Dillon Xl650 Vs. Super 1050

[norbs007]

This question might have been asked a million times, but here it goes anyway. I will be handing down my 550 to my brother-in-law and will be in the market for new equipment. Comparing the facts & figures in Blue Press for both machines there's not much difference between the two but the hefty price tag. When I called Dillon and inquired about the payment plan for the 1050 (and without asking anything else) the rep told me that depending on what I need it for, the 1050 is longer to change calibers and much more expensive than the 650 (did not mention I was comparing), which does not have a payment plan; and that the 1050 is not really for everybody. I said thank you and that was the end of the phone call. Not too informative I should say, so here I am asking in the forum. Just need to know the key advantages of the 1050 (trying to justify for it). Thank you.

[dirtypool40]

By comparing raw output and cost outlay numbers it is tough to justify the 1050.

My first reloading press was a 650 with four different complete tool heads and quick change conversions. I could go from 9mm to .40 in less than five minutes. 9mm to .45 took about half an hour. It served me well for about three years. It's a good solid machine.

All that being said I went from a 650 to a 1050 about two years ago and would not want to go back if I could avoid it.

If I am serious about a caliber and have the $$$ I would buy the 1050. Hell, before I changed jobs and moved I had one in .40 and one in 9mm HE.

I bought one in .40, put the sexy dies in it and could crank 12-1400 rounds of match grade ammo out an hour. I loaded about 40k on mine last year and was really impressed with how everything is adjustable (including primer depth) and how solid a machine it is. I did have some primer feed issues, but a cleaning and replacing a really old spring fixed this right up.

I didn't think there was much of a difference until I recently went to help a buddy set up his new 650. The stroke is longer and more difficult, and of course you prime on the forward stroke.

There are plenty of folks who love the 650, and I am one. The 1050 is just bigger, smoother, heavier and better...if you are serious, have the cash and are not going to change calibers every few days.

Confused yet? Relax, it's much worse than that.

[Loves2Shoot]

No priming on the upstroke.

[DougCarden]

The primer crimp swager....I got a deal on 30K of Crimped 9x19 brass....Makes life so simple

[shred]

I've got both and tried to write up something about one vs the other, downstroke priming, roller bearings and linkages, but never got anything I was happy with.

The bottom line is for mass quantities of one caliber, the 1050 rules, while for more-than-once-every-5K rounds- caliber changes the 650 is the way to go. Most people I know that load multiple calibers on a 1050 end up buying multiple 1050s so as to leave them set up.

[D.Hayden]

Norbert... I went through this last year too.

I figured, the 1050 is better made, all metal - that was just about enough. I bought it just to do 40s. I've never bought a top quality tool, that I later wished I had gone cheaper.

I really like all steps on the down stroke, and adjusting the primer seat, and not having to worry about it, has given me 99.99% running rounds, which I still gauge, but not sure why (I'll have 1 in 1,000 - 1,500 not gauge).

Shooting 3 Gun, I was buying Scharch processed brass .(http://www.scharch.com/), which was fine, and then I started picking up gallons of .223 brass from the LEO that use our ranges, and so I bought a toolhead for te .223. Still haven't done alot, but did make about 7,000 ready to go rounds on it.. free brass, just for some elbow grease. You need a power trimmer, but if you shoot a lot of .223, no need to worry about the military primer crimps.

If you can, try them both in action, there's enough people at Richmond that have one or the other.

[Merlin Orr]

Buy the 1050 - then no one can say..."mines bigger."

I use

One for .40

One for 38SC

550Bs and SDBs for the rest of my reloading needs.

1050s are just pure Sex!

[Caspian_45]

I have both. Both of them are old machines. One of the first run of 650's and the 1050 was made in the 80's (or so I was told by the original owner).

The 650 is great. Easy change over. VERY fast. An easy 100k and only 2 broken E clips (no biggie).

I just got the 1050. The primin' system sucks. Design flaw I guess. Put a 650 primer system on it and it would ROCK. VERY VERY fast. Crimp remover is great for mil brass. Dependin' on caliber the change over will vary. 9mm, 38 super, and 40 look to be only the swap of the tool head (correct me if I'm wrong). I only have it set up in 9, but it was in super when I got it and all I did was change the dies.

IMO for the money you can buy two (2) 650XL's for the same money, pretty much anyway. I like my 650 better and would get another if I needed a new press. But I ain't getin' rid of the 1050 either.

Like the guy at Dillon said. " A 1050 ain't for everyone".

Hope this helps.

[oddjob]

I know my answer WON'T help, but one shooter got a 650, then a 1050 (older one), got rid of the 1050 and got another 650. He just didn't like the 1050.

Another I know has a 650 & 1050 and loves the 1050 and likes the 650.

I have two 1050's and a 550 and will probably get another 550. My 1050's run very smooth and I would probably go with a 1050 if I were in your shoes. One of the major reasons I got a 1050 was at the time I had small kids and time was very valuble to me. Now that they are teenagers I could probably go to a single stage press!!!!!!

[al503]

I agree with Merlin. I love my 1050 because it is so much easier to crank out some serious ammo. On average, I could only produce about 5-600 rounds/hour on the 650. Last Friday, I pumped out about 3K rounds in about 3 hours on the 1050 and I was still fresh enough to go out and practice (which is what I would have done if I didn't have a g/f.) If I would have been reloading for 3 hours on the 650, I would have been much more tired and I'd only have about half the ammo.

In the end, I figure that the less time I spend reloading, the more time I have to practice and improve.

The only reason I could think of not to get a 1050 is if you don't shoot a lot and you don't need the capacity. Heck, even if I shot less than 1K rounds a month, I'd get the 1050, spend one wet/cold weekend and make enough ammo for the year.

[norbs007]

You guys are awesome, made life so much easier. I figured that there's got to be a reason for the big $$$ price tag. I am very passionate about our sport (just wish I can shoot better ) which is why I prefer to get best quality equipment that will outlast me. Thanks again!

[Thomas Moore]

just remember the 650 has a lifetime guaranty, the 1050 does not. caliber change takes longer and is way more expensive.

[Merlin Orr]

just remember the 650 has a lifetime guaranty, the 1050 does not. caliber change takes longer and is way more expensive.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

An anvil does not have a warranty.......BUT, bet you never need one (guaranty) either.

[ima45dv8]

Speed difference between the 650 and the 1050? I've seen some talented folks who can almost match the 1050 with their 650s, so not a big issue to me.

IMO, the single biggest selling point of the 1050 is the priming system. I know some folks have posted about problems they or their friends have had, but mine have been excellent.

What I didn't like about my SDB and the other Dillon models was having to change to a "push" stroke to seat the primer, and the fact it is done by feel. With most of the work done on the long down stroke, which kinds pulls you in toward the machine, you have to reverse the action and press the handle up and away from you. This had the effect pushing me back away from the machine when seating the primer.

Get a piece of brass with a tight or crimped primer pocket (military, S&B, the much-dreded AMERC brass, etc.) and you can find yourself exerting so much force that it's scary. And even then you aren't certain of whether it's seated properly until you gauge the ammo later. That's just way too many variables for me, now that I know the solution - the 1050.

A slug goes down inside the case at station 2 to support the backside of the primer pocket while a swage removes any crimp and uniforms the pocket. Station 3 seats the primer to a mechanically consistent depth, on the downstroke of the handle. No more pushing on the handle; no more guess work about seating depth. THAT is the real beauty of a 1050.

If you buy an older unit check with Dillon to see if it has been refitted with the revised index pawl. The newer version starts the shellplate moving a little sooner and has less of a tendency to spill powder by spreading the movement out over a longer time interval.

Caliber conversions? My ideal caliber conversion is walking 2 steps to the left or right and pulling the other handle, so I have one set up for .40 and one for .45.

[Thomas Moore]

if money is no object than by all means buy two or three 1050's but when you're reloading 5 different rounds the 650 is the way to go.

btw, you will break parts on the 1050. i had one....for 3 months....

[Sc0]

A 650 with 5 caliber conversions, seperate deswaging tool, a bunch of primer tubes, casefeeder, Big Dillon tumbler, and a couple of other things can equal the price of a 1050 setup for one caliber... If you have the money the 1050 can be nice, it just didn't fit in my budget or plans especially for multiple calibers.

Disadvantage of the 650, small working space for large fingers to correct things before the ram is allowed to return.

[benos]

By comparing raw output and cost outlay numbers it is tough to justify the 1050. 

My first reloading press was a 650 with four different complete tool heads and quick change conversions. I could go from 9mm to .40 in less than five minutes.  9mm to .45 took about half an hour.  It served me well for about three years.  It's a good solid machine.

All that being said I went from a 650 to a 1050 about two years ago and would not want to go back if I could avoid it.

If I am serious about a caliber and have the $$$ I would buy the 1050.  Hell, before I changed jobs and moved I had one in .40 and one in 9mm HE.

I bought one in .40, put the sexy dies in it and could crank 12-1400 rounds of match grade ammo out an hour.  I loaded about 40k on mine last year and was really impressed with how everything is adjustable (including primer depth) and how solid a machine it is.  I did have some primer feed issues, but a cleaning and replacing a really old spring fixed this right up. 

I didn't think there was much of a difference until I recently went to help a buddy set up his new 650.  The stroke is longer and more difficult, and of course you prime on the forward stroke.

There are plenty of folks who love the 650, and I am one.  The 1050 is just bigger, smoother, heavier and better...if you are serious, have the cash and are not going to change calibers every few days.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

+ 1 to that.

be

[Loves2Shoot]

Ps. It only takes a few minuted for a caliber change (I have 4 toolheads) once you've done it a time or two.

Over the years the cost has been well worth it, but then again I've kept my eyes open and the last 1050 I got for $750 with 4 calibers and 4 toolheads, hardly used at all.

It just takes a lot less effort to reload on the 1050, and the downstoke only is a lot easier on the elbows.

[John Dunn]

btw, you will break parts on the 1050. i had one....for 3 months....

I've had mine 3+ years, have yet to replace a part. In fact, it came with a few parts it doesn't need, and I took those off!

P.S. Never remove the anti-reverse ratchet thingy like I did, it will make reloading smoother, but death is almost certain. You have been warned!

[benos]

btw, you will break parts on the 1050. i had one....for 3 months....

Never broke parts on mine either. I remember replacing a spring, but that's about it.

P.S.  Never remove the anti-reverse ratchet thingy like I did, it will make reloading smoother, but death is almost certain.  You have been warned!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's the first thing I took off when I replaced my old 1000 with a 1050. (Please don't ask me why I replaced the 1000.)

[wide45]

btw, you will break parts on the 1050. i had one....for 3 months....

I've had mine about 5 years. Dillon stopped sending me catalogs because I never called them.

What parts am I supposed to break? I need to get back on the mailing list.

[Bill Nesbitt]

I bought my 1050 when they were $895 I think. I can't remember ever breaking anything. Get extra toolheads with a powder measure for each caliber. I can change calibers with the same primer size in 10 minutes. Remove 2 clips, one pin, 1 stud and the big bolt in the middle of the toolhead. Changing primers takes an extra 10 minutes.

Seating the primers on the downstroke is excellent.

I also have a 550 and I get tired faster when seating primers on the 550. I only use it now for small jobs.

[John Dunn]

(Please don't ask me why I replaced the 1000.)

[Forum Dick Mode On]

Why'd you replace the 1000?

[Mode Default: On]

[Nik Habicht]

The bottom line is for mass quantities of one caliber, the 1050 rules, while for more-than-once-every-5K rounds- caliber changes the 650 is the way to go.  Most people I know that load multiple calibers on a 1050 end up buying multiple 1050s so as to leave them set up.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I shoot more 9mm Production than anything else --- both my 1050 and 650 are set to produce it right now. I load on the 1050 almost exclusively. The 650 is set as a backup, since I often load on match mornings. When I need anything else --- 9mm open, .45ACP, or .38SPL, I convert the 650.....

[norbs007]

Thank you guys for all your response, showed the wifey this thread and was able to get her to help me out with the cost. The only thing is I have to wait 'till Christmas. I'm sure the 650 will more than serve my purpose, but I really don't mind the longer caliber change. I like working on this kinda things, it relaxes me. Super 1050 it is!