Revolver Specific Skills

[Carmoney]

My #1 suggestion for people struggling with the revolver: Hang onto the gun HARD!!

[D.carden]

My #1 suggestion for people struggling with the revolver: Hang onto the gun HARD!!

+1......a must

I put a few vid's on my site with some descent reloads...

The one titled 'Shooting demo' went to the History Channel folks (guess they didn't like it). At about the :30sec tru 1:00 mark is where the Revo stuff is. There's a solid 'on the move' reload after the plate rack......That can make ALL the difference in the world in a match. Not fumbling with the reload when you need to be some where fast and cover some distance

Oh, and Mike......That is a Pith Helmet on the other vid.......

http://www.youtube.com/user/Dcarden666

Edited March 4, 2010 by D.carden

[RevolverJockey]

I finally shot my first Revo match last Sunday and the two things I walked away thinking I needed to work on were:

1) Counting to six - doesn't matter how good your game plan would be for Limited if you only have 6 rounds.

2) Bottom feeder jokes - no matter how bad you are doing, it is always fun to sit back and watch people scrounging for brass or whine about a $150 mag that fell in the muddy puddle and needs to be cleaned before they continue. ALWAYS squad with another wheelie if you can. I had a blast.

Lee

[Chris Christian]

It is fun. Especially when you start beating some of the bottom feeders that were yawning when you stepped up to LAMR.

Chris Christian

[jjanglin]

Are the two D Cardens related= they both wear funny hats

Jim/Pa

Sailors

[slflr]

Two things that helped me tremendously with a revolver:

1. Don't start pulling the trigger until the sights are on the target.

2. Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires.

Or in other words for 2, never slow down or "stage" the trigger pull.

be

I disagree. If you are not getting on with the trigger work during the transition from target to target, I believe you are wasting time.

[CJDOUBLETAP]

9. "Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires." Do you use the same speed of trigger pull on every shot regardless of difficulty?

I definitely "stage" the trigger for hard shots, and yank it as fast as I can for the close ones.

[No.343]

9. "Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires." Do you use the same speed of trigger pull on every shot regardless of difficulty?

I definitely "stage" the trigger for hard shots, and yank it as fast as I can for the close ones.

That one seems like the hardest concept for me. I'll just worry about the right intensity of front sight focus and forget about the speed for harder shots.

[Matt Griffin]

9. "Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires." Do you use the same speed of trigger pull on every shot regardless of difficulty?

I definitely "stage" the trigger for hard shots, and yank it as fast as I can for the close ones.

That one seems like the hardest concept for me. I'll just worry about the right intensity of front sight focus and forget about the speed for harder shots.

I agree with this, I find that if I'm applying enough focus on the sight picture, my finger naturally slows down to the point where the disturbance is below my tolerance for movement in the front sight.

H.

[Cherryriver]

I don't want to get too carried away with a group self-congratulation thing, but this actually is one of the best, most useful threads I've ever seen on a shooting forum.

Meanwhile, still one other detail to be concerned with comes to mind after our club weeknight practice night. It's half drills and then a couple of stages, on the indoor range.

Co-attending were the usual suspects, including one friend who is very near master in Single Stack, and another who was the Limited Division winner from last year's Wheelgunner's Revenge ICORE match in Michigan.

Single Stack apparently has never even handled a revolver in her whole life. Sometimes I forget that there's a whole big world without cylinders going around.

I was operating my usual IDPA SSR rig in preparation for the IDPA match I'm putting on in a week, so I had my four-inch 586 and solid +P .38 ammunition in Safariland Comp IIIs.

Since we're putting on the club's first-ever ICORE match at this club in May (more later), Limited and I were hounding SS to try the revolver.

They say the best instruction is to instruct. While SS's muzzle control and finger discipline were as flawless as one would expect from a USPSA master (any week now...), I had to show her how to open the gun. Culture shock for both of us, I believe.

Then I had to describe the use of the speedloader and closing the gun, a little description of firing, and stepped back.

She immediately took an excellent firing stance and thumb-cocked the gun.

(Short intermission to begin breathing again after choking session.)

I decocked it and explained a little more- with newbies, of course, we always use dry-fire first to familiarize- but a master..!

Then, after six solid alphas on the stage targets, we came to ejection. I sort of had to point out that, unlike her 1911, revolvers require you to do the ejecting yourself.

Another dainty tap of the Comp III and another round of alphas, and then I got my gun back.

So, while mostly just taking the opportunity to share the vignette, it does serve to point out that a key element of revolver shooting is ejection, a skill alien to auto-loaders. While moonclips take out much of the drama, you still have to be absolutely positive in the ejection phase of the reload or everything else you can do will disappear.

Having a case or clip stalled against the recoil shield or thumblatch is a tie-up worthy of a large set of bad words. In the case of non-moonclipped work, having a lone case tie up the show by falling back into a chamber is a nasty stoppage; if the dang thing gets under the extractor star, it's just plain ugly.

Be consistent and positive in ejection and don't slack off and take it for granted.

Yes, SS is very slightly considering accepting my offer of a six-inch 686 fixed up for ICORE for our match, but no one's holding their breath.

Besides, who wants to get beat with their own gun?

[Chris Christian]

Just a thought... but how did the gal feel about slamming the Comp III into the gun and closing the cylinder to just let the speedloader fall where it may? I have seen a number of new revolver shooters who are looking for some place or pocket to put the empty loader instead of just going back to find it after the COF is over. It's kinda tough for me to tell them "Just let it drop", and actually have it sink in. I sometimes feel like I have left a trail of "bread crumbs" after a USPSA stage.. with all the speedloaders I have to go find (although many squad members will pick them up for you... a very nice touch, and I reciprocate by collecting their magazines after they shoot... I think that's a very nice courtesy that reduces stress on all the shooters...they have enough on their minds during the scoring without worrying about where their gear is). I just wondered how she handled that.

Chris Christian

[Cherryriver]

SS is very fastidious and simply handed the Comp IIIs back to me in the range-officer-position.

I would say trying a gun she had no inkling of how to operate was plenty enough to cope with for the first twelve rounds, so I wasn't looking to introduce match procedures.

Alphas, though. Sheesh. And I haven't even done hardly anything to the action on this gun besides clean it up and knock off the high spots. It's just an ex-police IDPA junker and probably eight-ten pounds of pull.

[Chris Christian]

Cherryriver,

Thanks for the feedback. Just wanted to know. I see a lot of new revolver shooters (and SS certainly would be one) that are quite willing to dump a mag from their familiar semi-auto... but seem to be far more retentive with speedloaders. Can't explain it... just observed it.

Chris Christian

[t0066jh]

Like someone else said. This is one of the best threads I've ever read.

Here's my $.02

How to Shoot A's fast. Practice dry firing holding the sights on the target. Then shoot groups. Learn where the sights need to be to shoot tight groups. Then start shooting them faster, then faster, then faster. Back to slower when they turn into Cs. Now do some math and figure out what % of hits can be C's and not hurt your overall scores too bad.

Practice reloads standing over your bed. 2 shots on target, reload, repeat until your moonclip pouches are empty. Time it again and again. Try slow then faster and faster until the fumble factor kicks in. Back off and that's your speed for now. Now do it with your eyes closed.

Learn to pull moons from your holders from right to left or left to right or whatever works best. You should never reach down to find an empty moonclip holder and the full one next to it.

[AzShooter]

Try and find "YOU CAN'T MISS" by John Shaw. In the early days he wrote the book that gave me the most help for shooting a revolver at matches.

Also get "FAST AND FANCY REVOLVER SHOOTING" Ed Migivern

What you learn in Brian's book will help you with your revolver shooting and Mental Control, Something you must learn to be able to shoot well.

[GMM50]

Hi:

I've been at this for 10+ yrs now. Just an average shooter. I don't practice enough!!

I shoot USPSA, pins, plates and just recently ICORE. Leaving ICORE matches out of this discussion.....

I just recently decided that time was my weakest area. USPSA scoring has score/time. And plates and pins are 100% time if you never miss.

I switched to minor power factor. It let's me concentrate on all the previously mentioned items and improving my speed.

With the less power I can more easily recognize my faults. And more easily correct them.

I also agree that grip is probably first on the list. Then trigger control.

Good Luck.

George

[jhgtyre]

I like this topic. It has some info that many will find useful so I am pinning it.

-ld

[benos]

Two things that helped me tremendously with a revolver:

1. Don't start pulling the trigger until the sights are on the target.

2. Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires.

Or in other words for 2, never slow down or "stage" the trigger pull.

be

Wouldn't number one slow you down? I pull the trigger while I'm transitioning to the next target, so when the sights arrive there I don't have to spend that extra bit of time pulling the trigger... If that makes any sense...

Haha, then again, I'm not a GM.

Sorry for the delay (and the confusion), just saw this.

When I typed:

1. Don't start pulling the trigger until the sights are on the target.

I was thinking of the epiphany I had while practicing for the Bianchi Cup, relating to the draw and first shot as opposed to transitions. I learned that I actually fired the first shot faster, and more accurately if I didn't start pulling the trigger until the dot was where I wanted the bullet to go. I realized two movements, the draw and the trigger pull, each done deliberately, worked out better and quicker than doing both of them at the same time.

For a speed shoot / transition course, I would still do that for the first shot. But I would be pulling the trigger while transitioning. But No. 2 still would heavily apply.

be

[benos]

9. "Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires." Do you use the same speed of trigger pull on every shot regardless of difficulty?

No. The trigger pull speed will vary due to the distance of the target or the difficulty of the shot.

be

[benos]

9. "Once you start pulling the trigger, do not vary your pull speed until the gun fires." Do you use the same speed of trigger pull on every shot regardless of difficulty?

I definitely "stage" the trigger for hard shots, and yank it as fast as I can for the close ones.

That one seems like the hardest concept for me. I'll just worry about the right intensity of front sight focus and forget about the speed for harder shots.

I agree with this, I find that if I'm applying enough focus on the sight picture, my finger naturally slows down to the point where the disturbance is below my tolerance for movement in the front sight.

H.

Please see later post above clarifying my initial confusion causing post.

be

[Bubber]

OKCICORE and I were discussing some of the issues we had shooting both the Dot and Iron sights. The issue was discussed in the "Book" (Brian's Beyound Fundamentals). When shooting iron sights you should look at your sights and be aware of the target. When using Optics you should look at the target and be aware of the dot. I am relearning this as I am shooting retro for both ICORE and USPSA. (no division just using speedloaders). When the targets are close and open I look at the target and am aware of my hits. But as the targets get further out I "SHOULD" transition back to the sights. If the stage is all close or far targets I do not have a problem but when they mix them up scores go down. IT all comes back to the "Book" about seeing what you need to see and different focus requirements. Place close attention to the "Book" as there will be a test and your scores will be posted....After the match.. Just some scnacks for thought. later rdd

[coldchar]

I have two comments that I would like to make on this topic. First is that starting the trigger pull before sights are aligned on a target can be a good thing. The challenge is that you have to be comfortable with when the shot breaks. The sights should come into alignment just before the shot breaks. Too early or too late and of course the shot does not go where you want. Just as people suggest that reloads should be made on the move, starting the trigger pull before the sights align on the next target can save you time.

The second thing I would suggest is to engage targets as you see them. This may sound like something everyone does, but I have found that this is not the case. Many shooters will only engage targets out to a particular distance, if they can engage the further targets at another point in the stage. If you engage all targets that you can shoot from multiple positions when you first see them, you always have the option of engaging them again if necessary. If you get good shots on them the first time you can pass them by later.

neither of these comments may be "general wisdom", but they are options that I like.

Agree on shooting them from where you can see them, but with one caveat. Don't be caught flat footed reloading when you could be moving toward a better position during the reload.

[Brewski]

Don't miss

[Forrest Halley]

Things I learned from people that are smarter and better than I:

1. Trust your sights. You don't have to be super crisp to get the job done. (John Zaczek Sr.)

2. It's just as accurate as the auto next in line. Believe in the gun and the trigger.

3. The cylinder must never stop moving after the draw until you are ready to ULSC. There is just too much travel in the trigger over other designs to allow this to not happen. That means trigger should be taken up as sights are aligning and during transitions. (Miculek)

4. Smooth reloads are better than fast or slow reloads and should be taken while moving if you can. The reloads don't have to be completed in a set time, just get it done before you reach the next position. (Bob Perdue) If there are more than six targets in the next array leave whatever is in the gun in the gun when you leave the present array. You have a standing reload no matter what so why leave perfectly good bullets on the ground? The only exception I give to this is if there is steel then I would go in full to avoid a second standing reload should I fail to do my part.

5. Don't Miss treat everything as Virginia Count. Seriously at 2 seconds and change or more a recharge bullet use efficiency is a must. COMMON SENSE

6. The number of rounds in your cylinder that count for score in most games. The subsequent series of clicks are very cool and very useless. ALSO COMMON SENSE but often difficult to remember if you get sidetracked by a light strike or bobbled reload.

[JFlowers]

Shooting ICORE occasionally will definitely help your USPSA game. Where a fast C might be worth more than a slow A in USPSA, in ICORE the A is always going to win. So the ICORE match now and then will force you to be more accurate and less fast. This really help when you go back to USPSA and can make those hard tight shots easily and confidently.