A question for all those that set up stages

[Poppa Bear]

I have done many where you lean out to get the last target. The fastest way is to lean, shoot, plant your foot outside to keep yourself upright and either unload and show clear, or plant and move back into the box to finish the course. I will grant that you do not want it so tight that the only way to get it is to lean enough to fall out, but i do not have a problem with a target that requires a lean with both feet planted to hit the A zone.

[monicataliani]

By the way, at 5'5" she is taller than the shorties around here I think.

Have anyone specific in mind???

[Joe4d]

does Black creek even shoot USPSA ? Would be great if they did, to my knowledge they shoot independent steel matches.

[Joe4d]

Its time for ports to be done away with completely in favor of verticle slots. Tired of hearing that, "tall people can squat" malarky. When shorter people get to shoot every single one of them in their natural shooting position, wouldnt matter if it was random, or 50 50, but ports ALWAYS favor shorter people. As far as leaning around baricade, I fail to see how 5-5 is at a disadvantage.

[Sarge]

By the way, at 5'5" she is taller than the shorties around here I think.

Have anyone specific in mind???

[polizei1]

Hey, Kevin knows I'm a little on the smaller side...I just prefer to view him as a behemoth.

I'm 5'4", so if your daughter is an inch taller than me, she shouldn't really have any issues. The only issue I've ran into so far is port height/wall height. Sometimes I have to stand on my tip-toes, which is a terrible position. Likewise, it's a lot easier to me to go low on a port than people over 6'.

[monicataliani]

It must just be an Ohio thing!!! LOL!!!! I am even shorter than Corey!!! That is why he squads with me, it makes him feel tall!

He is right though, I have only had a few stages that I was at an extreme disadvantage. But then again we have great MD's who always find me before the match to make sure I can see through all the ports!!!

Edited March 12, 2013 by monicataliani

[extremedistance]

JoeD

Black creek is Steel, IDPA and cowboy. they would have to close down the whole range for a USPSA match.

There was one steel stage there where we had to shoot two texas stars one from each side of a barrier. she could only do about half of each star. it was rough.

I do feel for the short shooters. Us big guys can always crouch or lean. but we will never move as fast as you compact sports cars for sure. I look like a big rig going through the streets of NY

[raz-0]

I design stages and run a match. I am (was) over 6'6" (and shrinking, thanks L4 and L5). I keep shorter shooters in mind, and per USPSA rules if you have a medical reason that you are unable to shoot a stage as described, exceptions can be made if given a suitable penalty. In the last 10 years or so shooting at least two matches a month, I can say being tall has benefited me maybe 20-30 times in a decade, and it is usually a lean or being able to get an upper a/b shot over a no shoot that others can't to save me an added position or a reload. With short ports, very teeny cooper tunnels, etc, it's usually a problem around 20-50 times a year depending on the stages people come up with that year.

We use stockade fence for walls, so making aport too high is really a non issue. Leans and starting positions that are hands/feet on the Xs I have to be careful about. The start positions I have developed a feel for, the leans I usually try to snag someone short walking by.

[extremedistance]

good to hear raz-o it is amazing how setting the box back just a foot can make a difference

[GigG]

Good course design will make it so there are different ways to shoot the course. Shooting T1-3 through port A and T4-6 through port B may be better for some shooters and some other shooting decisions may be be better for others.

Really good course design allows for freestyle and encourages creativity in your decision making.

[Locomotion]

I'm 4'11" and a USPSA CRO. Yes it's a challenge. In two separate major matches I was told to engage the target and take the misses, or step out of the shooting area to take the procedural. Lots of ports are too tall and that includes hands on X's. I try to make the range master aware after a walk through (before the match is shot) if something is just not possible for me. It doesn't always get fixed - depends on the match level. Now 5'5" is plenty tall compared to the 2-time world champion Athena Lee and champion Lisa Munson (dubbed "mighty mouse")You just have to do the best you can with what you have and what they give you. Since Level II RO is primarily stage design, I am very cognizant of these types of challenges.

[Firefight5243]

Setting up for me starts off with a sheet that has an idea on it. And then that idea gets turned around. After it gets turned around we think there is a complete stage... Then resolve the steel to close issues. Then have to fix the shoot through problems. Then have the match director come through and changes what ever he thinks should be moved or make it harder. I like options to give each shooter a few different ways to run the stage. Hard just for hard sake no... Bc I have to shoot it too, last match we had two poppers and two paper at 32 yards, it was surprising how many mikes were on that paper and the pick ups on the steel.

It's fun if you can even show up early and help set up DO IT ! You will learn so much about what goes into the match, I think it's funny how well you forget the stage you set up lol!

[rowdyb]

I'm only 5' 7"...

[robport]

At our range, we do, up to a point. It's an indoor range so we are mostly worried about hitting the ceiling or floor after the target though.

[JAFO]

We keep heights and physical abilities in mind somewhat. We have several small-statured shooters, both young and old. We rarely have prone positions, and the last time we offered a secondary box some distance away for those who didn't want to (or couldn't) get down there. As our walls need rebuilt, we have also started using vertical slots instead of square ports.

One other thing to consider with port/shooter height is shooting angles and berm height. For instance, depending on the distances between the berm, a target, and a port or shooting position, you could have some shorter shooters aiming over the berm on a head shot. Especially with something like a drop-turner stapled high on the sticks.

[Phil Dunlop]

My stages are firstly about specific challenges and then, given the resources, (particularly time and bodies), about symmetry for lefties, and consideration for the tall and those even shorter than me.

Freestyle is the cornerstone of the sport, but without the odd contortions it can be impossible to test some skills. Thankfully, the worst I have done is raise a grumble, I've never had a stage someone couldn't complete for its design.

[Nimitz]

Its time for ports to be done away with completely in favor of verticle slots. Tired of hearing that, "tall people can squat" malarky. When shorter people get to shoot every single one of them in their natural shooting position, wouldnt matter if it was random, or 50 50, but ports ALWAYS favor shorter people. As far as leaning around baricade, I fail to see how 5-5 is at a disadvantage.

finally ....

[robport]

I hadn't noticed it before, but we had a port last Friday that I had a lot of trouble bending over far enough to get a good sight picture. Apparently a lot of our other short-challenged people did too. We all clipped the top of the no shoot tucked away on the left of the lane, except for the guy that missed the target behind it completely.

Part of it was the brown-on-brown lack of definition of the head of the no-shoot covering the bottom of the target (it's indoors and the lighting in there was blocked somewhat too).

When I'm setting up, I usually try to put the hands up higher on the no-shoot to make it more obvious.

I did feel pretty scrunched up and uncomfortable trying to get the sights on it though.

I'm having all kinds of new issues to solve as I try to speed up a little.

I had never considered those types of issues in the context of fairness to competitors before...good discussion.

[MarkCO]

I have asked this same question concerning this topic. How many videos have you seen where to make the shot, the shooter is leaning to the extent of almost falling out of the shooting box? Anytime a shooter must contort to such an degree that they are off balance, this is an unsafe condition .

Granted, you don't want every shot to be straight forward, but I have seen courses where the competitor was leaning out on one leg, actually falling out while the shot was fired. Is this really necessary?

In many cases, that is a choice they made to avoid using their weak hand or shoulder. If you think it is unsafe, make it a prohibited action. Edited August 31, 2015 by MarkCO

[mccurdy53]

I have asked this same question concerning this topic. How many videos have you seen where to make the shot, the shooter is leaning to the extent of almost falling out of the shooting box? Anytime a shooter must contort to such an degree that they are off balance, this is an unsafe condition .

Granted, you don't want every shot to be straight forward, but I have seen courses where the competitor was leaning out on one leg, actually falling out while the shot was fired. Is this really necessary?

In many cases, that is a choice they made to avoid using their weak hand or shoulder. If you think it is unsafe, make it a prohibited action.

You cannot declare something a "prohibited action" until someone does it.

[Sarge]

Uhh, it's actually "forbidden action".

[MarkCO]

I have asked this same question concerning this topic. How many videos have you seen where to make the shot, the shooter is leaning to the extent of almost falling out of the shooting box? Anytime a shooter must contort to such an degree that they are off balance, this is an unsafe condition .

Granted, you don't want every shot to be straight forward, but I have seen courses where the competitor was leaning out on one leg, actually falling out while the shot was fired. Is this really necessary?

In many cases, that is a choice they made to avoid using their weak hand or shoulder. If you think it is unsafe, make it a prohibited action.

You cannot declare something a "prohibited action" until someone does it.

Not true, read the rulebook. Yes, "forbidden".

[PT9Baja]

I am 6'5", left-handed and 66 years old with some warn body parts that limit my abilities. I don't expect to shoot a stage the same as a 5' track star. I adapt what I have to what is needed . Overall it seems to balance out. There are stages that favor one body type or handedness , but then one comes along that does the oppisite. I have kicked on some unintended lefty friendly stages and have had it handed to me on acute angle righty stages. Over time it balances. I am thankful for the people who do the work and shoot em as they come , as best I can.

[MarkCO]

So at the Noveske MG match, I had 3 stages that it was beneficial to be small, out of 10 stages. There were also 2 stages where it was beneficial to be tall and two where it was beneficial to be left handed. What was interesting is the large number of right-handed tall people who (most jokingly) gave me grief about "short" or "left" friendly stages. I did my best to balance out the challenges to present equal challenge over the course of the match, regardless of body type (broken, old, etc...sorry not a lot of help) and it was almost like those who normally are advantaged by stage design had more issues than those who are short, left, etc and have learned to adapt.