MRevolutionIX Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 (edited) Just to give a little background on myself. I am a right handed shooter, right eye dominate, had laser corrective surgery a few years ago and have 15/20 vision. During a range session today I wanted to try and replicate something I experienced during this past weekends match. I had a combination of 5 hardcover mikes and no-shoot misses all left of my intended target. With both eyes open i was consistenly hitting left at varying ranges. 7, 10, 15 and 25 yards. As soon as i squinted my left eye my impacts were hitting where I intended. Shot about 150 rounds and the results were consistent. I even went as far as give myself a very small target in the form of one bullet hole. With both eyes open i would hit left. The very next shot with my left eye closed the bullet went straight through the original hole. I have never experienced this before and would like to hear from those who may have. Potenial fixes are to drift my sight or shoot more with my left eye squinted. Any suggestions? Edited June 9, 2014 by MRevolutionIX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 I noticed similar with my bullseye gun which was a Ruger Mk II (.22) using iron sights. When doing the left eye squint single eye sighting (focused on sights), the POI would vary slightly like maybe 2" at 25 yards compared to shooting with both eyes open and target focused. I believe it's because the sight picture is slightly different. Shooting both methods gave very consistent POI, but it was slightly different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Potenial fixes are to drift my sight or shoot more with my left eye squinted. Any suggestions?try the scotch tape strip on the shooting glasses to block the left eye when sighting and see where the POI is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRevolutionIX Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 (edited) I noticed similar with my bullseye gun which was a Ruger Mk II (.22) using iron sights. When doing the left eye squint single eye sighting (focused on sights), the POI would vary slightly like maybe 2" at 25 yards compared to shooting with both eyes open and target focused. I believe it's because the sight picture is slightly different. Shooting both methods gave very consistent POI, but it was slightly different. That what i was experiencing at 25 yards. Edited June 9, 2014 by MRevolutionIX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRevolutionIX Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 Potenial fixes are to drift my sight or shoot more with my left eye squinted. Any suggestions?try the scotch tape strip on the shooting glasses to block the left eye when sighting and see where the POI is. I shoot with a guy here locally that does that. I may try it and see how it goes. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted June 10, 2014 Share Posted June 10, 2014 I have been thinking about this same issue. I haven't check for POA/POI shift yet but will soon. One thing I have noticed is if I shoot with both eyes open I tend to target focus but if I squint or close my left eye then I'm front sight focused. Anyone know of a way to correct this other than just dryfire / live fire practice? I have considered shooting my next match with my left eye closed to see if it makes any difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillD Posted June 10, 2014 Share Posted June 10, 2014 We've got GM's in this sport who shoot with both eyes open and those who close their non shooting eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgj3 Posted June 10, 2014 Share Posted June 10, 2014 I think that Bill makes a good point, it's not always going to be the same for everyone. And, I would venture a guess that there may be a point in each person's life where they may have to change based on what is changing with their vision. Just because it works for your local GM or even dozens of others does not mean that it is absolutely going to be the best for you too. Try different things that seem to work for others, maybe they are onto something. Other times it may be that their whatever (grip, sighting method, posture, etc.) is not what works best for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayohee Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 After researching the subject online countless times I've found that many top level shooters do both and there doesn't seem to be any real advantage in using either for USPSA/IPSC. YMMV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRevolutionIX Posted June 11, 2014 Author Share Posted June 11, 2014 Very good points made by all. My concern is, I tend to shoot closer targets with both eyes open but squint my left when targets are further away or require a better placed shot. A 2" point of impact differance at @ 25 yards could mean a no-shoot or mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillD Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 If you are squinting for longer targets you could be looking over your sights on the closer ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3djedi Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 I use shooting glasses with a small piece of tape over my non-dominant eye. Do whatever works for ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theycallmeingot Posted June 30, 2014 Share Posted June 30, 2014 i have been putting tape over my left eye since pretty early on in my shooting and have never gotten over needing it. i saw a pretty big improvement in transitions being able to have both eyes open instead of squinting my left eye. i guess you could say i'm addicted to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayohee Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Thought I'd report back after finishing a Steel match and a few hours of action pistol. I found that with both eyes open I can transition almost twice as fast (steel challenge) and had a lot of success with this method. However, when I applied it to my normal USPSA practice session I had a very tough time hitting alphas consistently. I was able to transition much faster but it came at the expense of accuracy. I have thus resolved to putting a piece of office tape over my lenses and it has helped tremendously. I get a hard front sight focus but can still keep my peripheral vision. Next match is this Sunday so we'll see how it goes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabMan45 Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Read Brian's discussion of this in Section 3 of Beyond Fundamentals. Once I did, I switched to translucent tape over the dominant eye and have never gone back. There are lots of very good reasons for doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darqnezz Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I have heard of eye dominance switch. Could be happening in your case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooterdog Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 I never could get the hang of both eyes open. Always saw two sights and two targets. Tape on lens messed up my equilibrium. Finally just stuck with squinting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g17drumr Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 I use a paster on my left lens and it works great for me... also it keeps me indexed on the tarbet because if i move the gun and not my head and body the gun come out from behind the pasted section of my glasses so i see double and know im not doing it right. if that makes sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkCO Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 (edited) It is about what you need to see for the type of course you are shooting. If you ask them, I think you would be surprised at how many top shooters use a target focus often and a front sight focus less frequently. Some will even use one eye for that hard front sight focus. Use the timer and the hits to prove what works best for you. Edited October 10, 2014 by MarkCO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 I always struggled with this type of issue when I shot with both eyes wide open. I went through a phase where I would totally close my left eye to force the use of only my dominant right eye while shooting. But I found that totally closing my left eye dramatically decreased my peripheral vision field of view and decreased the chances of observing things passively in my peripheral vision. Such as confirming that a piece of steel is falling well after shooting it and moving to another location or engaging other targets. Or observing the movement pattern of a swinger as I am engaging another target. Since totally closing my left eye was a disadvantage I then switched to partially closing my left eye to a point where I could ONLY see peripherally out of it but not hard focus on anything with it. Doing this still forces the hard focus of only the right eye as it should but also allows me to retrain my peripheral vision observation in my left eye. I have been using this method of partial left eye closure for several years now and it is now second nature. I even find myself doing it when I am not shooting and simply looking around for things aggressively, such as double checking my blind spots while driving and changing lanes. Give the partially closed left eye solution a try and see if it works better for you. I think that the ability to shoot with both eyes wide open really comes down to how dominant your dominant eye really is. If your dominant eye is very dominant then it would be a lot easier to shoot with both eyes wide open. If your dominant eye is just slightly more dominant that your non-dominant eye, it becomes a lot harder to shoot with both eyes wide open and see a consistent sight picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swhiteh3 Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 Very interesting discussion. In my previous shooting experiences before serious competition, I was always told I should be working towards shooting with both eyes open. I tried and tried. No matter whether it was iron sights on an M4 or an Aimpoint Red Dot, I got the same results. Downrange when I shot with my right eye open only, I got good consistent hits. When I tried to keep both eyes open, I CONSISTENTLY get two distinct groups downrange - one right on top of my previous "good" group, and one to the left of it. The two groups apparently reflect my eyes' battle for dominance. FWIW, Every basic eye dominance test points to my bring clearly right eye dominant. Up until a few months ago, I wore corrective lenses, and just recently got LASIK. I've continued to shoot with my left eye closed for USPSA, but I really need to try tape over my non-dominant (left) eye some time. I hope it might restore some peripheral vision while also reducing stress in my face and eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I think that the ability to shoot with both eyes wide open really comes down to how dominant your dominant eye really is.I have always thought this was the case as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yeti Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 Your eyes can change over time. I know guys that have had fits trying to force a two eyed target focus. You need to determine what works. As of late, I am slower transitioning from close to medium distance targets in moderate light. When I should be changing to front sight focus, my stupid brain fights to maintain the full two eyed target focus. Ugh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan550 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 I realize I'm late to the show here, but after spending 30+ years in the eyeglass industry, I think most of what's been posted is accurate as far as putting tape on the non-dominant lens. If you close your non-dominant eye, the pupil of the dominant eye will dilate trying to compensate for the lost light. This can blurr things even worse than keeping both open. The tape allows light to come in on the sides and keeps that eye from closing out the light as it will if it is closed. As to the POI change, that's normal and you can adjust your POA to compensate with practice. I notice it most when I tape over the front lens on a red dot and keep both eyes open. Strange, I know, but it works! Alan~^~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimo-Hombre Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Tape the squint eye. Just put the tape hi. So you see under it for movement and reloads, on the sights you get one picture only. This strategy has worked for me, hope it does for you. The GM posters here no doubt have way better advice though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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