bernt Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 I have been playing with an interesting (if not very competitive idea). I am thinking about buying a p7m13 with a threaded barrel and mounting a short, effective comp on it. I have also been wondering if I could mount a small scope (i.e docter) preferably on the frame (as the barrel is fixed on the frame). It is gas operated however, and I do not know how using a compensater would effect cycling. A gunsmith told me it would, but to me it sounds illogical as the compensator only affects exess gas which would normally be expelled from the barrel (i can see point with barrel porting however). I am also thinking about having the internals of the P7 polished and the grip safety made a bit lighter. Anyone know anyone who have done some customizing on p7s? Compensating etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 It might be a good gunsmith exercise, but forget it for an open gun. Capacity and reloading would both kill you in competition. My .02 worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eerw Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 It was done a long time ago by Bruce Gray...back before STI and SV..built in 9mm major on a p7m13 I can remember a short conversation about it with Bruce and in short he said a lot of work ..I think Boland did a 1911 conversion where he reversed the rails, redid the trigger linkage and rewelded the frame to take p7m13 mags too.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sixgun Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Sounds interesting, but wouldn't the gun get too hot from shooting long strings? I thought that the P7 design used gas to cycle gun, thus physically warming the frame. I've seen guys at the range stop shooting them, and put them down to cool. Ray C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrett Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 The gun should run just fine with a comp. I forget, is the P7 series actually gas-operated (like an AR15), or is it gas-retarded (chamber won't open until gas pressure drops)? A comp will increase your back gas pressure. If it is gas operated, it will cycle harder. I don't know what effect it would have on a gas retarded set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehli Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Would be a pretty cool Steel Challenge gun, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 gorilla Have you ever owned or shot a P7M13? The grip is pretty big and I have big hands. Then there is that damned squeeze cocker lever on the front strap. Steel Challenge is all about time, and the first time you miss your grip due to that damned squeeze cocker you'd throw the pistol over the berm. Not good for SC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bernt Posted September 17, 2003 Author Share Posted September 17, 2003 The mechanism is gas retarded blowback if I am not mistaken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpolans Posted September 25, 2003 Share Posted September 25, 2003 It's been done before, so I know it'll work. There were a couple people in Germany that were shooting them with compensators that must have been a couple inches long on them. But really, I don't see the sense in it. You're going to take a gun that's fantastically expensive in stock configuration and isn't well suited for IPSC (mag release position, squeeze-cocker, etc.) and spend good money on trying to make it work. Sorta like hammering a square peg through a round hole, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted September 27, 2003 Share Posted September 27, 2003 I own a P7M13 and my gunsmith is a guy who has done quite some customizations to M13s. It is a very accurate gun. That's a fact. You can put a comp on the gun without any problems. It will not effect cycling as the gun is gas retarded. I am with tightloop and mpolans on this one though. IF you can handle the gun fast enough (which would include drawing it from a decent holster, which is hard to find), capacity is going to be a pain. The gun also has some weak parts, like the drop safety catch/spring. Now every gun has its weak parts, but every part on the P7 is expensive. A drop safety catch will cost you approx. $90. Problem with that part being weak is that it will hold you from dry firing it a lot. I love the egineering originality behind the P7, but I hate the fact that I can't dry-fire it all day long. My advice would be to get another kind of gun for the job, unless you really want it and have a boatload of cash to blow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Carter Posted September 29, 2003 Share Posted September 29, 2003 The front area of the trigger guard get's really hot when you shoot them alot. I did a class for a bunch of guys that carried P7's and we had to have 2 guns for each so we could keep shooting. They are super reliable and easy to shoot though, a lot of the guns were missing their extractors and still worked 100%. Bruce Gray is the man to see, he's done comp P7's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheQuietMan Posted October 14, 2003 Share Posted October 14, 2003 I have seen the gun. The comp actually pushes the gun down and you have to bring it back up to fire again. They tried to extend the mag to hold more than 13, but it couldn't work. Slide moving too fast and mag spring too weak at full extension. I haven't seen the guy in over a year and I can't remember his name. His gun, I remember. He used to shoot with us at Downeast Practical Shooters in NC. We had some double takes on the double tap head shots we used to take with our P7's. Cloverleafs always. 1911 guys didn't know what to say. You might be able to make contact at the P7 Cult at Park Cities Tactical. Someone there might know him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtypool40 Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 Interesting "paper tiger" to play what if with, but damn, that is a steep hill you are looking to ice skate up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SharonAnne9x23 Posted October 25, 2003 Share Posted October 25, 2003 Bruce Grey in california did some very interesting things with P7s. try to find him SharonAnne L2387 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 Just re-read an article in frontsight (April 2005) - A Dr. Michael Racano submited pictures of his Open P7M13. Appears he may be in Florida but has not shot any classifiers this year. Just curious if any one may be in contact with him. Would like to find out little more detail on his equipment - curious on what holster he uses. Thanx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianH Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 Would be a pretty cool Steel Challenge gun, no? Angelo Spagnoli shot the Gray/Boland gun at the SC for a couple of years way back when. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric nielsen Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 Bruce Gray shot his before the original ban on 9x19 Major. Back then having, 13+1 meant you could shoot 4 arrays of 6 shots each with only one running reload. 13+1 isn't Hi Capacity in our sport any more, you need more like 17+1. If you're wanting to have the Way-Coolest Gun at the Match, a red-dot compensated HK squeeze-cocker would pretty much win that title every time. But you'll be mag-changing on every array. Make sure you shoot JHP bullets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwx40x40 Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 If it's the gas gun part that interest you try www.ncggasgun.com they have a pretty cool gas gun conversion for 1911's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear23 Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 The mechanism is gas retarded blowback if I am not mistaken. Hey, lets not use labels here OK? It's development challenged. It would be a neat gun to see in this configuration. Expensive too do though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L9X25 Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 Dr. Racano commutes between Germany and Switzerland and only comes to Tampa, Florida to visit family every year or two. When he comes to town we will usually kidnap him and force him to shoot the Florida Open or State match with us. I know that he still has the Open P7 (almost impossible to sell or trade anything with those crazy laws) and have/had pictures of it that he had sent me. I will forward this thread to him and see if he will respond directly. Leo Just re-read an article in frontsight (April 2005) - A Dr. Michael Racano submited pictures of his Open P7M13. Appears he may be in Florida but has not shot any classifiers this year. Just curious if any one may be in contact with him. Would like to find out little more detail on his equipment - curious on what holster he uses. Thanx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 (edited) Leo Many Thanx Edited October 16, 2006 by Clyde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgtsvi Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 I use to have a P7 and thought it was pretty cool. The two things I didnt like was the frame would get so damn hot you couldnt hardly hold it after a couple of mags at rapid fire. The second problem I faced was HK's customer service sucks. Unless you are a military contract they dont have the time of day for you. I need a new extractor for my HK4 and received it about 4 months after I sold the gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 The P7 is a very cool pistol...I have one,but trying to make a P13 into an Open blaster is like trying toget a team of prairie dogs to pull a covered wagon up Pikes Peak... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 (edited) The P7 is a very cool pistol...I have one,but trying to make a P13 into an Open blaster is like trying toget a team of prairie dogs to pull a covered wagon up Pikes Peak... Well I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express Once Needless to say it's not about having an Open gun it's about having a P7 Space Gun. (For me) Proud member of "The Cult of the P7" Ok what do I have to feed these Prairie Dogs Edited October 17, 2006 by Clyde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZGunut Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Hi everyone, I have one such gun. It was built by Jim Boland and Bruce Gray (The gun is only marked with Bolands stamp, but he and Bruce shared the same shop space for a while in So Cal back in the day) It is a very cool gun, has one of Jim's Carberator Comps and mag well, checkered back and squeezecocker on the front strap a Bar-Sto standard rifled barrel a custom scope mount, Bo-mars, overtravel stop, etc. If anyone can host the pics, I would be happy to e-mail them to you to see. I also have a P7M8 that Bruce built as a carry gun as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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