20 Series Classifiers?

[nasty618]

At least a few of stages at the 2020 Nationals look like potential new classifiers...

 

Some of the ones i am thinking of are 5, 10, 13, maybe 12? They are more along the lines of the 19 series, which everyone i know liked - freestyle, movement, comstock, etc - in other words more representative of actual USPSA stages.

 

Others, like 4, 6, 11,  were back to the old "stand and shoot from a box" ...    I asked one of the ROs at Stage 11 if this might be a new classifier - he said yes, but they might change them.  Not sure what that means... 

 

Wondering if anyone has any real info of what these represent and if we're going to have a new set of classifiers next year.

 

[B_RAD]

There will be a few new ones. I actually liked them all. 

 

Two will be identical walls/borders with changes to the targets in the middle. Kinda neat idea. 

 

I liked the fixed time one. (I won that one. Or tied for the win) 

 

 

[rowdyb]

The only thing I've noticed with the newer ones with the walls is that walls aren't standardized and I've shot the "same" classifier at different clubs and had it look so different than they did at nationals as to change how it must be shot.

 

Things should be done in such a way so that someone can build it, who never saw it originally, and have them be the same.

Edited October 23, 2020 by rowdyb

[nasty618]

After looking at a couple of Race Gun videos, looks like some of them have been changed (either start position or type of targets), maybe ruling out the possibility of these stages being potential classifiers: 6, 11, 12?

 

These ones appear to still be the same across two Nationals: 4, 5, 10, 13. 

 

Also looked at the SS Nationals, looks like their stage 10 was the same as stage 5.  

Edited October 27, 2020 by nasty618

[shred]

No particular reason USPSA can't make any stage a classifier, regardless of who shot it with what, but it makes setting the HHF easier if they do, which seems to be the current practice.

 

The 'dogleg walls' stages seem like likely candidates although Rowdy's right about the setups.  The fixed-time maybe too, but unlikely to be run much if so.  

[B_RAD]

2 hours ago, shred said:

No particular reason USPSA can't make any stage a classifier, regardless of who shot it with what, but it makes setting the HHF easier if they do, which seems to be the current practice.

 

The 'dogleg walls' stages seem like likely candidates although Rowdy's right about the setups.  The fixed-time maybe too, but unlikely to be run much if so.  

Fixed time will not be one. They've already said it won't.  

[nasty618]

1 hour ago, B_RAD said:

Fixed time will not be one. They've already said it won't

 

Dang... that's too bad. That one or stage 11 (three targets close, 4 on each with a reload) would have helped me get the G.  Oh well, I guess it's back to earning it through regular local match classifiers

 

Just curious, where did they (USPSA?) say it - on FB? 

 

 

[B_RAD]

42 minutes ago, nasty618 said:

 

Dang... that's too bad. That one or stage 11 (three targets close, 4 on each with a reload) would have helped me get the G.  Oh well, I guess it's back to earning it through regular local match classifiers

 

Just curious, where did they (USPSA?) say it - on FB? 

 

 

That stinks man. I liked those. 

 

Yes. Henning Walgren posted and said he liked the new classifiers. Jake commented that it won't be one. 

Edited October 27, 2020 by B_RAD

[regor]

Anyone have video of the stages in questions for those of us who did not attend nationals? 

[nasty618]

There's a couple of full match vids with stage numbers on YouTube... Here's one: 

 

 

Here are stage 11 and stage 4

 

 

Edited October 27, 2020 by nasty618

[ampleworks]

On 10/23/2020 at 6:03 AM, rowdyb said:

The only thing I've noticed with the newer ones with the walls is that walls aren't standardized and I've shot the "same" classifier at different clubs and had it look so different than they did at nationals as to change how it must be shot.

 

Things should be done in such a way so that someone can build it, who never saw it originally, and have them be the same.

 

The new stage setup diagrams on the 19 series classifiers are absolutely horrible. It wouldn't surprise me that half the clubs out there have an issue with the setup. We went from very concise diagrams in the 99 and 06 classifiers with a nice page layout to the 19 ones that look like they were thrown together in MS Word on a Friday night before a match.

[shred]

23 hours ago, nasty618 said:

 

Dang... that's too bad. That one or stage 11 (three targets close, 4 on each with a reload) would have helped me get the G.  Oh well, I guess it's back to earning it through regular local match classifiers

 

Just curious, where did they (USPSA?) say it - on FB? 

 

 

As part of the multi-way tie for 2nd on the fixed-time stage, I liked it, but there's a reasonably high luck factor involved that IMO makes it not so useful as a classifier.

 

 

[Barcode1337]

20 hours ago, ampleworks said:

 

The new stage setup diagrams on the 19 series classifiers are absolutely horrible. It wouldn't surprise me that half the clubs out there have an issue with the setup. We went from very concise diagrams in the 99 and 06 classifiers with a nice page layout to the 19 ones that look like they were thrown together in MS Word on a Friday night before a match.

It really surprised me how low quality and messy the recent diagrams were. To me, as a former tech writer, consistency in format and presentation is crazy important. And as my club's MD, I would much prefer consistent, effectively diagrammed stage descriptions... especially since classifiers are supposed to be, y'know, relatively important.

[rowdyb]

diagrams are up, they are using 3 of them. all the very similar L wall shaped ones i predict will be build twenty different ways at locals.

 

your percents will show up tomorrow, though the hhf are already in the classifier calculator.

[nasty618]

I like them.  Didn't do too well on one and less than stellar on another, but picked up a 95+% score on the one I didn't even expect to become a classifier... 

 

Diagrams seem way better than the 19 series though, I think Jake has heard the feedback. 

 

 

[nasty618]

 

11A, 1C 8.39 sec, 6.91HF, 95.6%

[Brooke]

On 10/23/2020 at 9:03 AM, rowdyb said:

The only thing I've noticed with the newer ones with the walls is that walls aren't standardized and I've shot the "same" classifier at different clubs and had it look so different than they did at nationals as to change how it must be shot.

 

Things should be done in such a way so that someone can build it, who never saw it originally, and have them be the same.

Rowdy the walls seem to be specified as 8 ft on the diagrams.There is a dimension on 20-03 that I don't completely understand. That's the "2 ft off wall" dimension relating to the poppers. Not sure what that dimension relates to since there are no end lines on it just an arrow.

 

I like my stage tinker toy set and I like the way they are using them in these diagrams. There is a problem with the "toys" because they are not scaled to each other. The intention of the designers is pretty clear though. As to clubs setting them up differently that is a problem at some clubs who seem not to be able to read or not care or both. As they say there is no cure for stupid and I'll add "uncaring" to that. However most clubs I shoot at do a pretty good job. 

[rowdyb]

I liked shooting them at Nats just fine.

[mchapman]

8 hours ago, Brooke said:

Rowdy the walls seem to be specified as 8 ft on the diagrams.There is a dimension on 20-03 that I don't completely understand. That's the "2 ft off wall" dimension relating to the poppers. Not sure what that dimension relates to since there are no end lines on it just an arrow.

The best guess that I can come up with is that the grid must be to scale, that each square is 2ft. x 2ft. So the complete square on the left side of the poppers would be 2ft in from the line that you project straight back from the far left wall.

[MikeBurgess]

would dimensioning everything from a center line and base line be that hard? i hate laying out targets when I have to set one then measure then set another then measure, just layout from 2 axis and I can mark it all out in a minute and set everything and have it correct in no time. 

 

like on the new ones are the poppers 2 ft apart on center or between calibration zones? 

 

 

[regor]

Looks like 20-01

21 hours ago, nasty618 said:

 

11A, 1C 8.39 sec, 6.91HF, 95.6%

 

Looks like this was not shot at Open/Lim nationals. Wonder how they came up with the HHFs for those. Is consensus that shooting the center three off the draw is optimal or did anyone shoot it fast going to one side first? 

[shred]

We shot it in Open/Lim.  Most people drew to one side and shot the middle on the move on the way to the other end.

 

[rowdyb]

6 minutes ago, shred said:

We shot it in Open/Lim.  Most people drew to one side and shot the middle on the move on the way to the other end.

 

So which one are we shooting on Saturday?

[shred]

1 hour ago, rowdyb said:

So which one are we shooting on Saturday?

You'll have to ask the MD I'm just a stage goon.

 

[w_thomas21]

How do you use the 20 series classifiers in practicscore?

Wes Thomas