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Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!


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About euxx

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    Beyond it All

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    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
  • Real Name
    Eugene Kuleshov

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  1. euxx

    Contact for Practiscore

    Overall for both HF and "timeplus points" scoring is based on the sum of points from individual stages
  2. If we follow your logic - no official time could be used for arbitration, because it came from a sound recording device. I don't know where that idea of 3rd party recordings came from. For the whole time I was referring to time as recorded by official timer used at the stage and even shown an example of such recording in the official scores review:
  3. o one is suggesting that arbitration committee won't be listening to ROs story. But it is not any different from RO looking at the timer while standing in the middle of the stage on a clock. We are back to the same point that you trust RO who might or might not heard all the shots right, vs. timing device that might not have recorded all shots. Personally I have more faith in the timer than RO. Looking at the entire shot sequence recorded by an official timing device you can see certain patterns - cadence, time between splits, times for reloads/movements/change of position. Now hypothetically, shooters moves into position, shoots an array of 4 targets with 2 rounds each and moves to another position. RO were staying at the same spot for an entire sequence and he says shooter shots 9 rounds from that position, yet timers shows splits like this for the above sequence: ... 2.5 0.2 0.3 0.2 0.3 0.2 0.3 0.3 4.2 ... Are you still taking an ROs work on that 9th shot that doesn't show up in the recording? Now we are talking RO techniques. But if you think about it, even without watching timer you can came to the same conclusion after looking at the recorded final shot time sequence like ... 0.15 0.15 0.15 2.0. But the last part of your statement is a rule interpretations. To me, as long as recorded time comes from an official device, it is no different from the stage RO looking at a previous or second last shot in the timer after "if clear hammer down and holster" command at the end of the stage. I suppose you can request NROID comment on that to get an official position.
  4. I never said all shots must be recorded. But I did say that all shots that were recorded should be saved as recorded and available for reviewing by the match officials and competitors. Not all stage designs have that issue with competitor positioning or movement you been referring to and in my experience both as an RO who worked several National championships and bunch of Level 3s and as a competitor who shot bunch of National and several World shoots, I've seen it all, good and bad from both sides of the fence and in many cases it was pretty much ended with he say she say...
  5. Last shot counts for score, but this rule doesn't say that the only last shot must be recorded and it doesn't say that no other shouts must not be recorded. As I said, keeping of recording everything in between start and stop, provides better *official* evidence to help make better decisions by RO, CRO, RM and Arbitration committee. Unless, of course, you are deliberately defending current situation when such evidence is thrown away.
  6. Did you take the infamous USPSA RO issue seriously from couple years back? Ironically video evidence had been used to kick him out. Having an official timer device with complete recording of competitor's times would have prevented it from the beginning. Back in a day, they used stop-watches to record stage times and also didn't see that as a real issue...
  7. Which timer exactly are you referring to? Just so, I can put it into my list of not-to-use timers...
  8. Since you're going on a leap with calling timer an audio recording device, I'm going to quote 9.10.1 9.10 Official Time 9.10.1 Only the timing device operated by a Range Officer must be used to record the official elapsed time of a competitor’s attempt at a course of fire. If a timing device is faulty, a competitor whose attempt cannot be credited with an accurate time will be required to reshoot the stage.
  9. You don't have to. But, unlike before, the arbitration committee (or CRO, or RM) can review data to see if it can back ROs story and make decision based on an existing evidence.
  10. Didn't you guys just said "most your timers" can't pickup shots correctly (missing shots, picking up their own beeps, etc), yet you trust them. Basically you are making assumptions because you don't know any better and timer is not letting you know or making it too hard or to long to get better idea or ROs not bothering to check it because they have other things to do at the stage. And after RO pushed a button all evidence is gone. How can you trust that those timers didn't picked up that last shot extra 10 times? But as soon as I showed you more data - you immediately started to look for discrepancies... The full shot recording allows for such analysis after the fact and decisions can be made with more data than just ROs word that he captured time accurately. In my observations many, many of the ROs don't bother to look at the timer or holding it away from the shooter, so no, I can't say 99.999% ROs are trustworthy. See! You already looking at the timer's ALL recorded shots (recorded and saved a week ago), vs taking an ROs word for it.
  11. Now it is making you think and just recently it been said we should trust RO's word more than any timer's recording. How do you know all other timers are correct? Especially ones picking up their own beep... PS: you need to re-read a glossary definition of AD in the rule book, before you try to hand a DQ on someone
  12. Same data you can see on another screenshot. As recorded in the timer.
  13. Time line of two (or more) shooters compared time by number of shots. I find this chart very handy in practice, as well as comparing with my buddy at the matches. The comparison part is not related to this topic, but the time chart show real good when not all shots are recorded, as well as when RO bumps timer to things after shooting is done.
  14. Your first and last sentences are contradictory. Wouldn't "a qualified RO" have to look at the timer and recorded shots? Now the difference I'm talking about - RO looked at the timer and erased all records, vs. records of all shots (ac captured) are staying on record for arbitration committee to review. So, you trust a human, more than a timer? Just recently it been admitted that all humans are making mistakes. Perhaps it is about time to throw away those untrustworthy "many timers" of yours and start using some timers you can actually trust.