weeks ago on one of my rigs & I have mixed feelings. I really like the FO for point shooting & short, fast, & close range stuff. But I really like the black sight for longer distances & shots that require more accuracy. Good points and well stated, I've gotten sloppy with fiber optics also! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feederic Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 I switched from adjustable fiber to all black sevigny sights. I shot 4 matches before I tore the black sevigny's off and put the adjustable fiber back on, I feel like I can track the sights MUCH quicker. Actually, I know I can with fiber...my splits show it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted September 20, 2011 Author Share Posted September 20, 2011 Push those targets out to 25 yards and see if you feel the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xander Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Push those targets out to 25 yards and see if you feel the same way. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkeeler Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Not only mess around with blacking out the fiber but also try different colors of fiber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feederic Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 (edited) I know for a fact I shoot much tighter at 25 yds with all black. I'm still weighing that, but it still seems easier and quicker all around with fiber at my club with my eyes. I will try blacking out the fiber again, and I also just switched from red to yellow (as an experiment). Edited September 21, 2011 by feederic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Posted September 21, 2011 Author Share Posted September 21, 2011 I'm sure it is quicker for just winging lead... until you retrain your eye to see what its supposed to. I won't even consider fiber now. Anytime I get the opportunity to shoot someone elses' rig, I'm shocked at how much information the fiber is robbing me of. Its wildly distracting and it LIES. Certainly your miles may vary, but this thread is better than 2 years old and I've never once thought I should go back. ` Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan N Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I'm sure it is quicker for just winging lead... until you retrain your eye to see what its supposed to. I won't even consider fiber now. Anytime I get the opportunity to shoot someone elses' rig, I'm shocked at how much information the fiber is robbing me of. Its wildly distracting and it LIES. Certainly your miles may vary, but this thread is better than 2 years old and I've never once thought I should go back. ` After shooting fiber optic sites for quite some time, I have switched to black and am very content with black sites. Something that I noticed is that the size of fiber makes a huge difference. I recently shot a friends G17 with a Hi-Viz front sight. I was blinded by the fiber optic on that sight. A much smaller fiber like on the Dawson is desireable. But I still prefer black sights(for now). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbpt1911 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 Interesting read so far! I shot a match this past Sunday. I had a fiber optic front sight on my Taurus 1911 with the factory Heinie rear sight. Yes, the fiber optic is fast to acquire, and accurate enough on paper targets. But I had accuracy issues on some small steel targets(Texas Stars). it seems I am not aligning the top of the sights like I'm supposed to, instead I'm just place the fiber optic dot in the rear notch. Being as the fiber optic dot is larger I am raising the front sight so I can see the entire dot in the rear sight notch - causing me to shoot high. Well, I switched the front sight back to the factory sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbpt1911 Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 Oh yeah, the fiber optic front sight I've been using is the Hi-Viz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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