BritinUSA Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I'm hearing stories from Ecuador; Many European shooters ammo has not arrived. Armscor ammo is reportedly stuck in Panama. Local dealers are selling ammo, so maybe things will work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 So, what happens if the ammo doesn't arrive in time for the match, somehow? Will they toss the chrono?? In Standard, one might could see where factory stuff might make major (if it runs in the gun). In Open... another story, entirely... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Suber Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 I just got word that the match is being protested by the European teams because their ammo did not arrive. Apparently, the powers here did not make arrangements for the tariffs on the ammo. The Armscor ammo is in Panama and will not make it - the Panamanian govrnment will not release it. They are going to return it to its point of origination. 40 cal ammo is going for $50.00/50 and 38 Super is no where to be found. So, unless something changes ovrnight, there might not be a WS because of the protests. I did not make it to the range today but will be there tomorrow. This "ain't good." I'll post more as I find it out. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 This is not good ! IPSC really needs to address this issue. My understanding was that the planned some discussions at the GA about this problem. With the matches getting bigger (higher round count) travelling with that amount of ammunition is difficult at best and downright impossible at it's worst. Shipping the stuff is fraught with problems also. I really don't know how they will address this but if a significant number can't shoot the match then it becomes a meaningless competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSeevers Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 I know the 30 bays argument but they should have it here in the US. Heck I would have the ENTIRE European team at my house loading ammo on my 650. The density of Walmarts with cheap .40 ammo and # of 650's in the US is pretty high if you get my drift. They should have sent the ammo earlier too. If it had problems there might be reaction time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 The US ammo was supposed to go out from Miami yesterday but didn't make the flight.. here's hoping for today. If that arrives, then there will be US shooters with 1500+ rounds each, given what I heard on the plane, so they may be able to 'sponsor' another shooter. Protesting a match because you screwed up and your stuff didn't make it??? I need to remember that for next time I forget my holster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 The shooters did not screw up the ammo, some of it was shipped months ago. Those organising the shipment seemed to have dropped the ball. It's sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 The shooters did not screw up the ammo, some of it was shipped months ago. Those organising the shipment seemed to have dropped the ball. It's sad <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I know. I shipped my ammo off months ago but it's not here yet. Even if it never shows up, IMHO it's not a good reason for me to kill everybody else's match that did get theirs. I'll be pissed, but that's not a good reason to piss off everybody else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Suber Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 According to guy from Finland I was talking to in registration, their ammo got held up in Spain. Apparently, Spain changed their laws at the last minute and would not forward any ammo. Others shipped directly to Ecuador (months ago) and someone here dropped the ball. The Armscor ammo is supposed to arrive here at 5:00 am tomorrow morning (we'll see). It seems peope are working things out. Those shooting 38 Supers are the ones who will be SOL if their ammo does not arrive. You just can't find it here. There still is some 40 and 9mm ammo available. The argument about protesting the match is based on whether or not you can "crown" a world champion if all regions/countries could not compete because of a logistical error which was not the competitor's/team's fault. I can see that side of the argument. Trust me, after flying here with my wife and two kids, I don't want to have the match canned. But the argument has merit. The good news is that the pre-match was still underway today and I did not hear anymore talk about protesting. That could change Monday morning if the tournament starts and people still don't have ammo. The stages look fun, though trying to figure out the layout/scheduling is interesting (even for someone from Ecuador). I'll update tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kline Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 Thanks Jack, keep us posted as things go on for those of us who couldnt make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BritinUSA Posted August 19, 2005 Share Posted August 19, 2005 Armscor has a huge stake in this match. Everyone is relying on them and if they fail, they are done. I don't think they will fail. I think the ammo will be there. Have faith... Shoot well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRe Posted August 20, 2005 Share Posted August 20, 2005 Ivan, we're pullin' for ya, bud!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alberto Hart Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 The Armscor ammo container arrived yesterday at 2:00 AM. They were expecting to take it to the range during the morning. That´s all I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Moore Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 this is one of the many reasons i will never shoot a world shoot match outside of the US. will somebody just build a range to handle all the stages and keep it here in the US where the majority of the shooters reside. just venting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alberto Hart Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 One of the reasons that I´m shooting this, is because I like to travel. If the laws are hard worldwide concerning shooting related items, is because the US asked that. The rest of the world is experiencing a dissarming movement after 911, and is being promoted by US on long term estrategical interests. The main advisor for this, is George Soros and his group IANSA (see www.iansa.org ). The container wasn´t waiting at the Ecuadorian port...it was at Miami. So the problem was a US one. If everything is done only in the US, it will be like the Superbowl. A football world championship of a sport played only by americans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 (no edom romuh) Just because the US contingent to the WS is twice the size of any other group, you think that the majority of shooters are from the US. My how provincial of you!. We here in the US should be forever indebted to the shooters of the world that allow us to actually compete against them and even be members of their organization. Why the next thing you'll be saying is that we should have our own rule book! OK, Tongue in cheek mode off. (Read the first line in the parentheses backwards) Sorry could not resist. Yes it would seem that the GA should look very carefully at the local situation and what its level of political stability is before awarding a WS to a particular venue. Yes it is a big undertaking and personally, I doubt that I would ever attend one other than here in the US either. We need to realize that the majority of the people in the world think we are "DANGEROUS PEOPLE" running around with guns the way we do. And in truth, the exposure most of the world gets to gun sports is NONE, what they get is the nightly re-run of COPS either on TV or in person. Anyway, I really hope that the ammo situation is resolved so that the WS goes off. It would be a shame to see all the people that put their hard earned money into travel and time off for what is to many a once in a lifetime event and not be able to shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Norman Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 One of the reasons that I´m shooting this, is because I like to travel.If the laws are hard worldwide concerning shooting related items, is because the US asked that. The rest of the world is experiencing a dissarming movement after 911, and is being promoted by US on long term estrategical interests. The main advisor for this, is George Soros and his group IANSA (see www.iansa.org ). The container wasn´t waiting at the Ecuadorian port...it was at Miami. So the problem was a US one. If everything is done only in the US, it will be like the Superbowl. A football world championship of a sport played only by americans. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Really?! Actually it is the UN that is trying to disarm the world and that AH George Soros is not an American, regardless of whether he has citizenship here or not. He is as anti American and pro George Soros as anyone can be. His last effort was to wreck certain European currencies to his own benefit. He is constantly meddling in our internal politics. Trust me, Most of us here are not concerned if your law-abiding citizenry has guns, we are worried about the towel wearing types that like to learn to fly, but not to land planes. In truth, the real problem is that there are a lot of people out there that are only interested in their own power and in their own brand of freedom, one that generally does not fit into our world view very well. As to the ammo shipment not leaving Miami, I would think that if they had clearance to ship, in other words knew it would be received, it would have gone, It seems likely that the hold up was on the receiving end. No clearance to enter, why spend the money to ship it and have it stuck someplace where it cannot go forward and probably won't get returned either? Jim Norman PS, This really isn't the place for poolitical discussion, iknow, but I have to defend my country. So lets see if we can come up with a solution to the problem, OK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 By the sounds of it, between the new range in Tri-County (Portland-OR) and the range expansion at Albany, OR. We might have the facilities here in Oregon to handle a WS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caspian_45 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 Well the ammo problem would not happen here in the US. Quincy, IL (PASA) has a Firearms wholesale business. Someone with a FFL could buy any and all the ammo the competitors needed. There's a ton of ammo here in the states and easy to get. Unless you just had to have your "home brew", you can get everything you need in country and not have the over priced shippin' costs. The 38 super and such for the open guns wouldn't be a problem either. I think we could round up all the componets to load it. The reloader won't be a problem either. Just stop at any house and ask to use their Dillon press. Ok, maybe not. Some of us could bring our Dillons to the match. You might have to use the "house brand" of powder and bullets. Maybe the "Match" and "Vendor" sponsers could actually "sell" their product to the competitors to use at the match. Now thats a crazy idea. My hat's off to the Armscor people. They have had a tough time with this. But the WS should be held in a country that can support it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerkf Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 There are many stories as to what happened to the container. Some said it made it to Panama but was sent back to Miami. The truth of the matter is that Armscor screwed up but I think they´re trying to make good on it. Let´s not US bash on this forum please!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 The truth of the matter is that Armscor screwed up but I think they´re trying to make good on it. Let´s not US bash on this forum please!!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And this information came from where?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasonub Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 I posted this in the other thread yesterday From Myro Lopez, I just want to say that the ARMSCOR ammo that got held up in Panama is now in Equador! so at 0630 ammo will be at the range Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFD Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 This thread cures me of any desire to ever shoot outside of the US. Too many matches here to deal with this kind of crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alberto Hart Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 I´m not bashing down on the US, I´m saxon too (Irish). Just wanting to say that there`s something else outside your borders, and that also shoots IPSC. I lived in the US for several years, and oftenly go there. Please don´t take it bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shred Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 Even with not having enough ammo in-hand to shoot the match and all the other glitches and snafus, as of now, I´d do it again in a heartbeat. I´m already thinking hard about Indonesia in 3 years and I speak even less of the language there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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