Buying Cars

[EricW]

I hate buying new cars. I hate buying cars so much that I drive them completely into the ground until they're coming apart at the seams. I don't think I'm saving money. I'm doing it to avoid anger. I'm to the point that I have no choice but to buy a new car. I can't get to work on time, and apparently, that's a problem. I've been fighting cars non-stop for the last month. I spend every night working on my old suburban in the vain hope that it will be reliable again. (It won't.) At the end of it, I've dropped nearly a grand and haven't got jack shit done for over three weeks including shipping orders.

I hate the price of cars. It's insane. I thought spending $15K on my '93 Subaru was ridiculously opulent at the time, but it was the cheapest thing I could find that fit my life. Prices today? Holy crap! 25 G's don't buy much...

And the technology SUCKS now! I haven't looked at a car for 14 years (that's right, I drove my car for 14 years). My Subaru got 28 MPG new. It has a 1.8L engine which gave very nice acceleration because the car was light. AND....it was 4WD. It was so peppy that people thought I had a V-6. Only time I had to take it to the shop is when I got in an accident. Tune ups cost $20 and took 20 minutes if I paused to drink a beer.

Well...fast forward to 2008. Cars cost more and they're WORSE. You'd be hard pressed to find anything but a hybrid that gets over 30MPG and most get in the low to mid 20's. How the F*** did the car companies manage to make their stuff worse over the last decade and a half? Computers got way faster and way cheaper. Airliners got much less expensive to fly. Cancer treatment made huge strides. Cell phones went from the size of toasters to postage stamps.

But cars...cars got crappier.

I know why: car reviewers. I now hate car writers like I loathe politicians, telemarketers, and televangelists. The whiny little turds. First they bitch that the cars don't accelerate. Bullshit. Mine worked fine. (Nobody needs to go 0-60 in 3 milliseconds anyway. Just chill out and merge *behind*, dammit.) So the car companies dump the great performing sub-2L engines and put huge-ass V-6's in go-carts. Now guess what they bitch about? Mileage. Has the concept of "mutually exclusive alternatives" simply evaporated from the educational system? Freakin' morons.... Don't get me started on the goofy-ass option packages that got put together to keep these nutcases from griping in the trade rags.

For the love of God, even France makes a better car. They get 40+ MPG, don't need keys to start, and have diesels that are just torquier than all hell. That's in FRANCE!! I won't be importing a Peugeot any time soon, but it's a damned sad state of affairs when we're playing second fiddle to France in a field of endeavor besides making stinky cheese.

And worst of all, at the end of the day, it's cheapest to buy a car brand-new because of all the clueless retards that can't do arithmetic. You see it all the time. The same car that's a year old with 10-20K on it and they want a couple grand more than new. I don't care if you can dicker it down a couple K, once you amortize it out, the cost per year is actually more over time for a used car now. That was *not* the case when I was a kid. These cars must be going to the customers that bought all the $500K->$1M houses with adjustable mortgages that are now firesale-ing their homes on Craig's List. (If you're smart enough to make enough ching to buy a $1M house, be smart enough to read the fine print, dumbass.)

Most of all, I hate sunk costs, and that's all a car is. It's not an asset. It's money down a rathole.

Cars. Car dealers. Car companies. Car reviewers. Stupid customers.

I hate you all.

Edited December 31, 2007 by EricW

[GentlemanJim]

Man...dont pop your o-ring Buddy

Relax and shop around...I have bought several cars and trucks at GSA auctions pretty cheap for late model stuff.

The big problem is that new cars are disposable...not worth the cash to upkeep or restore.

For a fraction of the cost of a new truck..a good shop could revamp your old suburban...good as new

Examine your options

Best of luck!

Jim

[frenchwrench]

Used Honda Accord 2001 40,000 miles 5800.00. Buy it. It will run for the next 15 years. Just add oil and rubber as needed. But don't buy anything newer because they're not made as well and won't last as long. They also get worse gas mileage, mine gets 30 in the city. The new ones get 28. Wierd

[Merlin Orr]

ROTFFLMAO........

But...I am not laughing at you. I am laughing with you.. no wait...your not laughing... OK..I'm laughing to keep from crying as I realize I am getting close to that point also...

Excellent rant!

[BritinUSA]

My Dad has a citroen in UK. It's a diesel that gets about 60mpg and higher on the motorways. Europe is way ahead of USA in the diesel department. I read somewhere that 40% of all passenger vehicles in Europe are Diesel.

The only new car I would buy now is a diesel. The engines last forever and fuel economy is amazing.

[EricW]

FWIW, I appreciate the advice, but I just can't "do" used. I've realized that I'm simply too old and too busy to fix stuff like cars and computers and...pretty much anything else. There just isn't time in my day anymore, literally.

[Jim Norman]

I just bought a new car for my wife. I went through 4 dealers, walked out of one, totally PO'd (What will it take to put you ina new car today? 'tknow, how about you sign ti over to me for 4 years and I'll bring it back then)

I want a couple things when I buy a vehicle:

I want your best cash price, you got one chance.

I want your best 0% financing price, I will determine if it makes sense.

I want the car I want. Please do no try to up sell me or move me to a different model.

Above all, keep that high preasure AH you call a Sales manager or Closer in the closet. He is almost 100% guaranteed to cause me to walk out of your dealership. Oh, and if your salesman quoted me a price, you damn well better honor it. I really don't care how much you made or lost.

Of necessity, I buy about 3-4 vehicles a year, every year. Trucks. I call three dealers with a spec. If I am lucky I get two replies. I can't understand why dealers don't recognize a repeat customer. If i treated my customers like car dealers treat me, I wouldn't need to buy 3 trucks a year to keep my business current. i'd be out of business.

Eric, I feel your pain.

Jim

[EricW]

Jim,

We're on the same page, amigo. Like Israel, I do *not* negotiate.

[scirocco38s]

FWIW, I appreciate the advice, but I just can't "do" used. I've realized that I'm simply too old and too busy to fix stuff like cars and computers and...pretty much anything else. There just isn't time in my day anymore, literally.

I feel your pain, and I have been amused by your pain. You are right cars are a hole you throw money at. Its just they dont give you the satisfaction that shooting and other things do so your expenses on them cant be justified as easily. And your right about car dealers as a rule they are bottom feeders. I have bought 2 new cars in the last 5 years and I go in with a whole different attitude. I go to a lot and find the car I like after hours, the next day I walk up and when the salesman approaches to help, I point at the car and tell him how much I will pay out the door(taxes, tags , everything) then I tell him he has 5 minutes to get the ok to sell it for that, if he comes back with any price different than what I said and put in writing, I tell him or her to kiss off and I go to a new dealership. If they are hungry enough, they deal. I dont talk trade-ins or anything else. If they say they arent making any money on it at the price I quoted thats to bad. I sell my old car to carmax or someother wholesaler and keep everything quick and painless as possible. I dont have time to waste at a dealership and I let them know it up front. If they start playing the game, I walk. If you come back a second time to the same salesman he will remember and will take you seriously then. My last purchase was a 2005VW Jetta GLI. It sat on the lot for 10 months waiting for a soldier who ordered it to come back and the dealer couldnt set on it anylonger. It listed for $28700, I walked in and drove it off the lot in 30 minutes for 21500(taxes,tags, and all other associated cost). The dealser still made 1k off the deal but it was better than sitting on a car that might or might not move. It has 1.8litre engine and 180hp, crusing down the road at 60mph gets me 32mpg, and around town it gets 25. My wife drives it everyday and loves it. I have found the way I deal with them keeps my sanity in check and my blood pressure from rising.

[BSeevers]

I wanted a choice on the poll

5. Getting a prostate exam

[Putty]

We have gone totally Honda and toyota.

I like my Tundra...its paid off.

My 92 civic still gets 42mpg highway, is awesome in snow, can climb my near vertical driveway when its iced and snowed over and doesnt blow oil.

Our new honda accord (from appleway on Sprague....ok buying experience) goes 140 mph plus and is built TIGHT....need i say more?

I may buy the new ridgeline as friends of mine have them and love them...but I sure like that new full sized Tundra....

A friend of mine bought the new Tacoma down in Moscow and had a great experience. Pretty amazing what they put into those trucks with stability control, on demand rear lockers etc. Parker was good to me when I bought the Tundra, now they are pretty terrible to deal with. So its a crapshoot. Dunno about Spokanes dealers, I know their new mayor sux.

[-JQ-]

HEY!! I can't select them all!! I just bought a "new" car and it was everything it could be...and shouldn't be.

When I aksed if they had "life ins" on the loan they actually said they didn't offer that as they didn't want a bunch of little widows coming in crying about paying off the loan...guess what...I'm a 40 YO widower. That almost lost the deal and would if my trade in would have gotten me back home...grin, bear it and drive away fast.

Must include "All the above"!

[hitman]

Looks like you need some help.

Here is how I do it.

Shop the lot when they are closed.

Reserch on line.

When you are ready to test drive what you like walk in and ask for the sales manager, tell him you will deal only with him.

Ready to buy, tell SM you will pay invoice, they will fill it up have it washed & waxed and you expect it to be done by XXX then write a check.

Thats how I got my last one, no BS, no PIA salsemen.

PS: Check out the Honda CRV great ride and you should be able to get at least 250K out of it.

[wide45]

I hate buying a car for all your reasons.

Bit the bullet last year, and got a new Saturn Vue.

Cheapest model had smallish 4 cyl, 5 spd. stick.

Gets high 20's mpg doing everyday driving.

I'd like a little better, but this is not a tiny econobox.

Yes, its a minivan, with delusions of SUVhood, but it's comfortable on a trip, and has plenty of room.

Survived the "shortcut" down the 4 wheeler path thru the maple grove, then back up, and still got us to the match.

Nice CD radio, air, power everything, built in cell phone.

Cost slightly less then I paid new for the 11 year old vehicle it replaced, and that one was cheap.

Naturally, they substantially changed the car design for this model year.

I think one of the reasons cars get poorer milage than they used to is the crappy gas of today, and adding more alcohol will make it worse.

[DonT]

Eric,

Feel your pain. I will never deal with a salesman again. http://newcarslowestprice.com/

[SteveZ]

Eric...go look at a Mini Cooper S. Quick acceleration, great gas milage, go-kart like handling....less than $30K....and best of all...you won't look like every other "honda civic" on the road.

[el pres]

I work in the industry, to be a little more specific highline

European luxury cars. All foriegn companys have whole

line ups of vehicles that wont see the U.S. market. 50-70

mpg diesels, 1.4 ltr turbos, even twin turbo 35mpg V8's diesels,

in the same body vehicles that they sell here (say like a Mercedes

E200 or BMW 314). Infact I think even U.S. manufactures make

similar small engine models of their current line up for export.

Although, these vehicles will never see the U.S. market for two

reasons. Certain states such as California implement really high

standards and tariffs on new production diesel vehicles and since

these states also provide and very large market share of total sales

they just dont bother with the hassle and cost that will be past down

to the consumer. Second is the belief that the U.S. market only wants

horsepower and size, which is mostly true. We keep buying them and

they keep making them , the expensive the car, the more profit they

make.

In my line of cars horsepower has increased 100% in the last ten years.

Tips: Best day to buy a car? Last day of the month, they get desperate to

meet a # of units for the month, or last day of the year... I want this price or

I'm leaving...

They say they are losing money on the deal? No, if they were then you would

not be buying it for that price...

Most importantly, dont buy any additional policies, paint protection, anti theft

gimicks, or anything else from the finance guy after you made your deal. He

works strictly on comission as does everyone else at a dealership and all those

items are just that, gimicks to get some money back from the deal you made up

front. If they say something like, well that was already applied to the car the just

plainly refuse the whole deal. Nothing is yours until you sign the final contract..

Always , at any point in the process you MUST be willing to get up and walk out

or they will get what they want!!

Edited December 31, 2007 by DIRTY CHAMBER

[EricW]

All foriegn companys have whole

line ups of vehicles that wont see the U.S. market. ...

Although, these vehicles will never see the U.S. market for two

reasons. Certain states such as California implement really high

standards and tariffs on new production diesel vehicles

Which just kills me, because the State of Kalibanifornication just got done putting on a 1-hour show on PBS crowing over how smart they are now that they're going to ban carbon emissions from cars. Nothing says intelligence like legislation via a total lack of understanding of chemistry and the laws of thermodynamics.

OK, enough ranting...back to packing...

[shadetree]

Definitly not my Idea of fun.

[JimmyZip]

Dirtychamber has it right! I married into a family that LIKES TO CAR SHOP!!!

They are always trying to one-up eachother on how good a deal they got and now, after eleven years as an in-law, I LOVE CAR SHOPPING!

The computer has made it a kick in the pants! Research the papers and on-line for what all the dealers in several hundred miles radius are willing to sell the car/truck/van/suv you want and then you can get a good idea of where they are willing to go. There are few loss-leaders in the car industry. don't invest yourself emotionally when you get to any dealership. You don't have to be polite! These people are some of the shrewdest scumbags on the planet. Go in well rested and be willing to just walk.

I used to listen to their speil all the time and now I just cut them off and tell them I'm not willing to pay that. And my favorite line is" I don't want to waste your time, like I hope you won't waste mine." That way I don't feel that it's neccesary to stick around and get jerked.

research, be firm, don't invest yourself emotionally, and make it fun. And like Dirty said, last day of the month, heck, Tomorrow wouild be golden op! They get hungry about quotas.

My $1 worth, JimmyZip

[boz1911]

Eric, tell us how you really feel Guess I'm lucky, I have friends at the dealers, and Atlanta has about a zillion dealers. I was able to get over 10k off my Ford Diesel truck last year when I bought it. I plan in keeping it for a looonnnng time. Good Luck!

[dajarrel]

I hate vehicle shopping.

Thanks for the rant. It does the soul good.

dj

[ChrisStock]

ROTFFLMAO........

But...I am not laughing at you. I am laughing with you.. no wait...your not laughing... OK..I'm laughing to keep from crying as I realize I am getting close to that point also...

Excellent rant!

Holy Mcshizzle.... the first post I read this morning after coffee here at work. Merlin said it best I suppose

[North]

Nice rant. +1

[Sestock]

I would have voted for "passing a kidney stone"

I hope that I can get another 100K on my VW