Ben Stoeger

[gohuskers]

Way to go Ben. Congrats on everything!

[redbird1976]

Congrats, Ben. Good Luck in Greece

[Ben Stoeger]

The US Production Team CRUSHED this match. I can't wait to get home.

[Sherwyn]

GREAT JOB Ben

Sherwyn

The US Production Team CRUSHED this match. I can't wait to get home.

[Ben Stoeger]

I am headed back home today.. I should get back to the states in the middle of the day tomorrow.

I learned a lot at the World Shoot about how to train for these types of events. I had a dog shit match... and I feel I can only do better next time.

I really am looking towards more training now.

I will post lots more details and video when I get home.

[92fs]

I am headed back home today.. I should get back to the states in the middle of the day tomorrow.

I learned a lot at the World Shoot about how to train for these types of events. I had a dog shit match... and I feel I can only do better next time.

I really am looking towards more training now.

I will post lots more details and video when I get home.

Awsome job Ben! I tried to follow the scores on the IPSC wold website but, I couldn't even find your name on several of the stages. I wouldn't call second at the world shoot dog shit but, no one knows how you perfomred better than you. You have had one hell of a season. I cant wait watch what you accomplish next year.

Edited October 10, 2011 by 92fs

[Ben Stoeger]

My first World Championships!

Ok.. I am back from my very first World Shoot. I (as usual) have some thoughts on it.

Firstly, international travel with a gun has it’s pitfalls, but it really was not as bad as I thought it would be. I am happy to report that everything seemed to work out fine with it. From what the other guys told me, Greece is the worst country for traveling to with a gun that they had tried, and it was still doable.

The location was awesome! The weather was the best I have ever experienced in my life. It was 75 or so at night and 80 during the day. The water in the Sea was warm and I really enjoyed swimming.

The stages in the match were different from the US. There was very little running and gunning. There were 53 moving targets in the match (way more than in the US). One stage had 5 swingers in it! There were however fewer tight shots and fewer No Shoot targets to contend with. The biggest thing I noticed is that you very rarely got to stand and shoot. There was always a hitch to the stage. Usually it was a tight position or something like that, but almost as often you needed to load your gun or deal with a prop in some way.

I liked the stages, but they were different. I wasn’t really very well prepared for them. I have mostly been practicing at being super accurate, and not so much at dicking around with props and such.

Here is my match video. I didn’t get video of all the stages, sorry about that, but you should get an idea of the flavor of it from the video I did get.

For those that don’t know, in IPSC they don’t let you on to the stage except during the walkthrough. At this particular match, you were given 3 minutes to look at the stage. My squad had 17 people on it, so things were pretty crowded. I really do not understand why they have this sort of system. It really made a difference if you had to go first on a complicated stage. That person really didn’t have much preparation or visualization time at all. To be totally honest it is unfair. I hope that rule gets changed.

I did also notice that some stages changed partway through the match. Stage 19 had some No Shoot targets added. Stage 21 never really seemed to work consistently. (more on that in a bit) Stage 28 had the length of some ropes you needed to pull change during the match. It actually affected the way people shot the stage. Some guys hooked the ropes onto a door knob, but later competitors weren’t able to.

Stage 21 is a stage that had a sliding thing with 3 targets on it. I heard from Robbie that just before he got up to shoot the stage, the RO’s did something to the slider to “fix” it. When he shot, it appeared much faster than for other people. He had to shoot the moving targets really fast, and dropped a bunch of points as a result. He argued for and got a reshoot because the prop didn’t work the same for him.

I got up to shoot that stage the day after I heard about it from Rob. Matt Mink shot the stage just before me, and the sliding target didn’t work at all for him. He got stopped and was moved down the stack to do a reshoot. The RO went up and “fixed” the slider. I got up to shoot and shot the same target sequence as everyone else in my squad had. People would activate the slider, then move, then shoot some targets, then wait, then the slider would come out. When I shot, I swung to the slider to find that it was already half way down. I had to shoot crazy on it, and dropped a ton of points. I asked for a reshoot, and then was told I had to talk to the range master. A half hour later, he hadn’t shown up.. I gave up, signed my score sheet and moved on to the next stage. Irritating! That is the second stage shown on my video, if you are curious about it.

One other thing I took issue with was the behavior of many of the other competitors. Things sure are different than in the US! I saw MANY targets getting pulled so guys could try and get a double. I even saw 25 yard swingers with one D hit get pulled. It was nuts! At the US Nationals you would get kicked in the balls for pulling stuff like that.

Eric G even biffed up one stage, then arbed the stage and actually got it tossed. (The stage had not been run consistently). In the US, that would be considered a pretty lame thing to do, but in IPSC it was cool I guess. It was just a bizarre set of ethics over there.

Overall, I am glad I went. I really learned what I need to start training for. I am going to come into next year a lot stronger, no doubt about that! Frustrations at the World Shoot aside, the stages were cool and the props were awesome. I am looking forward to the next one!

[justaute]

Thanks very much for the narrative. This helps me better understand the context of various stages I see on youtube. Congrats on your 2nd place finish (I know you are not that happy about it).

[Ben Stoeger]

Thanks very much for the narrative. This helps me better understand the context of various stages I see on youtube. Congrats on your 2nd place finish (I know you are not that happy about it).

1st or 31st doesn't really matter... I don't like not shooting my best. I just want to learn from the stuff I was not able to do well at the match.

[wurm]

You can be unhappy at your shooting all you want. We are all proud of you. You and the rest of Team USA kicked some serious butt!

So what's the plan now? Are you jumping right back into training or are you taking some time off?

[mhop]

I did also notice that some stages changed partway through the match. Stage 19 had some No Shoot targets added. Stage 21 never really seemed to work consistently. (more on that in a bit) Stage 28 had the length of some ropes you needed to pull change during the match. It actually affected the way people shot the stage. Some guys hooked the ropes onto a door knob, but later competitors weren't able to.

Stage 21 is a stage that had a sliding thing with 3 targets on it. I heard from Robbie that just before he got up to shoot the stage, the RO's did something to the slider to "fix" it. When he shot, it appeared much faster than for other people. He had to shoot the moving targets really fast, and dropped a bunch of points as a result. He argued for and got a reshoot because the prop didn't work the same for him.

I got up to shoot that stage the day after I heard about it from Rob. Matt Mink shot the stage just before me, and the sliding target didn't work at all for him. He got stopped and was moved down the stack to do a reshoot. The RO went up and "fixed" the slider. I got up to shoot and shot the same target sequence as everyone else in my squad had. People would activate the slider, then move, then shoot some targets, then wait, then the slider would come out. When I shot, I swung to the slider to find that it was already half way down. I had to shoot crazy on it, and dropped a ton of points. I asked for a reshoot, and then was told I had to talk to the range master. A half hour later, he hadn't shown up.. I gave up, signed my score sheet and moved on to the next stage. Irritating! That is the second stage shown on my video, if you are curious about it.

One other thing I took issue with was the behavior of many of the other competitors. Things sure are different than in the US! I saw MANY targets getting pulled so guys could try and get a double. I even saw 25 yard swingers with one D hit get pulled. It was nuts! At the US Nationals you would get kicked in the balls for pulling stuff like that.

Eric G even biffed up one stage, then arbed the stage and actually got it tossed. (The stage had not been run consistently). In the US, that would be considered a pretty lame thing to do, but in IPSC it was cool I guess. It was just a bizarre set of ethics over there.

Overall, I am glad I went. I really learned what I need to start training for. I am going to come into next year a lot stronger, no doubt about that! Frustrations at the World Shoot aside, the stages were cool and the props were awesome. I am looking forward to the next one!

so foreign competitors don't have any class and ipsc leaders favor certain competitors

Edited October 14, 2011 by mhop

[TimAustinTX]

Congrats on your National and World results.

Tim

[justaute]

Understood. Believe me, if you knew me, you would know why.

Thanks very much for the narrative. This helps me better understand the context of various stages I see on youtube. Congrats on your 2nd place finish (I know you are not that happy about it).

1st or 31st doesn't really matter... I don't like not shooting my best. I just want to learn from the stuff I was not able to do well at the match.

[beltjones]

In the words of certain IPSC czars, "Everything you are saying is a giant lie because you didn't arbitrate it."

In reality, I'm glad you went and represented us so well. 2nd in the world is no small feat, but even if you don't regard it as a shooting performance worthy of your normal abilities, at least you showed true class and sportsmanship. There is way more merit in having your best day as a sportsman than having your best day as a shooter.

[Ben Stoeger]

so foreign competitors don't have any class and ipsc leaders favor certain competitors

I am reporting what I saw... feel free to draw your own conclusions.

As far as guys trying to get reshoots and doubles goes... The Production team actually pulled one of the Czech guys aside. We noticed that after he bombed a stage out, he didn’t try to get a reshoot or anything. He just shook his head and walked away. We complimented him on his sportsmanship. That is how prevalent the poor sportsmanship was… we actually felt the need to give a guy a pat on the back because of what he DIDN’T do.

[Ben Stoeger]

In the words of certain IPSC czars, "Everything you are saying is a giant lie because you didn't arbitrate it."

In reality, I'm glad you went and represented us so well. 2nd in the world is no small feat, but even if you don't regard it as a shooting performance worthy of your normal abilities, at least you showed true class and sportsmanship. There is way more merit in having your best day as a sportsman than having your best day as a shooter.

Yes... It was clear to me at the match that the guys in charge don't think about things the same way I do. They had a 35 euro a plate awards dinner. They had an opening ceremony in a centuries old coliseum. All of that is very nice, but it isn’t important like making sure the stages are consistent. That is my view anyway.

Vince Pinto made it pretty clear on the Global Village that he doesn’t like this sort of criticism. That pretty much guarantees that I am going to post about it here and on my own website. =)

I know that we represented well as far as sportsmanship goes, the problem is that I don’t think anyone really cared. I didn’t hear too many people complaining about Eric’s behavior… Like I said, the standards are just different for a lot of guys.

[euxx]

Ben, thanks for your match review. Many of us who didn't go there can onl share your frustrations.

One thing though, you generalized an IPSC World Shoot as a representation of all IPSC matches. Surely, some matches in Europe run large squads and have a short walktrough time, but there is lot of matches with more friendly athmosphere. I hope you could travel more to IPSC matches abroad and we will hear more good words about your experience.

[Dan Hefta]

Ben, I am happy that you made it back safe and sound. What an experience you had, thanks for sharing. US Production CHAMP!!! :bow:

[beltjones]

In the words of certain IPSC czars, "Everything you are saying is a giant lie because you didn't arbitrate it."

In reality, I'm glad you went and represented us so well. 2nd in the world is no small feat, but even if you don't regard it as a shooting performance worthy of your normal abilities, at least you showed true class and sportsmanship. There is way more merit in having your best day as a sportsman than having your best day as a shooter.

Yes... It was clear to me at the match that the guys in charge don't think about things the same way I do. They had a 35 euro a plate awards dinner. They had an opening ceremony in a centuries old coliseum. All of that is very nice, but it isn’t important like making sure the stages are consistent. That is my view anyway.

Vince Pinto made it pretty clear on the Global Village that he doesn’t like this sort of criticism. That pretty much guarantees that I am going to post about it here and on my own website. =)

I know that we represented well as far as sportsmanship goes, the problem is that I don’t think anyone really cared. I didn’t hear too many people complaining about Eric’s behavior… Like I said, the standards are just different for a lot of guys.

The great irony is that the standard response when those of us in "the peanut gallery" (their words, not mine) complain about the lack of video, score updates, ANYTHING from the match is that their number one priority is running the match for the competitors. It seems like consistent stage execution is one of the most important thing in terms of running the match for the competitors.

I'm sorry if your fellow shooters were not impressed by the show of sportsmanship by the US Production Team. Rest assured that we care. The point of integrity is that you do what is right regardless of what others are doing, and whether anyone else notices or not. Sincerely, thanks to you and the rest of the team for conducting yourselves with integrity.

[Ben Stoeger]

So what's the plan now? Are you jumping right back into training or are you taking some time off?

More training! Always more trainng....

[Ben Stoeger]

Ben, thanks for your match review. Many of us who didn't go there can onl share your frustrations.

One thing though, you generalized an IPSC World Shoot as a representation of all IPSC matches. Surely, some matches in Europe run large squads and have a short walktrough time, but there is lot of matches with more friendly athmosphere. I hope you could travel more to IPSC matches abroad and we will hear more good words about your experience.

I would love to shoot more matches further from home. If I ever get the money, I will.

[euxx]

Btw there is quite a lot of matches south of the border all year round and few more north of the border at the Summer season. That should be cheaper then going to Europe.

[Ben Stoeger]

Btw there is quite a lot of matches south of the border all year round and few more north of the border at the Summer season. That should be cheaper then going to Europe.

Well... That is true... but my budget is aleady maxed out with a few section/area matches and then Nationals. I can shoot pretty much everything in driving distance then fly to Nats... I am tapped out after that.

[92fs]

Btw there is quite a lot of matches south of the border all year round and few more north of the border at the Summer season. That should be cheaper then going to Europe.

Well... That is true... but my budget is aleady maxed out with a few section/area matches and then Nationals. I can shoot pretty much everything in driving distance then fly to Nats... I am tapped out after that.

Well Ben,

With what you have accomplished this year, I would think that Some sponser would want to step in and help offset the costs. You have gotten where you are on your own but, maybe it's time for some corpoate cash to come your way. I don't know of anyone elses at your level, sooting the nationals in an all black jersey.

[Ben Stoeger]

Btw there is quite a lot of matches south of the border all year round and few more north of the border at the Summer season. That should be cheaper then going to Europe.

Well... That is true... but my budget is aleady maxed out with a few section/area matches and then Nationals. I can shoot pretty much everything in driving distance then fly to Nats... I am tapped out after that.

Well Ben,

With what you have accomplished this year, I would think that Some sponser would want to step in and help offset the costs. You have gotten where you are on your own but, maybe it's time for some corpoate cash to come your way. I don't know of anyone elses at your level, sooting the nationals in an all black jersey.

The lone gunman, one man army, me vs the world thing is working pretty well for me. I have decided not to seek sponsorship. (not beyond the bullets and gear that I currently get)