Making the long shots

[FillYerHands]

I have looked at match performance in the past year, and I can see that one area I need to improve on is long shots - say, 20 yards and out. Not only are Mikes abundant, I find that I cannot call the shots, whereas I can on 10 to 15 yard shots.

Any advice on how to improve here?

[JThompson]

I have looked at match performance in the past year, and I can see that one area I need to improve on is long shots - say, 20 yards and out. Not only are Mikes abundant, I find that I cannot call the shots, whereas I can on 10 to 15 yard shots.

Any advice on how to improve here?

Shoot more long shots. It sounds simple, but spend some time doing just that. It's all about trigger control and wobble zone. Shoot some PPC if you have it there. Shoot from a bench rest. Find out what it takes to keep those sights aligned on the target until that bullet leaves the barrel.

[Bigpops]

Not to sound like a smart a$$...but practice.

I have a 10 inch gong that I will shoot from 50-70 yards almost every practice session. I shoot a minimum of 15 rounds one after another. If it takes me 20 minutes to do so then that is what it takes. I simply draw, aim (front sight) and think trigger control. I go as fast or slow as I need to make good hits. I expect to hit the gong EVERY time.

Anytime my accuracy starts heading south, I slow down and perform the above. It has helped me a great deal.

My other mind set is "center is center". meaning I don't care how close or far a target is....I am burning a hole in the center of where I want to hit.

BP

[Graham Smith]

I don't know if this will help or not but print out some of the 1/3 sized targets and stick them up in the basement and dryfire practice with them. Same thing at the range.

You can also practice the mantra "Slow is smooth and smooth is fast". It hasn't really helped me overcome my tendency to shoot too fast, but sometimes it sinks in long enough to get me though a stage without a bunch of mikes.

[pjb45]

I use the hanging steel at 50-70 yards. I paint them. My eyes are so bad that I need binoculars to see where the hits are being made. That has improved my long distance shot performance.

Additionally, practicing with head shots only, really brings the sight picture and trigger control to the forefront.

[benos]

From another thread.

[Spray_N_Prey]

haha thanks Brian, I went clicking through there to check it out and realized it was my own post.

[Boats]

Have the same problem,

I have been shooting a few NRA slow fire 25 yard pistol targets. 10 shots freestyle grip and trying to clean the target with all 10's Slow and deliberate pace. Most sessions only shoot two targets. So far best is 98. It really lets you see whats going on, how the pistol recoils and sights rise on ignition. Spot each hole with a scope after firing the shot, It does not take long to predict exactly were the hole will be according to how you gripped the gun and broke the shot.

When I can shoot 100 =10 10's am going to put the string on the clock look for some speed while maintaining precison. The 10 ring is 3 inches 12 moa. It's working for me.

Boats

[Jaxshooter]

I have been starting my practice sessions shooting from 25 yards. I usually shoot 30 rounds. I have noticed a big improvement in group size in the last month.

[FillYerHands]

Thanks all. I guess I was hoping for something other than "practice."

But that's what got me where I am with short range, so it makes sense.

[uscbigdawg]

Bill Drills at 25 & 50 yards is how I fixed it. Max taught me that one. After doing these enough, everything else is easy.

Rich

[JeffWard]

How accurate is your gun/load? Have you ever bench-rested your gun out at 25-40 yards?

If the gun/load is not capable of holding a 4-6" group at 30+ yards, then YOU may be shooting perfectly!!!!

Get confidence in what you gun can do, and it will build confidence in what YOU can do... Then.... PRACTICE long shots.

I also use 1/3 size targets for dry-fire at home.

JeffWard

USPSA_Target_Bottom.ppt

USPSA_Target_Top.ppt

Edited July 20, 2009 by JeffWard

[XD Niner]

Making sure I have adequately prepped the trigger makes a world of difference for me in longer shots. Manny Bragg taught me that.

Edited July 20, 2009 by XD Niner

[SA Friday]

Classifiers 99-09 and 99-63 are pretty good to practice to improve in this area.

[bkeeler]

I have looked at match performance in the past year, and I can see that one area I need to improve on is long shots - say, 20 yards and out. Not only are Mikes abundant, I find that I cannot call the shots, whereas I can on 10 to 15 yard shots.

Any advice on how to improve here?

I would be looking at this. Why can you call your shots at 10 to 15yds and you can't call them at 20yds and out?

Are you certain that you are calling your shots at closer ranges?

Calling the shot doesn't change with how far the target is from you the acceptability of sight alignment may change but knowing how to call your shots doesn't change with distance.

BK

[Duane Thomas]

Take up the slack in the trigger until you feel it hit resistance. I've heard this point called "the link." Watch your sights, make sure they're aligned perfectly. Accept your wobble zone, i.e. that the sights are going to be moving around slightly. There's no way you can stop that from happening, so you might as well accept it. During his Matt Burkett inverview, Brian says something to the effect of, "Imagine your mishevious buddy is standing down at the end of the range moving your target around. At that point what can you do about it? Nothing. So just shoot." At this point there are two classic "school answers" on how to complete the trigger pull:

(1) Just incrementally, continuously, and at the same rate, apply increasing pressure on the trigger until the gun fires. I find this method very slow, and also it gives me all the time in the world to anticipate the shot and pull the gun downward.

(2) Once you've hit the link, apply almost as much pressure as necessary to fire the shot, but not quite, then apply that last little bit of pressure, like the last half pound, to drop the hammer. Therefore you have, basically, turned your gun into a super-target-pistol with a half pound trigger pull. I've shot that way myself for years, and even given that advice on these very forums. However I recently realized that, for me anyway, that approach doesn't work very well. This likewise gives me too much time to anticipate the shot. Also I tend to apply so much pressure during that "last little bit" of trigger pull that I move the gun around. After trying it that way for years I realized I needed to come up with Something Else.

What I came up with is to take up the slack until I hit the link, then just smoothly pull the trigger all the way through. One smooth application of pressure. Like I'm firing a revolver, but with a Glock or 1911 it's just a revolver with a really, REALLY short, light trigger pull. For me, that mindset, "I'm firing a revolver, just one smooth, continuous trigger pull," seems to work really well. Frankly, it works really well for achieving a combination of speed and accuracy in-close, as well.

Raise your head enough that you can see the front sight flip and come back down through its entire arc of recoil, instead of having your head down so the front sight flips up out of your vision with every shot. Not only does keeping the head up, so that you bring the sights up to your eyes instead of your eyes down to the sights, work well for being able to track the front sight in recoil, in my experience having the face back a bit further from the gun seems to make the whole process of having the gun move in your hands and come back slightly toward your face in recoil less intimidating, less frightening, and greatly reduces or eliminates the tendency to flinch.

Watch how Travis Tomasie holds his head while shooting. He's almost tilting his head backward; he looks almost like an old man peering through the bottom half of bifocials. But I'll tell ya what: this is a guy who can see his front sight through its entire arc of motion and call his shots. Guaranteed.

[G-ManBart]

What I came up with is to take up the slack until I hit the link, then just smoothly pull the trigger all the way through. One smooth application of pressure. Like I'm firing a revolver, but with a Glock or 1911 it's just a revolver with a really, REALLY short, light trigger pull. For me, that mindset, "I'm firing a revolver, just one smooth, continuous trigger pull," seems to work really well. Frankly, it works really well for achieving a combination of speed and accuracy in-close, as well.

Duane,

If I ever get a job at Quantico you'll have to come visit some time. I would be able to show you, both in graph and video form, that what you're describing here is absolutely, positively, the best way to go....not that you need more proof

They've got a cool setup that puts a pressure sensor on the trigger and graphs it on a computer screen next to you. Then they have a set of glasses with cameras built into them as well as cameras they can set up from the side so you can compare all the views and see exactly what's happening when someone is shooting. It's pretty cool to play it back and compare the sight picture to the trigger press graph and then look at the hits on target. I learned more about trigger press in 3hr of playing around with that setup than I ever thought possible. The guy that came up with the whole system is a former national PPC champion so he knows what he's talking about when it comes to accuracy.

I describe it as just rolling through the trigger press like it's a revolver....pretty much the way you do As people get better than can do it faster and maintain their accuracy, but it surprises the heck out of them in the beginning! R,

Edited July 21, 2009 by G-ManBart

[G-ManBart]

I have looked at match performance in the past year, and I can see that one area I need to improve on is long shots - say, 20 yards and out. Not only are Mikes abundant, I find that I cannot call the shots, whereas I can on 10 to 15 yard shots.

Any advice on how to improve here?

I'd be concerned about the shot-calling aspect as well. For fun, I'd try shooting some clay birds off the backstop at 20yds or so. You'll want to see them break so you'll have an incentive to follow through on the shot which should help you make sure you're calling them properly.

[Duane Thomas]

Bart,

Thanks for the info. I've heard about that system before, but never, sadly, experienced it firsthand. POOOOOORRRRR Duane....

[BSeevers]

Thanks all. I guess I was hoping for something other than "practice."

I like the honesty

Many have said it but you might look at your shot calling

[Silver_Surfer]

I shoot it like I pratice it. If I pratice standing freestyle I shoot it standing freestyle. What I'm tring to get at is just because the target may be at 50yds. I will still shoot it standing freestyle and will not go prone unless I pratice that way. I made that mistake ONCE!

[bigstick0000]

The first thing I did was make sure my gun was accurate and it was dead on. I began shooting at 15 yards out over a period of three weeks worked out to 65 yards with my handgun. I can't see where I'm hitting until I get up to it but the hits are always there. But- I am also shooting the max load at that range and the holes are where I put them.

[38supPat]

Thanks all. I guess I was hoping for something other than "practice."

But that's what got me where I am with short range, so it makes sense.

This is fairly telling about the way we tend to practice, and what happens in matches. This doesn't just happen with long shots for a lot of people and it's because we don't practice what we don't like, or isn't fun.

It becomes a doomed cycle unless we break it. A shooter doesn't like long shot, or feels they are not good at them, so they don't practice hard shots. Of course hard shots come up at matches and when we suck at them it just reinforces our dislike for them.

Keep track of what you have problems with at matches, and put those at the top of the agenda when you go to practice next, it's the only way to get better.

Further, remember you are there to train. Lots of folks go to the range set up a target and blast a box of ammo at it and say they "practiced"

If you want to improve you have to find out what you are doing wrong, or right. I went through this this year too (theres a couple of threads on it) and what a lot of it boiled down to was, to a small part, a poor grip when drawing, and to a larger part, what I was seeing or what I was looking at. Sometimes it can be as simple as you are looking at the whole target not the precise point you want the bullet to land in the A zone. Or how you are seeing the sights is not what you need to see for that distance/type of sight.

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=89870

[Mistral404]

I really liked this thread. I am working on a new gun-new division. I am still in the early stages. I almost have the sights dialed into where I need them. My draws are sort of strange. Facing up range, turn and draw is now running into the 1.40-1.52 range.

But over the next couple of days, I need to be shooting longer distances. This will help greatly.

[racerba]

Thanks all. I guess I was hoping for something other than "practice."

You don't need practice. Practice is over-rated. All you need is a tail feather from a bald eagle that you caught by hand. A tooth from a bengal tiger that you caught by hand and extracted the tooth while keeping it alive. A claw from a polar bear (same criteria as the tiger). You mix the three items in a wooden bowl with 3 drops of your own blood (if you have any left from retrieving the last to items). Doing this will make you shoot perfect at distances beyond 25 yds.