9mm Major Load Data

[DWFAN]

Yeah Bobby the spread sheet is old but my 9mm major load I used to use was from that. I used Hs6 for major.

Alan sent me the spread sheet and it has a lot of info on it. I also referenced several burn rate charts and they all have the powders in different order accordingly so no 2 burn rate charts are the same.

I contacted Hodgdon and told them I'd buy a metric butt load of SP2 if they could get more in country. Tried the same with Kaltron (importer of Viht powders) and they told me the import licenses are pretty hard to get and had to have each product specifically listed on the license.

Grafs told me if I could find someone with the import license they would "match my metric butt ton" purchase because they'd love to have some too for resale.

I know a couple guys who would buy metric butt tons of SP2, 3, AO, BA10.. any of it that they could get.

[BrianATL]

Took 10 case loaded with 3N38 and seated a 124gr MG CMJ on there. With the AutoComp powder the COAL is 1.168". By doing nothing but changing the powder to 3N38 the COAL is now 1.180". Evidently the fuller powder of the case is preventing too much compression and limiting the COAL. I'll shoot these 10 through the chrono to verify PF. If the feel is good I'll load some more, but it would have to be REAL good!

I am thinking thats one of the reasons they make that seater die adjustable.

[SLM]

This is getting off topic but... So who used to import SP-2?

[kgunz11]

This is getting off topic but... So who used to import SP-2?

I wish I knew. I'd contact them and find out if their license was still good. I know Grafs use to sell it but no one knew where they were getting it from.

[kgunz11]

Took 10 case loaded with 3N38 and seated a 124gr MG CMJ on there. With the AutoComp powder the COAL is 1.168". By doing nothing but changing the powder to 3N38 the COAL is now 1.180". Evidently the fuller powder of the case is preventing too much compression and limiting the COAL. I'll shoot these 10 through the chrono to verify PF. If the feel is good I'll load some more, but it would have to be REAL good!

I am thinking thats one of the reasons they make that seater die adjustable.

I did not change bullets so I shouldn't need to change seating depth. The powder is preventing the bullet from going any deeper in the case.

[BrianATL]

Crank the seater die down eight of a turn and I bet you get the OAL length you want. Been loading this stuff for years

[kgunz11]

Thanks Brian, I'll give that a try.

[DWFAN]

This is getting off topic but... So who used to import SP-2?

I wish I knew. I'd contact them and find out if their license was still good. I know Grafs use to sell it but no one knew where they were getting it from.

I was under the impression it was Vectan/Noble sport's decision to not send it to the U.S. anymore.

[SLM]

This is getting off topic but... So who used to import SP-2?

I wish I knew. I'd contact them and find out if their license was still good. I know Grafs use to sell it but no one knew where they were getting it from.

I was under the impression it was Vectan/Noble sport's decision to not send it to the U.S. anymore.

I read something similar... The containers that they've been using for years are no longer DOT approved. It wasn't that they wanted to quit, it was that they weren't going to change containers just to make one country happy. Following that was a rumor that Hodgdon was going to get it in in barrels/bulk, package it and sell it as they have approved containers. I even read where that had been "Confirmed by XXX at Hodgdon. Got that right from the ownder!" Man, ya gotta love the internet rumor mill but anyway....

[CocoBolo]

Took 10 case loaded with 3N38 and seated a 124gr MG CMJ on there. With the AutoComp powder the COAL is 1.168". By doing nothing but changing the powder to 3N38 the COAL is now 1.180". Evidently the fuller powder of the case is preventing too much compression and limiting the COAL. I'll shoot these 10 through the chrono to verify PF. If the feel is good I'll load some more, but it would have to be REAL good!

I am thinking thats one of the reasons they make that seater die adjustable.

I did not change bullets so I shouldn't need to change seating depth. The powder is preventing the bullet from going any deeper in the case.

I had the same issue with AA#7 and I cranked and cranked and cranked some more and they just kept coming out 1.180-1.185. G-man told me to use the U-die to get more neck tension, I think they go down but come back up before the crimp. I'll try that with the next batch but the 1.180 runs in the gun fine. Loading was slow since it would sling powder out and that would get in the primer punch.

Edited May 12, 2010 by CocoBolo

[kgunz11]

OK took the 3N38 to the range and shot 10 through the chrono along side 10 of the AutoComp load. Same PF average between the 2 and no perceivable difference in dot track between the 2. I forgot to get one of her mags when I went to the range so I had to single feed each round. It allowed me to really watch the dot track in recoil. Neither of them are anything like the SP2, but I guess I can quit riding that train. For the cost difference, and the fact that AutoComp is much easier to load with, I'll stick with that.

Edited May 12, 2010 by kgunz11

[8082011]

My turn to add more to the 9-major posting. Thanks to all the people here, reading gave me a good starting point and made it easy to pick powders and loads. Well here goes...

Ten shot strings out of a full size gun with no barrel holes. The powders I used were HS-6 and AutoComp seated with MG 124gr JHP loaded to 1.170.

HS-6 Avg velocity. PF

7.9 1358.5 168.5

8.1 1391.3 172.5

AutoComp

6.8 1367.3 169.5

6.9 1380.5 171.2

I guess my next test will be which powder I like the best. I'll be using 8.0gr for HS-6 and 6.9gr for AutoComp. Load up the rest of the powder of each and go from there.

[Xfactor]

OK took the 3N38 to the range and shot 10 through the chrono along side 10 of the AutoComp load. Same PF average between the 2 and no perceivable difference in dot track between the 2. I forgot to get one of her mags when I went to the range so I had to single feed each round. It allowed me to really watch the dot track in recoil. Neither of them are anything like the SP2, but I guess I can quit riding that train. For the cost difference, and the fact that AutoComp is much easier to load with, I'll stick with that.

Bobby, what PF did you get them up to? Any pressure signs with either?

[racegun9]

This is getting off topic but... So who used to import SP-2?

I wish I knew. I'd contact them and find out if their license was still good. I know Grafs use to sell it but no one knew where they were getting it from.

I was under the impression it was Vectan/Noble sport's decision to not send it to the U.S. anymore.

Seems to me Adco Sales was the original importer.

http://www.adcosales.com/merchant2/

If someone is doing business with them they might be

able to fill in some blanks.

I'm thinking they sent me the original reloading data.

I know grafs ended up with whatever was left in the country.

But its been a few years

[eric nielsen]

Adco is what I remember. Also that is what is stamped on the back of my Vectan loading booklet.

I wrote to Nobel Sport shortly after the start of what they said would be a "short" interruption of supply to the US. Gave them some large number of pounds SP2 I thought they could sell just to USPSA shooters. They said they would look into and get back to me...

Realize they are a French company and the way they do business is different. Quick reactions and command decisions are very rare. Meetings, committees, unions, and contracts rule over most their economy.

For instance if you want to buy a machine or a computer from a French company you will haggle for months while both sides & their lawyers write and re-write proposed contracts. Once the contract is signed, that's it. You are getting what they build, even if it doesn't work. The assumption is that you missed a detail, you should have put it in the contract, and it's your fault. You are bound to keep buying for the life of the contract.

If the problem truly is the DOT containers and they are still willing to sell in bulk, it would benefit us greatly to get a US distributor who is willing to feed our addiction. It really is the ultimate Open powder & best for 9Major by far.

edit - forgot to mention that for loading 3n38 in 9Major, it's a good idea to avoid spraying case lube into the insides of the cases. A box big enough to lay out all your cases flat helps that. Also you can probably see that it's good to crimp each round soon after seating and measure many/all of your rounds for OAL.

Edited May 14, 2010 by eric nielsen

[MoNsTeR]

Did some testing with Power Pistol since I had some lying around. Numbers in this thread are kinda all over the place so I took a wild guess where to start.

Test gun is a Bedell 9 major with full length (5.4") barrel and no ports.

124gr MG JHP

1.170" OAL

R-P brass (mostly, anyway)

Wolf SP primers

6.8gr (n=10)

Avg 1311.2

ES 41.3

SD 14.3

7.0gr (n=10)

Avg 1324.3

ES 40.0

SD 13.4

7.2gr (n=12)

Avg 1353.2

ES 35.1

SD 11.3

7.4gr (n=10)

Avg 1344.5

ES 50.1

SD 14.0

Based on my prior experiences with Power Pistol in 9mm "book" loads, I expected it to be extremely loud and flashy. Flashy it was, particularly since it started to rain as I concluded my pistol shooting for the day and it got rather dark. Noise-wise though it wasn't any worse than 3N37. Compared to 3N37 dot movement was less predictable. Feel in the hand was marginally softer at the same PF. In terms of cleanliness it didn't leave the nasty grit in the gun that 3N37 does, just a fine haze on everything (noticed it in particular on mag lips). Clear winner in that department. Loading it kinda sucked, the individual granules are very light and tend to fly out of the cases as you work the press. Metering consistency is also poor relative to VV powders (but what isn't?). Primers were nice and rounded, just a little bit of firing pin drag (which I also get with 3N37).

In terms of the data, I'm halfway between disappointed and confused. At 7.2gr it's barely making major (PF=167.8) and then moving to 7.4gr velocity actually goes down. Maybe it's my particular gun or combination of components, but to me it doesn't really look viable.

Pros: cheap, clean

Cons: dot tracking not so hot, loading consistency sucks, statistics suck

[markcic]

9mm

5 inch STI barrel with SL2 comp and 4 popple holes

124gr Montana Gold CMJ

1.2" OAL

Federal NT Brass

Wolf SR primers

Winchester Autocomp Powder

8.2gr

1387 ft/sec

172 PF

8.0gr

1339.5 ft/sec

166.1 PF

7.8gr

1300.8 ft/sec

161.3 PF

7.6gr

1297 ft/sec

160.8

7.2gr

1240.8 ft/sec

153.8 PF

[Team Amish 1]

5" 2011 9mm at 1.170" w/124 CMJ, comp only, no hybrid holes

9-May 78° F

Powder weight ave FPS ave PF

Longshot 7.6 1,332 165

20-Jun 93° F

Powder weight ave FPS ave PF

HS-6 7.6 1,329 165

HS-6 7.7 1,347 167

HS-6 7.8 1,365 169

HS-6 7.9 1,402 174

HS-6 8.0 1,406 174

HS-6 8.1 1,413 175

n350 7.4 1,384 172

[jkatz44]

What power factor are you guys trying to be out. 175?

[Alan Adamson]

What power factor are you guys trying to be out. 175?

Usually, I shoot for 171+/-

Alan

[CocoBolo]

5" 2011 9mm at 1.170" w/124 CMJ, comp only, no hybrid holes

9-May 78° F

Powder weight ave FPS ave PF

Longshot 7.6 1,332 165

20-Jun 93° F

Powder weight ave FPS ave PF

HS-6 7.6 1,329 165

HS-6 7.7 1,347 167

HS-6 7.8 1,365 169

HS-6 7.9 1,402 174

HS-6 8.0 1,406 174

HS-6 8.1 1,413 175

n350 7.4 1,384 172

Team Amish can you enlighten us on your impresson of N350? I have a bunch of it but didn't think it would be much good in 9 major.

[shooterbenedetto]

9major 5inch gun 3 port comp no holes.

n350 7.3g

aol 1.155

crimp .370

CCI primers

win brass.

PF- 168 consistent

[xinnix]

Does anyone shoot hard cast bullets? I am just looking to enjoy shooting paper at the club I belong to at 25 yards. I have a 1911 9mm S.A. Loaded 5 in barrel. I was looking to keep cost down and shoot hard cast bullets. I have tried some loads and have had good results for me with 120 gr hard cast .356 bullets but I cannot get them. I am not into competition shooting. The place I got my cast bullets ran into some problems and it is going to be a while before I can buy bullets from Penn in the 120 Gr. 356". I am looking for a cast bullet 125 Gr. 356" using Power Pistol. Does anyone have a load built up that would work with the cast bullet and the Power Pistol. I have a lot of the Power Pistol and that is why I wanted to stay with that. And 125 gr. bullets are common to get in .356" any help would be appreciated. Thank you very much and I have enjoyed reading this whole thread and the work and passion that has gone into everyones work and enjoyment. And it is great that you all share your information.

[Rob Tompkins]

Let me start off by stating I'm new to Open guns and 9mm Major but otheriwse an experenced shooter and reloader.

So, here are my results...

This data was from a STI Trubor w/ 5" barrel blank w/ custom milled comp (reportedly done by Brazos).

Brass: Once fired mixed headstamp

Bullet: Zero 125gr JHP

Primer: Fed SP

Loader: Hornady LNL, powder measure calibrated with balance beam scale

COL: 1.170 - 1.175

Charge Min V Max V Avg V Spread Std Dev PF

Ramshot Silhouette

7.0 1196 1239 1217 43 11 152

7.2 1225 1260 1240 35 13 155

7.4 1247 1291 1266 44 13 158

7.6 1271 1294 1284 23 8 160

7.8 1284 1320 1298 36 13 162

8.0 1306 1347 1326 41 13 166

Autocomp

6.0 1108 1159 1134 51 16 142

6.2 1140 1196 1176 56 17 147

6.4 1144 1201 1177 57 16 147

6.6 1181 1256 1223 75 22 153

6.8 1215 1274 1245 59 19 156

7.0 1246 1284 1273 38 13 159

Notes: As you can see I only had one load that made Major PF and then just! I picked a COL of 1.170 to keep pressure down and it seemed to be a common / popular choice but I found that it was just a bit too long to fit in my STI mags with 9mm spacers.

From here I'll try the Ramshot Silhouette at shorter COL's (I've seen several references for this powder / bullet combo at shorter COL's) before I go to a higher charge weight, as I find 8gr is nearly a compressed load.

Overall, compared to results posted here I seemed to be getting ~2.5% - 3.0% lower velocites with the Silhouette and ~6% lower with Autocomp. At first I thought my chrono was mis-calibrated but due to different deltas from the reported data I don't think so. But I could be wrong.

Also, the previous pistol owner told me 8.0 gr of Silhouette gave him 170PF. I think he said COL was 1.170.

Any other thoughts?

Edited July 20, 2010 by Rob Tompkins

[CocoBolo]

Let me start off by stating I'm new to Open guns and 9mm Major but otheriwse an experenced shooter and reloader.

So, here are my results...

This data was from a STI Trubor w/ 5" barrel blank w/ custom milled comp (reportedly done by Brazos).

Brass: Once fired mixed headstamp

Bullet: Zero 125gr JHP

Primer: Fed SP

Loader: Hornady LNL, powder measure calibrated with balance beam scale

COL: 1.170 - 1.175

Charge Min V Max V Avg V Spread Std Dev PF

Ramshot Silhouette

7.0 1196 1239 1217 43 11 152

7.2 1225 1260 1240 35 13 155

7.4 1247 1291 1266 44 13 158

7.6 1271 1294 1284 23 8 160

7.8 1284 1320 1298 36 13 162

8.0 1306 1347 1326 41 13 166

Autocomp

6.0 1108 1159 1134 51 16 142

6.2 1140 1196 1176 56 17 147

6.4 1144 1201 1177 57 16 147

6.6 1181 1256 1223 75 22 153

6.8 1215 1274 1245 59 19 156

7.0 1246 1284 1273 38 13 159

Notes: As you can see I only had one load that made Major PF and then just! I picked a COL of 1.170 to keep pressure down and it seemed to be a common / popular choice but I found that it was just a bit too long to fit in my STI mags with 9mm spacers.

From here I'll try the Ramshot Silhouette at shorter COL's (I've seen several references for this powder / bullet combo at shorter COL's) before I go to a higher charge weight, as I find 8gr is nearly a compressed load.

Overall, compared to results posted here I seemed to be getting ~2.5% - 3.0% lower velocites with the Silhouette and ~6% lower with Autocomp. At first I thought my chrono was mis-calibrated but due to different deltas from the reported data I don't think so. But I could be wrong.

Also, the previous pistol owner told me 8.0 gr of Silhouette gave him 170PF. I think he said COL was 1.170.

Any other thoughts?

I've seen a lot of this. I was getting 170pf in my gun I just kept loading and shooting and shooting some more then with the same load a year later I was 162pf. Some of this is wear and tear on the barrel and some of it is differences in lots of powder