gng4life Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 (edited) There's a bunch of CORE's on the approved gun list, not sure which model is pictured above.That is a PC version of the CORE.PC version? Ported and compensated? Is it approved with the non ported barrel? I'm not sureSent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Performance CenterSee#173 Edited August 1, 2015 by gng4life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southpaw Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 So as the rules are now, this is pretty much just Production with a slide mounted optic and 35oz. weight limit. If the 35oz. weight limit somehow makes sense for this division then shouldn't they also apply it to Production? Or, if as the name "Carry Optics" denotes, the weight limit rationale is that this division is meant for CCW guns then shouldn't there be more strict rules on the gun size as not many people CCW a Glock 34 or M&P CORE. And even fewer people have 140mm mags in their CCWs loaded to only 10 rounds. (Just playing devil's advocate here. And I don't see the need for a weight limit and I'd be shooting a Glock in CO). So they got rid of the +2oz. weight restriction and just have a max of 35oz, right? So does that mean we can weigh polymer guns down to bring them up to 35oz? Frame weights aren't specifically mentioned, but I'm guessing they'd say that falls under the "unless a mod if specifically authorized it's prohibited" part. But I could glue say an ~8oz. piece of lead to the bottom of my mags since aftermarket basepads are allowed, right? If they insist on keeping the weight restriction, maybe instead of banning those guns outright, say they're limited to 8 rounds instead of 10 (still everything scored minor). You could even open it up to guns not on the approved list and SA guns and say those can also be used but loaded to 8. The sub 35oz. guns would still rule the division with the 10 round limit, but at least then other guns can play rather than being completely banned. So if you've got a 1911 with a dot you now have a place to shoot it if you don't care about the lower capacity and just want to have fun with it. I don't know how great an idea this really is, haven't put much thought into it, but it could be a way to increase participation in the division since more guns would be allowed, albeit at a disadvantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 If you just want to have fun you could shoot any gun you wanted with any mods you wanted in "open" division. Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Stevens Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 There's a bunch of CORE's on the approved gun list, not sure which model is pictured above.That is a PC version of the CORE.Ok, just saw they all have ported barrels. Thanks. They would not be eligible. I don't believe you can just change the barrel to make it legal either. I seem to remember something regarding the ported Glock pistols that said they were legal with a non ported barrel. I could be wrong though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 In Production as long as it's on the list you can drop in a non ported barrel and be legal so the same should stand here. Regarding the weight you should h the able to add weight to your polymer CO gun of choice to get it up to 35. Weighted basepads are easy but I think the slight movement of the magazine in recoil make that a less optimum area. Tungsten guide rods are an easy option. I have also done some with epoxy in led into place inside the back strap channel. Might as well run those extended +0s and Springer Precision even has an option for more weight onside the magaziner. You would not be able to add weight external or on the rail or anything but I am sure people will come up with all sorts of creative things to do internal to gain a few ounces. I think the fact that the max weight is 35 versus 33 is interesting and changes things quite a bit. 35 Oz seems like middle ground between the heavy and polymer guns where you will see lightened CZ 75 style PO guns on one end and you will see polymer guns with added weight on the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 Frame modifications are not permitted, so the only way to REDUCE the weight of a Carry Optics gun would be to mill the slide and the only milling that is permitted is to mount the scope, so this will only have a small impact on the overall weight of the gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 Frame modifications are not permitted, so the only way to REDUCE the weight of a Carry Optics gun would be to mill the slide and the only milling that is permitted is to mount the scope, so this will only have a small impact on the overall weight of the gun. Remember that CZC has made well over 2k ACCU Shadows and now the long slide 75. At 500 guns required for a new submission to CO they will have those numbers in no time flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garmil Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 In Production as long as it's on the list you can drop in a non ported barrel and be legal so the same should stand here. Regarding the weight you should h the able to add weight to your polymer CO gun of choice to get it up to 35. Weighted basepads are easy but I think the slight movement of the magazine in recoil make that a less optimum area. Tungsten guide rods are an easy option. I have also done some with epoxy in led into place inside the back strap channel. Might as well run those extended +0s and Springer Precision even has an option for more weight onside the magaziner. You would not be able to add weight external or on the rail or anything but I am sure people will come up with all sorts of creative things to do internal to gain a few ounces. I think the fact that the max weight is 35 versus 33 is interesting and changes things quite a bit. 35 Oz seems like middle ground between the heavy and polymer guns where you will see lightened CZ 75 style PO guns on one end and you will see polymer guns with added weight on the other. S&W performance center 9 is the model and that's not on the list. Changing the barrel wont change that. At least that's how I interpret it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beastly Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 It's only a matter of time before you'll see a CZ SP01 Shadow under 33 ounces. Look at the P01's alloy frame. I am sure Angus has already sent a few emails to CZ to get them ready to send over the first batch of alloy framed SP01 Shadows. No more Welfare Optics... The new 32.7 ounce alloy framed custom AccuShadows are going to cost about US$2,000. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I guess I'll have to stop calling it Plastic Optics then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 (edited) ....... The new 32.7 ounce alloy framed custom AccuShadows are going to cost about US$2,000. . Jeez...... After milling it for an RMR and buying an rmr you're probably around $2700! You can buy an STi trubor with compensator and red dot for about the same price. Might as well hit open. Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Edited August 2, 2015 by 3djedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrydoc Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 (edited) It's only a matter of time before you'll see a CZ SP01 Shadow under 33 ounces. Look at the P01's alloy frame. I am sure Angus has already sent a few emails to CZ to get them ready to send over the first batch of alloy framed SP01 Shadows. No more Welfare Optics... The new 32.7 ounce alloy framed custom AccuShadows are going to cost about US$2,000. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I guess I'll have to stop calling it Plastic Optics then... I believe he has already milled some slides he posted pics on FB but I'm not sure which model. Edited August 2, 2015 by terrydoc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOF Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Shot a USPSA match today with a ported 9mm S&W CORE and a Jpoint 8 MOA sight. Shot Open/Minor. But, it was a total hoot! I'm old & slow but I ran 90% Alphas ... no Deltas, Mikes, Non-Shoots (and there were plenty of those up tight to shoot targets), etc. We had some COFs that gave you the option of shooting 25 yard targets from the start position... or running up to shoot them closer. The Jpoint let me shoot from there faster/more accurately than I could have run (I run slow... Super Senior) run up to them. No fear of a 25-30 yard target.... 90 % Alphas. This is the first USPSA match I have ever run with a dot sight. I haven't even got the gun/load tuned yet (it's on it's way to Dan Burwell). But, it won't be the last match I do with a dot. I can see Carry Optics becoming a very popular division. I'm only a C Class shooter in Limited (Minor) L10 (Major) and Revolver (6 shot Minor). But I think this old fart can have some fun in CO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suncoastarmory Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk That looks great! Did you do that yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk That looks great! Did you do that yourself?No no. It's from CZ Custom shop Facebook page. They're already working on carry optics!Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 The rules state that you can use an aftermarket slide provided it is the same length and contour as the original. What does that mean? It has to look exactly like the factory slide? Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishsticks Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 The rules state that you can use an aftermarket slide provided it is the same length and contour as the original. What does that mean? It has to look exactly like the factory slide? Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk Apparently that was the interpretation for production. There's a relatively recent thread on here somewhere (I'm on my phone or I'd try to link it) where someone had a NROI interpretation that said a lone wolf slide was no Bueno because of the forward serrations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 I tink the only way that a non-OFM slide would meet this criteria is if it were made under license from the manufacturer by a third-party Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insertgenericid Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So I have a question about the secondary slide. I have an extra slide for my G17 that I purchased, which was milled by Atei for an RMR and their enhanced rear serrations (basically slightly larger and deeper). No windows, slide lightening, forward or top serrations. My read is that this would not be allowed, because it is a Glock slide. But, if it were an aftermarket slide, it would, since it is the same length, caliber, and "contour." Is that correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So I have a question about the secondary slide. I have an extra slide for my G17 that I purchased, which was milled by Atei for an RMR and their enhanced rear serrations (basically slightly larger and deeper). No windows, slide lightening, forward or top serrations. My read is that this would not be allowed, because it is a Glock slide. But, if it were an aftermarket slide, it would, since it is the same length, caliber, and "contour." Is that correct? The issue is 21.2 a. Any refinishing that provides a competitive advantage is not allowed. I believe the same is applied to aftermarket slides. If it has a milled feature not found on the stock gun which provides a competitive advantage then it is a no go. If its aftermarket but is basically the same externally as a factory slide then it would be allowed. "Per existing NROI ruling, cosmetically enhancing the finish of a slide is already ALLOWED in Carry Optics Division, provided that the finish provides no competitive advantage. This clause is NOW interpreted to specifically ALLOW refinishing the frame, as well as the slide, subject to the existing constraints on refinishing (cosmetic only, no competitive advantage). Special Notes/Clarifications: • Any finish which provides a non-cosmetic function will be deemed PROHIBITED. For example, a gun finish which provides a roughened texture in an area where grip tape is not allowed (Appendix E4) is a PROHIBITED modification." "21.2b Milling of slide — only as required to insert optical sights A slide may be modified specifically for the purpose of installing optical sights, and for no other purpose." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garmil Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So I have a question about the secondary slide. I have an extra slide for my G17 that I purchased, which was milled by Atei for an RMR and their enhanced rear serrations (basically slightly larger and deeper). No windows, slide lightening, forward or top serrations. My read is that this would not be allowed, because it is a Glock slide. But, if it were an aftermarket slide, it would, since it is the same length, caliber, and "contour." Is that correct? Yes somewhat its a glock slide and had been milled for something other than sights so definitely not legal. If it was aftermarket it could be up for debate based on if the slide is considered the same contour or not. Hard to say, are the serration changes obvious next to a factory slide? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insertgenericid Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Visually, yes. Whether they'd actually be compatibly advantageous, I really doubt. But rules is rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Anyone who is attending Production Nationals should stop and say hi to Bruce Gray who will be cruising around the match with some P320s set up for CO and Production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So I have a question about the secondary slide. I have an extra slide for my G17 that I purchased, which was milled by Atei for an RMR and their enhanced rear serrations (basically slightly larger and deeper). No windows, slide lightening, forward or top serrations. My read is that this would not be allowed, because it is a Glock slide. But, if it were an aftermarket slide, it would, since it is the same length, caliber, and "contour." Is that correct? "21.2b Milling of slide — only as required to insert optical sights A slide may be modified specifically for the purpose of installing optical sights, and for no other purpose." Has that update been issued? I don't see it anywhere. My rule book just says "sights" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So I have a question about the secondary slide. I have an extra slide for my G17 that I purchased, which was milled by Atei for an RMR and their enhanced rear serrations (basically slightly larger and deeper). No windows, slide lightening, forward or top serrations. My read is that this would not be allowed, because it is a Glock slide. But, if it were an aftermarket slide, it would, since it is the same length, caliber, and "contour." Is that correct? "21.2b Milling of slide only as required to insert optical sights A slide may be modified specifically for the purpose of installing optical sights, and for no other purpose." Has that update been issued? I don't see it anywhere. My rule book just says "sights" http://uspsa.org/document_library/2015/APPENDIX-Carry%20Optics%20Provisional%20Division.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now