New L10 Division Blaster

[Chuck D]

I've purchased a new SVI frame to build a new L10 Division blaster on (have large hands and a widebody fits me better). I have little to no interest in shooting Limited Division so please keep this fact in mind when making your caliber choice. If YOU were building a new blaster on either a Single Stack or Widebody frame for L10 use ONLY...what caliber would you choose and why?

[kevin c]

40, mainly because nearly all my other guns are in the same caliber, and I already have the dies/brass/bullets/loads set up for the different disciplines. I am no judge of the 45, though, when it comes to recoil, etc.. If recoil is not an issue, the extra big 45 holes might get you a few more points once in a while (though you might lose them on a noshoot...).

[D.Hayden]

Same as Kevin. I'd really like to have one caliber to shoot for L, L-10, and Production. I shoot a 45 SS now in L-10, I'd rather have a 40 SS, when I can find one (that I'm allowed to have in California). I like the way 40's shoot, I don't know the physics, but they feel softer. If you ever decide to go to Limited, you're set, and I'd think the pistol would re-sell easier.

I'd think the bullets should be cheaper too, but the Zero's I use are the same price per 1K 40 or 45 (or within a $1).

[AikiDale]

A physicist would be of great help explaining this but in the same weight bullet, at the same velocity the English major in me thought there should be no difference between .40 and .45 so for the last year and a half I've been shooting .45. Then after shooting several other folks .40s I got one. I suspect it has something to do with angular accerleration and the larger diameter of the .45 but the front sight moves up and to the right for me whereas the .40 goes nearly straight up and back down. Much easier for me to see more, more quickly with the .40. And my results last weekend in the first match I shot with it seemed to bear this out. For me, the STI Edge in .40 seems to work much better than either my SS or DS Kimber in .45.

[Cameron]

Reloading components much less expensive

[Bill Schwab]

I shot 45 for years, then switched to 40 and have never looked back.

It seemed to me that if I get a good grip coming out of the holster the 40 recoiled less, but was less forgiving than the 45 to a slightly off grip.

[TriggerT]

Let me start off by saying that all of my guns for USPSA compitition are in .45acp.

That said, if I was to do it all over again, all of my guns would be in .40. I have been asked by several new shooters, who are looking into buying or building a gun for USPSA what they should get. You should get a high cap .40, with both some 10 round, and high cap mags. My resoning is this. Have just one gun, one set up, one loading press, that you can use for both Limited, and Limited 10. OK, you say you have no intention of ever shooting Limited, just L-10. That will change, trust me. Been there, done that, had to buy another gun for shooting Limited.

Next issue is that .40 brass is both easier to find, and cheaper. that is not to say that .45 brass is hard to find, but I shoot with several cops who get all of their ammo from there departments, so they always give their .40 brass away. If I had a .40 cal gun I could have tens of thousands of free cassings.

Wide body guns ARE faster and easier to reload, especially for newer shooters. Unless you have very small hands, the size of the fram wont be an issue.

I love my .45acp. Les Baer built my L-10 gun for me, and I shoot it better than anything else I have found.HOWEVER, I wish I could have just one gun, so that I didn't have to change when I want to shoot limited.

[JFD]

I love my .45s, but if I had it to do over again everything would be a double stack .40 just because it's cheaper to feed them.

[rhino]

If it's specifically a game gun (whether Limited 10 or Limited), I think .40 is a far better choice.

There is no comparison between the felt recoil of major .45acp and .40. The .40 wins every time and you can see it at any match where there there are .45 and 40 shooters in the same squad.

The only real downside of .40 is that it is a bit more work getting a 1911-style gun to run reliably than with .45ACP or .38 super, but obviously it's a problem that can be overcome.

The only reason I have and shoot .45ACP is because all of my guns are defensive tools first and foremost. I shoot them in gun games because I want to improve my skills with them, prove their reliability to myself, and have a lot of fun. If I were building a gun just for USPSA, it would be a .40.

[LPatterson]

In the 50's when I started shooting a pistol it was a .45 and I will admit I had trouble with it at 50 yards but now that I use a 2 hand grip it is not a problem. I like the .45 so much I have had an Open Glock made.

[steve223]

I just dont like the recoil impluse of the 45 even with lite springs it is just to slow. I like my 45s but for a game gun i would go with the 40.

Steve

[Chuck D]

I shoot a SV in 45ACP now. It's a good gun and I'm competitive with it but I'm getting to the point where if feels "slow". Cycles slow, recovers from muzzle flip slow...you get the point. I've made several changes in bullet weight and recoil spring rates...added weight with a bull barrel and tungsten guide rod but it still feels slow and muzzle flips a bit too much to speed up the muzzle flip recovery.

I'm not a big fan of 40...heard it's a bit difficult to make major with reasonable pressures. I've had my share of "hot loads" back in my early days of shooting Open. I'm not too keen on going through THAT again. That's the 45's big draw...easy to make major safely. Maybe use 10mm instead?

Seems so far 40 is THE choice from those that responded...

I'm learning something new here...keep up the discussion !

[diehli]

I'm not a big fan of 40...heard it's a bit difficult to make major with reasonable pressures.

Never go by what you've "heard." If you pay attention while reloading, it shouldn't be an issue. Hell, plenty of factory ammo makes major and it's obviously within SAAMI-spec for .40.

[warpspeed]

One major reason for going 40 S&W in a widebody is resale.

If you decide down the road that you wnat to sell the gun, a wide long dust cover 40 will be much easier to sell than the same in 45 ACP.

Plus, what Cameron said, brass is much cheaper in 40.

[roby]

as a fairly new shooter myself, i shoot a 45 because that is what i have. however, shooting a 45 ss and then trying a 40 ss there was a difference for me atleast in transition and accuracy of accelerated shot to shots. in a widebody gun i feel there is no question or comparison. its just not worth it if your goin to be building a gun to chamber it in 45 (a dedicated game gun that is).

[kevin c]

I'm not a big fan of 40...heard it's a bit difficult to make major with reasonable pressures. I've had my share of "hot loads" back in my early days of shooting Open.

Maybe use 10mm instead?

With the PF down to 165, and the .40 no longer the new kid on the block where loading info was strictly trial and error, I think you can find many safe pressure loads to use for IPSC.

I think the recoil would be a lot worse than both the 40 and 45, at least for factory ammo, and the components (mainly brass) a bit harder to come by in the quantities and price that 40 is available at.

[Jack Suber]

While my new .40 is being built, I decided to pull out my old Para 45 for L10. I'll be shooting it at the Summer Blast this weekend (Should be interesting). I have not fired this pistol in about 3 years and was startled when I shot it and saw these huge gaping holes in the target. The big bullets have helped me pick up a couple of points, but then burned me on a no shoot on a tight target. Still, it is fun to go back to the .45. Another thing I am having to adjust for is swingers. I am shooting 200 grn bullets and as a result, my timing seems to be off. Now, if I can only remember to reload.......

[eric nielsen]

40cal sti or svi. 10round mags [for now] if you don't wanna pay the Brady Tax.

Less torque, higher capacity, cheaper brass, much cheaper bullets.

More consistent cycling, more reliable [usually], higher resale value.

Much easier to download for Production or Steel or NRA Action.

If you want a lower initial investment, don't go singlestack - go Glock. In 40.

Just my opinion...

[Ron Ankeny]

I choose to shoot a single stack .45 in L10 because real shooters know rocking and rolling with a SS in .45 is the shit.

If I was looking at L10 seriously and wanted the advantage of a little faster reload, cheaper components, and a quicker impulse, I would shoot a fat gun loaded to 10 rounds.

[Duane Thomas]

Doublestack: .40 S&W.

Singlestack: .45 ACP.

[Singlestack]

I choose to shoot a single stack .45 in L10 because real shooters know rocking and rolling with a SS in .45 is the shit.

[Chuck D]

Now that someone makes a 10 round mag for SS in 40 caliber, why wouldn't you use one of those?

Could it be that's not " the..... "

Guess I'm not "keepin it real."

[benny hill]

limited 10 is a reloading contest. which ever you can reload & shoot the fastest,USE.

[Chuck D]

So, which "caliber" reloads faster?

It's about caliber...not frame manufacturer/design but I do get the point about L10 being a "reloading contest."

Thanks guys for your input...gives me food for thought.

[Chuck D]

"A .40 or .45 loaded to the same power factor deliver approximately the same recoil. Power factoring is, in essence, equalizing recoil for the sake of fair competition. Picking between a .40 and .45 to gain an advantage from the standpoint of recoil alone is pointless. The magazine capacity of the .40 is the only reason it survives, and it is a legit advantage. Light bullets create sharper recoil and snappier gun movement than heavier bullets at the same power factor with the same powders. This is a personal preference issue that no one agrees on, so pick what you like."

The above statement is taken from a response from TGO (www.robleatham.com) to a shooter whom asked him about recoil recoil spring rates. The author of the question is switching from a 45 to 40 caliber and is having recoil handling problems.

I thought the statement about picking a 40 over a 45 from a recoil standpoint being pointless to be as interesting as the statement made about mag capacity being the only reason the 40 survives.

Maybe the 45 isn't a bad choice for L10 afterall.